# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Cichlids >  Sexing Electric Blue Ram ?

## Stitch

Hi, need help in sexing Electric blue ram (EBR).

Does all male EBRs have a longer 2nd dorsal front fin? If there isn't, means it is a female? So far, what I have observed in one or two LFS I visited recently, most of the EBRs do not have a longer 2nd dorsal fin leh? So really confused.

Cannot identify from the red belly for the female, what else can I reference to determine the sex of the EBR?

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## edw7636

Finding from the internet.

*Common name:* German Blue Ram

*Scientific name:* _Microgeophagus ramirezi_

*Family:* Cichlidae

*Origin:* Venezuela

*Maximum size:* 3 inches

*Temperature:* 80 degrees

*Minimum Tank Size:* 10 gallons

*Care:* This fish is very sensitive to water quality. As long as you keep the water soft and the temperature stable, these are an easy fish to care for. A "community" cichlid that does well with fish such as tetras, gourami, danios, and catfish. Rams also enjoy planted tanks, with smooth rocks for spawning.

*Feeding:* Doesn't readily accept flakes but with a little coaxing you can get them to accept them. They enjoy bloodworms, brine, daphnia, and other live foods.

*Sexing:* Females have a pink belly and are wider in the stomach. The dorsal rays are also shorter. Males have longer black dorsal rays and a more of a yellow tint to their chest. Males are sometimes larger than females.

*Breeding:* Spawn on rocks and leaves. Males and females will clean and prepare the surface before spawning. Spawns usually yeilds between 25-50 eggs. Very caring parents that do not eat their fry. You can observe them "fanning" their eggs with their fins. They are very impressive parents. Eggs hatch in 24-48 hours after spawning and mother and father continue to care for the fry until they are able to eat on their own.

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## Jhontan

> Hi, need help in sexing Electric blue ram (EBR).
> 
> Does all male EBRs have a longer 2nd dorsal front fin? If there isn't, means it is a female? So far, what I have observed in one or two LFS I visited recently, most of the EBRs do not have a longer 2nd dorsal fin leh? So really confused.
> 
> Cannot identify from the red belly for the female, what else can I reference to determine the sex of the EBR?


Hi,

Let me share with you my 3 cents worth info.

Kept German Ram for some time till the confirmed pair hatched several times. Unfortunately they all died. 

The female has a distinct pink color in its abdomen. The male I had looked like female as it was plump in size while the female which was slim turned out to be a female. Therefore, I based on the color of its abdomen.

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## Stitch

Currently my 2 electric blue ram do not show the pink abdomen. Perhaps still young?
I dont know. I tried to get one which looks plumper and one more slender hopefully one is female and the other is male.

I cannot identify from the dorsal fins too. Both look the same. Maybe like I said, perhaps they are still young. Will see how.
Even if they are not a pair, it doesnt matter too, they dont fight that much (only occassional pushing).
So I guess, either they are 2 females or a couple, therefore less aggressive ???

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## Stitch

From this video, it seems that it is not necessary for the female electric blue ram to have a pink abdomen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLbMc6HH_xM

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## Jhontan

Hi Bro,

Pinkish abdomen is one sign that tells whether it is a female fish. Conventionally we always think that a female fish is round in size and male is "rectangle" in size but in ram case, it is totally different.
Male ram, in my experience, is round and robust whereas female is long and tender. Good luck, bro.

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## stormhawk

There's no way to positively identify the EBR sexes just from the fins alone. Some females may have a longer 2nd dorsal fin ray too. You'd have to buy several and hope for a pair to form out of the bunch.

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## Jhontan

> There's no way to positively identify the EBR sexes just from the fins alone. Some females may have a longer 2nd dorsal fin ray too. You'd have to buy several and hope for a pair to form out of the bunch.


Yes, this is another method of pairing the rams.

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## Stitch

Thanks for the input. One of my ram is starting to develop a longer 2nd dorsal fins. He/She which was once being bullied and is now a bully. Esp aggressive during meal time. Will chase the other one (which was previously more fierce) till it has no where to hide.

The one being chased I noticed does not have a higher fin and the colour pale in comparison. So female?

Putting more in the tank may not be ideal in my tank as mine is just a small tank. Thus, I thought it may not be safe for a pair to spawn and fry to survive if there are too many in the tank.

Hmm ... See how it develops as they grow bigger.

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## Jhontan

> Thanks for the input. One of my ram is starting to develop a longer 2nd dorsal fins. He/She which was once being bullied and is now a bully. Esp aggressive during meal time. Will chase the other one (which was previously more fierce) till it has no where to hide.
> 
> The one being chased I noticed does not have a higher fin and the colour pale in comparison. So female?
> 
> Putting more in the tank may not be ideal in my tank as mine is just a small tank. Thus, I thought it may not be safe for a pair to spawn and fry to survive if there are too many in the tank.
> 
> Hmm ... See how it develops as they grow bigger.


In my opinion based on my experience, the female is long and has a pinkish abdomen whereas the male is round and robust. They had several spawn and turned into fries. The challenge I have had is to turn them to adult fish which I failed to do so.

Good luck.

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## PKB

> In my opinion based on my experience, the female is long and has a pinkish abdomen whereas the male is round and robust. They had several spawn and turned into fries. The challenge I have had is to turn them to adult fish which I failed to do so.
> 
> Good luck.


I have one "Commando" fry. All his sibing die within 2 - 3 days after they hatch. And I am left with one 1 fry. Fetch it with BBS. When the llttle fella is about 1cm long, I threw him into my main tank, a 4ft planted with his daddy, mummy and other rams, and tetra. Now he has out grown his own mummy and is chasing her around the tank. Poor mummy ram, haha...  :Confused:

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## Jhontan

> I have one "Commando" fry. All his sibing die within 2 - 3 days after they hatch. And I am left with one 1 fry. Fetch it with BBS. When the llttle fella is about 1cm long, I threw him into my main tank, a 4ft planted with his daddy, mummy and other rams, and tetra. Now he has out grown his own mummy and is chasing her around the tank. Poor mummy ram, haha...


 
Indeed yours is a SOF trained. I did have one SOF but it became my shrimps' snack. THe outcome was that I gave up keeing ram and now turn to common krib. They have all become adults but no spawn from them.

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## freyster

> Male ram, in my experience, is round and robust whereas female is long and tender.


I tried this method and failed before.. end up one of them killed.

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## Stitch

Just bought this balloon. Is this a male or a female? (Sorry poor pic quality)
ElectricBlueRam_1.jpgElectricBlueRam_2.jpgElectricBlueRam_3.jpg

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## stormhawk

Should be female I think, though I'm 70% sure it is.

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## Jhontan

Hi Stitch,

By looking at the middle pic of yours and compared to mine, the left one looks like a male to me whereas the right one looks like a female. The other pics which I looked at look like a male to me which it is robust.

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## stormhawk

One fish is a normal EBR, the other a Balloon EBR. You cannot compare "robustness" between the 2 forms, since one is shorter, hence much stouter in body form.

I'm fairly certain the Balloon pictured is a female, because the tips of the pelvic fins are slightly rounded and the fins are short, which are normally much longer and pointed, even in male Balloons of any form. However, the Balloon EBR in the photos can be a young male. Only time will tell if it is truly a female.

Stitch, are you trying to breed this Balloon EBR with the normal EBR in the photo?

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## stormhawk

These photos will be much more helpful in sexing them:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5555692839 <-- typical male Balloon EBR (some may have shorter dorsal rays if not dominant male)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5555692835 <-- typical female Balloon EBR (usually pelvic fins are rounded but sometimes pointed in this case)

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## Stitch

Thanks Stormhawk,

Thanks for the infomation and the pictures. Very nice images you got there.
No, I am not trying to breed the Rams. I just got the balloon because the normal EBR (which I am pretty sure is a male) is very aggressive and keeps pecking and nipping at the fin of my other balloon EBR (I have 2 existingly, 1 normal & 1 balloon). So much so that the tail and fin is frayed. So I got this new balloon, which I saw was very agressive in the LFS tank hoping to curb the aggressiveness of my male normal EBR. But I guessed because it is a new tenant, so it got bullied also. But, this gave the old tenant balloon EBR a breathing space. No more harassment for a moment.

No choice, in the end the agressive normal EBR has to be trapped for now until the new tenant establishes its territory. Surprising the 2 balloons have no issue with each other in the tank. 

These fish have very interesting characteristics to observe I must say.

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## stormhawk

Not my images however, just pics I found while trawling the web.

You made a good choice in trapping the dominant EBR. If you didn't do this the weaker one may not be able to eat.

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## Aarzoo

Hi i know this is old but which lfs have ebbr been to both lfs at clementi no ebr there just normal ebr, tia.

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## stormhawk

I last saw the balloon EBR at Hong Yang Aquarium at CCK Central. Not sure if it's still in stock. You can Google for their contact info and call them to ask for availability.

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## Aarzoo

Thanks bro will check them out  :Wink: 

Sent from my GT-P3100 using Tapatalk HD

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