# Planted Tanks > Aquascaping >  Newbie DSM attempt for Iwagumi

## FaRnieGuy

First attempt on DSM using HC. Want to keep things simple so i tried to do Iwagumi.

My tank is a Gex Glassterior Slim 600.

found some left over ADA Amazonia from many many many years ago  :Grin:  and also some JBJ base fert  :Surprised: 
and here it goes...

poured the left over ADA Amazonia as the base, added JBJ Base fert and also placed my rocks in.

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Went to Seaview and bought this Azoo substrate recommended by their staff.

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then i started spraying dechlorinated water to wet the substrates before i start planting.

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## FaRnieGuy

back aching hobby 

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it was after i finished planting all my HC then i realised i forgot my slope at the back.  :Exasperated:  :Exasperated:  :Exasperated: 

Day 3 (13 November 2014)

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Day 9 (19 November 2014)

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Day 10 (20 November 2014)

HC growing soooooo slowly. decided to get some root tabs to hopefully help the HC to root nicely.

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## FaRnieGuy

Day 15 (25 November 2014)

was happy to see some of the roots crawling down.  :Grin: 

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Day 23 (2 December 2014)

HC spreading bit by bit.. some turning yellowish but i'm happy to see new leaves coming out.

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## FaRnieGuy

Tank: Gex Glassterior Slim 600
Lighting: Beamswork LED 400
Photo Period: 20 Hours (Lighting not strong so i extended the photo period, hope it helps)
Misting: misting is done only before, during and after photo period.
Room temperature: Day 29 deg celsius max, Night about 24-26 deg celsius(because of aircon) 

i covered the front and back of the tank with blue mat, i did cover the sides also. so that all the light will "concentrate" in the tank? haha. 
another reason is because the tank is in my room, i can't sleep with the light on.

planning to flood the tank before Chinese New Year 2015. hope the HC can carpet nicely and not die on me.
might be getting CO2 for the tank, don't want to see HC melt after i flood the tank. that'll be months of effort wasted.

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## Urban Aquaria

Looks good, at this rate you could probably flood the tank in another 2-3 weeks time. Great timing.  :Very Happy:

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## FaRnieGuy

> Looks good, at this rate you could probably flood the tank in another 2-3 weeks time. Great timing.


 :Very Happy:  I'm really afraid of flooding the tank. Read about too many cases of HC dying after flooding. :eek:

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## kurty

> I'm really afraid of flooding the tank. Read about too many cases of HC dying after flooding. :eek:


yeah, i'm one of them..

i planted 2ft of hc via DSM..
after flooding, they melt or died..
despite i'm using co2, good light, ada soil, root tabs..

well, maybe mc is more suitable for me. 

good luck to you, mate

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## Urban Aquaria

> I'm really afraid of flooding the tank. Read about too many cases of HC dying after flooding. :eek:


If your HC carpet is well established with good strong root structure during DSM, the melting after flooding will usually be minimal (it'll mainly be the older leaves that melt)... just don't flood the tank too early before the HC has time to establish properly or they will all tend to melt.

Co2 injection after flooding will definitely help in the transition process.

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## limz_777

didnt know azoo have aquasoil , how much it cost for a bag ? 9 litre ?

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## FaRnieGuy

> yeah, i'm one of them..
> 
> i planted 2ft of hc via DSM..
> after flooding, they melt or died..
> despite i'm using co2, good light, ada soil, root tabs..
> 
> well, maybe mc is more suitable for me. 
> 
> good luck to you, mate


Thanks bro. I hope everything will be ok for my tank. :thumbup:

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## FaRnieGuy

> If your HC carpet is well established with good strong root structure during DSM, the melting after flooding will usually be minimal (it'll mainly be the older leaves that melt)... just don't flood the tank too early before the HC has time to establish properly or they will all tend to melt.
> 
> Co2 injection after flooding will definitely help in the transition process.


I'll be very patient with this DSM. Let the roots establish properly. *fingers crossed*

I've never use CO2 before, how many bps is good for the transition taking note that my lighting is Beamswork LED 400 which is only around 78 x 0.06W = 4.68W ?

Thinking to get those disposable CO2 set, not sure whether it's enough because I'm planning to inject CO2 only during transition.
Or is it a must to continue injecting CO2 to keep the tank running? 

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## FaRnieGuy

> didnt know azoo have aquasoil , how much it cost for a bag ? 9 litre ?


Hi, the Azoo substrates that I got was 5.4kg pack, written on the bag that it's for 40L aquarium. Cost about 3 red notes after discount. :thumbup:

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## kurty

> I'll be very patient with this DSM. Let the roots establish properly. *fingers crossed*
> 
> I've never use CO2 before, how many bpm is good for the transition taking note that my lighting is Beamswork LED 400 which is only around 78 x 0.06W = 4.68W ?
> 
> Thinking to get those disposable CO2 set, not sure whether it's enough because I'm planning to inject CO2 only during transition.
> Or is it a must to continue injecting CO2 to keep the tank running? 
> 
> Sent from my GT-N7105 using Xparent BlueTapatalk 2



i think the plant fairy will answered you like this:

the light is weak, go for something better as it will serve you well in the long run.
instead of disposable co2 set, why dont you get an used co2 cylinder with solenoid etc?
the price range from $50-$100.
while you can fixed a timer to control the operating time.
When light is on, co2 is present = photosynthesis.

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## FaRnieGuy

> i think the plant fairy will answered you like this:
> 
> the light is weak, go for something better as it will serve you well in the long run.
> instead of disposable co2 set, why dont you get an used co2 cylinder with solenoid etc?
> the price range from $50-$100.
> while you can fixed a timer to control the operating time.
> When light is on, co2 is present = photosynthesis.


Reason why I wanted to get a disposable set was because I'm thinking to inject CO2 only during transition phase. Might want to stop CO2 if I can. 


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## Urban Aquaria

> I'll be very patient with this DSM. Let the roots establish properly. *fingers crossed*
> 
> I've never use CO2 before, how many bps is good for the transition taking note that my lighting is Beamswork LED 400 which is only around 78 x 0.06W = 4.68W ?
> 
> Thinking to get those disposable CO2 set, not sure whether it's enough because I'm planning to inject CO2 only during transition.
> Or is it a must to continue injecting CO2 to keep the tank running?


Based on number of LEDs and wattage, your current light may be okay for DSM stage (no water so no light barriers), but may not be enough to sustain growth after the tank is flooded due to the greater reduction of light intensity through the water layer.

If you find the HC growth slowing down a lot after flooding, then you may need to consider upgrading to higher intensity lights, especially in conjunction with Co2 injection.

As for BPS injection rate, it depends on the Co2 equipment used and their diffusion efficiency, just start from 1 BPS and then monitor and adjust from there. Use a drop checker to gauge the Co2 levels, as long as it's shows green color means there should be sufficient Co2 levels in the tank to support the plant growth. Some people are kiasu and inject more Co2 until the drop checker shows yellow color, but it's not really necessary and just uses up Co2 gas.  :Smile: 

It's possible to just inject Co2 during the post-flooded transition period, but once you stop Co2 injection the HC growth will also slow down greatly... what usually happens is the new growth can't grow fast enough to replace the old growth (their leaves have a limited lifespan, they don't last forever), so the older layers will gradually melt away and the carpet wouldn't be as lush as before.

Hence it's best if you can try to get a proper Co2 tank set with solenoid regulator so that you can maintain consistent and healthy growth for the HC... it's cheaper on the long run and much less hassle to use (it can operate automatically on its own once you program the injection timings).

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## FaRnieGuy

> Based on number of LEDs and wattage, your current light may be okay for DSM stage (no water so no light barriers), but may not be enough to sustain growth after the tank is flooded due to the greater reduction of light intensity through the water layer.
> 
> If you find the HC growth slowing down a lot after flooding, then you may need to consider upgrading to higher intensity lights, especially in conjunction with Co2 injection.
> 
> As for BPS injection rate, it depends on the Co2 equipment used and their diffusion efficiency, just start from 1 BPS and then monitor and adjust from there. Use a drop checker to gauge the Co2 levels, as long as it's shows green color means there should be sufficient Co2 levels in the tank to support the plant growth. Some people are kiasu and inject more Co2 until the drop checker shows yellow color, but it's not really necessary and just uses up Co2 gas. 
> 
> It's possible to just inject Co2 during the post-flooded transition period, but once you stop Co2 injection the HC growth will also slow down greatly... what usually happens is the new growth can't grow fast enough to replace the old growth (their leaves have a limited lifespan, they don't last forever), so the older layers will gradually melt away and the carpet wouldn't be as lush as before.
> 
> Hence it's best if you can try to get a proper Co2 tank set with solenoid regulator so that you can maintain consistent and healthy growth for the HC... it's cheaper on the long run and much less hassle to use (it can operate automatically on its own once you program the injection timings).


Ok. Noted with thanks!
Will probably get a proper set of CO2 then. 

Shall wait and see whether I'll need to upgrade my lighting because my tank is only about 25cm in height.


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## babiwangi

Try use seacham excel carbon. It works for me without co2 tank for now

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## FaRnieGuy

> Try use seacham excel carbon. It works for me without co2 tank for now


Hmmm.. that's something good to try on my 1ft tank. Planning to plant E.tennullus as foreground on sudo sand with root tabs.
 :Cool: 

Thanks!

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## AQMS

I recommend a second hand co2 injection rather than excel,you save a lot in a long run and you can 
sell the cylinder in the market place if you did not want to continue in the hobby.I have a few 2litre 
cylinders fully load from bioplast lying around if you are looking for one.

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## FaRnieGuy

> I recommend a second hand co2 injection rather than excel,you save a lot in a long run and you can 
> sell the cylinder in the market place if you did not want to continue in the hobby.I have a few 2litre 
> cylinders fully load from bioplast lying around if you are looking for one.


Thanks bro, I'll be getting a proper set of CO2 for this main tank but not now.. My room no space to put already. Waiting for my brother to clear his stuffs from my room. Haha.

Meanwhile playing with another 1ft tank. Well, hand itchy while waiting for DSM. hehehe.. Will try Seachem excel in this tank. Hope it helps.


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## babiwangi

Oh bro this is my exp.. i also very new with this. So initially i use sc excel and the plant was goo. About 1 week my water shown some green algae abit and water not so clear. So i change 50%water and just let it while dosing excel every morning, water still the same. Then i decided to buy seacham flourish (fert) and dose it into the tank. Then in 3 days without I realise the water soo clear and bright..just dose the fert once a week based in the direction to use. Btw my tank is 2ft tank with at least 30 small fishes

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## FaRnieGuy

> Oh bro this is my exp.. i also very new with this. So initially i use sc excel and the plant was goo. About 1 week my water shown some green algae abit and water not so clear. So i change 50%water and just let it while dosing excel every morning, water still the same. Then i decided to buy seacham flourish (fert) and dose it into the tank. Then in 3 days without I realise the water soo clear and bright..just dose the fert once a week based in the direction to use. Btw my tank is 2ft tank with at least 30 small fishes


Thanks for sharing bro.. :thumbup:

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## FaRnieGuy

updates updates  :Grin: 

Day 30 (9 December 2014)



 :Blah:  Crawl baby crawl.. climb climb.. SPREAD~!



things are looking pretty good so far. let's just hope that it will spread more and carpet the front fast.
the front of the tank still looked rather "botak".  :Sad:

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## FaRnieGuy

hmm.. how come the photos became so big?  :Shocked:

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## FaRnieGuy

Updates  :Very Happy: 
Day 37 (16 december 2014)

Carpeting nicely.. slowly but surely..  :Cool: 



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## FaRnieGuy

Updates again.. 

Day 44 (23 December 2014)

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ps7iq5jzyy.jpg

Should be flooding it soon..

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## azman_haron

[QUOTE=FaRnieGuy;802208]Updates again.. 

Day 44 (23 December 2014)

Should be flooding it soon..

44 days!!! How do you resist the temptation????

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## FaRnieGuy

Haha... actually I'm just afraid of flooding it.. the transition phase is scary.. read about too many failed attempts.. :eek:

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## Urban Aquaria

After flooding, if you have Co2 injection, pump in more to ease the plants transition process, since there'll be no livestock during this period you don't need to worry about the higher Co2 levels. 

If no Co2 injection, then consider adding liquid carbon (ie. Seachem Excel) to help maintain the HC growth. Moderate light photoperiod to a 6-8 hour schedule to slow down algae issues.

Test the water parameters and if there is still alot of ammonia in the water, do more frequent water changes to flush out the excess nutrients (even with a carpet of HC, its still considered relatively "low" density as there are no other fast growing plants to soak up excess nutrients, this a common challenge with single-plant iwagumi scapes). Also dose potassium and micro/trace nutrients to support continued growth of the HC, as those nutrients tend to be depleted first and deficiencies will appear quickly.

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## FaRnieGuy

> After flooding, if you have Co2 injection, pump in more to ease the plants transition process, since there'll be no livestock during this period you don't need to worry about the higher Co2 levels. 
> 
> If no Co2 injection, then consider adding liquid carbon (ie. Seachem Excel) to help maintain the HC growth. Moderate light photoperiod to a 6-8 hour schedule to slow down algae issues.
> 
> Test the water parameters and if there is still alot of ammonia in the water, do more frequent water changes to flush out the excess nutrients (even with a carpet of HC, its still considered relatively "low" density as there are no other fast growing plants to soak up excess nutrients, this a common challenge with single-plant iwagumi scapes). Also dose potassium and micro/trace nutrients to support continued growth of the HC, as those nutrients tend to be depleted first and deficiencies will appear quickly.


Noted with thanks!!! 
I'll probably use Seachem Excel unless I can find a decent set of co2 from marketplace..  :Roll Eyes: 


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## FaRnieGuy

Day 51 (30 December 2014)



Got my co2 last night from a nice bro..
Hand itchy.. Can't wait.. So I decided to flood today..

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...pskvoq17v6.jpg

Happy to see pearling.. Don't ask me about water parameters.. I forgot to buy test kit! 



Co2 at 3 bps
Dosed 3ml of Seachem Excel & 1ml Seachem Flourish..


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## FaRnieGuy

More pearling..

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419950745.263785.jpg

I'm a happy man!


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## Urban Aquaria

Nice!  :Well done:

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## qwert9277

Looks awesome  :Smile:

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## FaRnieGuy

> Nice!


 :Wink:  thank you!

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## FaRnieGuy

> Looks awesome


 :Wink:  thank you!

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## FaRnieGuy

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1419962486.981671.jpg

I'm in love with my tank.. Lol
Been staring for hours..
Pearls pearls pearls.. 


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## Ingen

Very nice, is that all from one tub of monte carlo?

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## FaRnieGuy

> Very nice, is that all from one tub of monte carlo?


It's actually from 4 packets of HC.. not monte carlo..  :Very Happy: 

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## Ingen

Oh, I thought was MC haha.

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## FaRnieGuy

Is it possible to get 0 ammonia 0 nitrate 0 nitrite and ph about 6.5?
Weird.. What should I do?
Haha 3rd day after flooding.. Did a 50% water change yesterday though..


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## Urban Aquaria

> Is it possible to get 0 ammonia 0 nitrate 0 nitrite and ph about 6.5?
> Weird.. What should I do?
> Haha 3rd day after flooding.. Did a 50% water change yesterday though..


I've also noticed that effect in my DSM setups after they were flooded too... i'm guessing the many weeks of faster plant growth during DSM soaks up most of the nutrients, so there are probably much less nutrients getting released into the water column after its flooded.

I noticed your substrate is also mixed in with Azoo soil substrate, not sure of its overall nutrient content compared to if it was filled with 100% ADA Amazonia aquasoil though, so that might affect the parameters too.

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## FaRnieGuy

> I've also noticed that effect in my DSM setups after they were flooded too... i'm guessing the many weeks of faster plant growth during DSM soaks up most of the nutrients, so there are probably much less nutrients getting released into the water column after its flooded.
> 
> I noticed your substrate is also mixed in with Azoo soil substrate, not sure of its overall nutrient content compared to if it was filled with 100% ADA Amazonia aquasoil though, so that might affect the parameters too.


Really don't know what should I do now.. 
Added 4 tiger barbs and 8 Yamato.. Hope can have some poo poo to help..


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## Urban Aquaria

> Really don't know what should I do now.. 
> Added 4 tiger barbs and 8 Yamato.. Hope can have some poo poo to help..
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I guess you'll just have to monitor the ammonia and nitrate levels over the next few days and weeks... if your filter is new, then it could also be due to the tank still cycling, but the ammonia level is probably low enough to be processed or taken up by the plants quickly so the levels are not detectable at the moment. 

Though since you have Co2 injection, it may be a better idea to dose fertilizers to support and maintain healthy plant growth, it'll help to avoid nutrient deficiencies and minimize melting.

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## FaRnieGuy

> I guess you'll just have to monitor the ammonia and nitrate levels over the next few days and weeks... if your filter is new, then it could also be due to the tank still cycling, but the ammonia level is probably low enough to be processed or taken up by the plants quickly so the levels are not detectable at the moment. 
> 
> Though since you have Co2 injection, it may be a better idea to dose fertilizers to support and maintain healthy plant growth, it'll help to avoid nutrient deficiencies and minimize melting.


Noted.. 
I only have Seachem Fluorish which I dosed every alternate days for now.. Hope it helps.. Don't wish to see them melt.. 


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## FaRnieGuy

One question..
How often do we change the solution in the co2 drop checker?


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## FaRnieGuy

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1420255915.551801.jpg

Day 5, I'm still getting these results...


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## Urban Aquaria

> One question..
> How often do we change the solution in the co2 drop checker?


The Co2 test kits usually recommend to change the solution once every few weeks, but i change mine every few months or if the amount becomes low due to evaporation, it still works fine.




> ImageUploadedByTapatalk1420255915.551801.jpg
> 
> Day 5, I'm still getting these results...


Looks like it's a good time to dose some macro ferts to supplement the nutrient content in the tank. 

Note that the test kits measure the nutrient levels in the water column, but there may still be ample nutrients inside the substrate (not released into the water column) that can be accessed by the plant roots, so they may still be able to get sufficient nutrients to continue growing well at the moment. 

Btw, do make sure you are mixing the test reagents well to get consistent measurement results.

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## FaRnieGuy

> The Co2 test kits usually recommend to change the solution once every few weeks, but i change mine every few months or if the amount becomes low due to evaporation, it still works fine.
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like it's a good time to dose some macro ferts to supplement the nutrient content in the tank. 
> 
> Note that the test kits measure the nutrient levels in the water column, but there may still be ample nutrients inside the substrate (not released into the water column) that can be accessed by the plant roots, so they may still be able to get sufficient nutrients to continue growing well at the moment. 
> 
> Btw, do make sure you are mixing the test reagents well to get consistent measurement results.


Ok! Noted on the co2 drop checker!

What kind of macro ferts? 


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## Urban Aquaria

> What kind of macro ferts?


If you find that the nitrate levels are staying low, can look at dosing specific nitrogen (N) fertilizer... or those all-in-one fertilizer solutions that contain both macro NPK and micro/trace nutrients (ie. Tropica Specialized).

You could also feed the fishes and shrimps abit more food to generate additional nutrients too.  :Very Happy:

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## FaRnieGuy

> If you find that the nitrate levels are staying low, can look at dosing specific nitrogen (N) fertilizer... or those all-in-one fertilizer solutions that contain both macro NPK and micro/trace nutrients (ie. Tropica Specialized).
> 
> You could also feed the fishes and shrimps abit more food to generate additional nutrients too.


I'll probably try to feed more first.. And stick with Seachem Fluorish..
If things don't change, then I'll get some all-in-one fertilizer..


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