# Killies Import > Planted Tanks >  new lazy setup

## joteo

After enviously studying Kwek Leong's 24" x 20" x 20" tank, I decided to custom order my own.

(I made two tank to be placed on a two-tier rack. The lower one has no substrate and will be used to prepare and grow out plants.)

I considered the 24" x 18" x 18" and also the 24" x 24" x 24".

The 18" wasn't high enough and the 24" would've been too difficult to plant ad maintain for the short-limbed me.

Unfortunately, due to the size of the tank, it's not as easy to maintain as my previous lazy woman tank that's of 24" x 12" x 14".

On paper the tank didn't seem to be that much bigger than the existing. But all those inches add up, as you can see against the old tank.



Any change/modification requires me to clamber up on a chair plus use long tweezers.

It is my first attempt at really thinking the layout through instead of just chucking in plants.

This is what it looked like on first planting last Thursday (the yellow sponge shouldn't be there)



But already I'm starting to chuck in plants. I can't resist!

It is just a week older and already I've added some Tiger Lillies and some echinodorus with red markings at the back to add some red to the tank.

The vals at the back need to grow in before they can be seen.

I'm not sure about the moss sheets in the front and there's a part of me that thinks the front is actually pretty nice just bare.

I'm not sure just how long these plants will last since the base is only gravel and no fertilizer and there's no CO2. I also don't use lights as this tank is next to 4 large windows.

Since it is a new setup, however, I put in some sticks of fertilizer near the echinodorus and vals.

I'm still wavering on the CO2 as I've invested so much in the plants, it would be a waste if they die on me.

But I hate to have algae problems and I've managed so far to keep the algae at bay after a few initial problems in my old tank by controlling the window blinds.

Okay, layout and plants:

Left hand (LH) side and LH back corner vals, echinodorus, tiger lilly
Back Java fern
Right hand (RH) side back narrow leaf java fern in gravel (needs to grow) plus tiger lilly
LH side between echinodorus and driftwood, java fern (narrow and Windelov) on small driftwood pieces. Some crypts and a red lilly stuffed between and planted in gravel
On the two large pieces of driftwood anubias nana 'petite', anubias barteri 'variegated', goldern anubias
In front of the two large driftwood, crypt in gravel, some anubias on a small piece of driftwood, anubias 'petite' and golden anubias on another small piece of driftwood
RH mid/back that crinkly leaf thing and some lily

So, what do you think of my second attempt?

thanks
joanne

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## |squee|

Looks like a nice mound scape coming through! I agree with you, leave the foreground bare. 

They won't die on you without CO2, it's the lack of fertiliser/other factors that cause it. I maintain a non-CO2ed tank full of anubias plants by no water changes(only water top-ups weekly) and weekly light fertilisation. Light is ambient lighting from my 60cm tank next to it.

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## FC

Joanne,

May I suggest that you:
1) mount a fan (get the Jebo 3" DC fan at $10~11, I think it is much quieter than the 4" AC fan) to keep it cool. Mount it at the back of the tank.
2) it is nice to have bare front, I have some cosmetic sands lying around, you can have a bag if you fancy.
3) I have no experience with non-CO2 tank but if I were you, I will go for it. Keep it simple if it (can) works.
4) stick the oyama sticker on the background, it helps to camouflage equipment/walls/etc behind it. Choose plain colour.
5) top up the water as high as practical, something like 0.5~1" from the top. It will look much better. Having low water line give one the impression of half-done/lack-spirit tank.
6) move the internal filter higher, about 5~6" from the top. For such setup, I would prefer hang filter. It looks great and neat when you hang behind the tank. Besides, it is a very cheap (less than $20), cooler and efficient filter.

As you see, I am more of an equipment guy than anything else. I like equipment and I also very particular on how I place/setup them. I am also a minimalist where I use/deploy only the essentials.

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## timebomb

Joanne,

First off, you need lights. The plants can survive on sunlight alone but you still need lights because you want to look at your tank after the sun has set  :Laughing: 

Don't put the driftwood right smack in the middle. Move it to one side, towards the back of the tank and group your tall plants around it. Trust me, it will look better. You can either leave your foreground bare or fill it up with sheets of moss. I would say go for the latter. 

As for CO2, if price is a concern, I would suggest you DIY your own. It's far cheaper but one helluva lot more troublesome. It would involve mixing a new yeast solution every week or so.

Since you have already added the gravel and water, it's too late to Oyama-paper the back of the tank as what Freddy suggested. It isn't a big deal anyway. When the Vals take off, they should form a nice Val wall for you. But it will also send runners all over the tank. To keep them under control, use a piece of acrylic as a divider. 

Overall, nice tank. I'm sure things will work out fine for you. 

Loh K L

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## joteo

Thank you for your comments.

Terence:
I think you're right. I might just stick to cheap and simple for now. It's very tempting as you read and enjoy other peoples' aquatic gardening work to hanker after the luscious and quick greenery that one can get from CO2.

Freddy:
I wanted a higher water level, but am not sure my 1" thick stand can take it. The fish tank maker says it's okay. But I'm not certain. Is it okay if the water level goes all the way up to the brace?

Actually, I have a canister filter and fan, but it is all in the old tank. They will be transfered to this new tank when the water cycling is complete. My fan is very big, made of metal and is very noisy.

I thought that adding about 25% of old water from the old tank would quicken the cycling. But my driftwood now all have this fuzzy white algae/fungus that I think indicates the water isn't ready yet. I notice that this fuzzy white fungus disappears after everything calms down. I don't even have to do anything but it goes away.

Right now, the tank is too near the wall for me to put anything behind it.

May I know why you suggest putting the internal filter higher? Is it just to avoid unsightly wires? I find a lot of dirt gets stuck at the bottom of the tank, and I was intending to put this filter in addition to the canister filter, at this level.

Kwek Leong:

I did add an acrylic divider that I read in some other post you did with your tank. It curves from the front RH corner to the opposite LH corner in the back.

I understand what you mean about the driftwood. But that's as far as I can move it! (see picture of side view below) I think my driftwood is too big for my tank. Do I need to make a bigger one? :P

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## FC

> 1) I wanted a higher water level, but am not sure my 1" thick stand can take it.
> 2) My fan is very big, made of metal and is very noisy.
> 3) I notice that this fuzzy white fungus disappears after everything calms down.
> 4) Right now, the tank is too near the wall for me to put anything behind it.
> 5) I find a lot of dirt gets stuck at the bottom of the tank.


1) The stand should be strong enough, fill th tank with water till it reach the bracings.
2) Save your ears, get the quieter fan at $10~11.
3) Change the water 100% to remove residual fungus desolved in the water.
4) Use a board and paste it with coloured paper (black, blue or white) and double-side tape it behind the tank.
5) That's a good sign actually. To maintain clear water, you need to allow the waste to settle down onto the ground. The filter outlet should be above the mid water level to acheive this. Forget about getting the filter to suck the waste from the ground, it's not practically possible. Important is to have a filter with flow rate that cycle the water 2 times an hour, for your tank with about 150L, the flow rate should be about 300L/hr. Get one with the largest media volume. Try the overhang filter.

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## joteo

> 3) Change the water 100% to remove residual fungus desolved in the water.


Should I do that now or later?




> 5) That's a good sign actually. To maintain clear water, you need to allow the waste to settle down onto the ground. The filter outlet should be above the mid water level to acheive this. Forget about getting the filter to suck the waste from the ground, it's not practically possible. Important is to have a filter with flow rate that cycle the water 2 times an hour, for your tank with about 150L, the flow rate should be about 300L/hr. Get one with the largest media volume. Try the overhang filter.


Are you saying that I should use an overhang filter instead of a canister filter? I have an Eheim 2213 with 440l/hr but I find it rather slow.

Thanks
joanne

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## wks

Hi joanne, I like that driftwood, beautiful piece. It reminds me of a ship's anchor. Try planting as densely as possible with some fast growing plants like _Hygrophila difformis_, otherwise algae will start blooming soon. As an additional precaution, get some hornwort (_Ceratophyllum demersum_) or floating plants.

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## FC

> Should I do that now or later?
> 
> Are you saying that I should use an overhang filter instead of a canister filter? I have an Eheim 2213 with 440l/hr but I find it rather slow.


Change now.

Since you have the canister, use it. The 440L/hr is a pump rated flow, the actual flow will be reduced to about 300~350L/hr after the losses through media, hoses, etc. It is ideal for your tank. Connect a skimmer to the inlet to keep the water surface clean/clear. Till your tank is successful, you may consider invest in hangon filter (advantage: it does not have unsightly hose and canister). Example:

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## joteo

> Hi joanne, I like that driftwood, beautiful piece. It reminds me of a ship's anchor. Try planting as densely as possible with some fast growing plants like _Hygrophila difformis_, otherwise algae will start blooming soon. As an additional precaution, get some hornwort (_Ceratophyllum demersum_) or floating plants.


Jason,

It's actually two pieces of driftwood. The one standing vertically will not stay up on it's own and needs some support.

I put in some hornwort already, thanks.

joanne

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## joteo

Hi Freddy,

Since you are a hardware/equipment kind of guy, you might know.

I do not have space behind the tank. It is flush against the wall.

The only place, therefore for a hangon filter, is on the side.

I have a brace on the sides of the tank.

I've looked at many hang on filters before. They all don't seem to be able to accomodate tanks with bracing.

Have you seen otherwise?

joanne

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## wks

Hi joanne, don't mind me throwing in my 2 cents worth again. 
If your intend fish load is light, you may want to consider using an Eden 501 canister filter. Unfortunately it can't hang on to the tank, you may need to buy a small basket with a hook from shops selling household goods. 
What I do is to squeeze the basket between the wall and the tank so I can house the small canister filter easily.

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## RonWill

> They all don't seem to be able to accomodate tanks with bracing


 Joanne,
Tank panel thickness and top bracings vary with makers. For others to render help, you'd need to be more specific. What is the total clearance that will allow a hang-on? Have you looked at Eheim's Liberty series?




> Unfortunately it can't hang on to the tank, you may need to buy a small basket with a hook...


 Jason, the brackets for hangon mounting is available as an option for the 501. For those, where esthetics is a priority, it will be much neater.

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## |squee|

> Terence:
> I think you're right. I might just stick to cheap and simple for now. It's very tempting as you read and enjoy other peoples' aquatic gardening work to hanker after the luscious and quick greenery that one can get from CO2.


  :Laughing:  If you plant thickly for this tank and all goes well, frankly I find non-CO2 tanks much more serene and enjoyable than CO2-enriched tanks.

Some random tips off my head:
1) I find moss in non-CO2 tanks tend to collect dirt and brown algae.
2) A couple of Yamato shrimps will be great, as well as Otocinclus.
3) Clear up dead bodies from fauna fast: my oto died in my similar-to-yours non-CO2 tank and I didn't notice. The following week I had brown algae en masse, with the walls all covered with green/brown algae and the tank stunk of blue green algae.

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## FC

> I've looked at many hang on filters before. They all don't seem to be able to accomodate tanks with bracing.


Joanne,
You are right. However, your tank's bracing is quite slim/narrow, you may have some luck with some hang on. In worse case, turn the tank 90 degree.

Eden 501 is an interesting new compact canister filter. See pic.


Like what Jason mentioned, with its' compactness, you may be able to find a neat way to hang it. I cannot remember the price but it is very competitively priced.

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