# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Cyprinids >  The Striped Barb - dedicated to Nicky

## hwchoy

Nicky, this is your little _Eirmotus octozona_ contaminant, now all grown up at 5cm. Most likely to be the _Systomus lineatus_ but also could be the larger _Systomus johorensis_. Some scholars place them under the genus _Puntius_.

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## Nicky

Choy, you are solid man. First this fish was not that beautiful in my tank. Next it was sick when it went to you. Plus this is a damn fast fish, how on earth did you get such a clear shot?? Anyway Good Job!!

If you go to the following link (author is AQ forumer with nick = kuching)
http://www.geocities.com/rasbora2004/barb.html
and refer to the pic with 2 fishes and some human fingers, you can see exactly how this fish (that I handed over to you) was like when it was small. The fish on the right-bottom in the pic was it when it was little.

2 pictures up and on the right, that was how it looks like during the transformation of the same fish you took the pic now.

So what is the real scientific name of this fish, anyone know?

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## hwchoy

I am waiting to see if Heok Hee might be able to confirm for me, but it is probably the _Systomus lineatus_ or possibly _Systomus johorensis_, which grows much larger.

It is a beautiful fish, and not an aggressive barb. You will mostly find it named as _Puntius lineatus_ instead (including FishBase), depending which school of scholars you prefer to follow. I follow the school which places it in the _Systomus_ genus, which is a much tighter classification than the general _Puntius_.

I quote from a message from H.H. Ng:[quote:4d31c077ae="NG Heok Hee"]_Systomus_ was resurrected as a valid genus by Walter Rainboth, who used it for small barbs with a serrated dorsal-fin spine, 2 or 4 barbels, and less than 12 gill rakers on the first gill arch. In contrast, _Puntius_ would have a smooth dorsal spine, only 2 (never 4) barbels, and more than 12 gill rakers on the first arch. So, by this definition, many of the barbs encountered in the aquarium trade are _Systomus_ (_S. tetrazona_, _S. binotatus_, _S. hexazona_, _S. partipentazona_, _S. johorensis_, _S. gemellus_, and so on).

Of course, this scheme is not adhered to by all workers, so some references (notably those of Kottelat) still refer to these as _Puntius_.
[/quote:4d31c077ae]

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## hwchoy

Should be a _Systomus johorensis_, so it will grow a bit bigger.

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## kuching

Hi guys,i'm kuching.
I'm not sure these species are still under puntius or not but i'm telling you the puntius lineatus &amp; puntius johorensis are very similar...look at the 2 pix below:





Can u see the difference?1st 1 is p.lineatus....they got more than 3 stripes running parallel with lateral line but p.ohorensis only got 3 stripes(adult).The juvenile of p.johorensis is looks like p.pentazona!Interesting fish,huh?!!1st i like to swim in school while the 2nd one like to swim alone!(in the wild under my observation)

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## hwchoy

Hi Michael, for most people it will be Puntius, but some of us follows Walter Rainboth so it is Systomus. You notice their dorsal spine is serrated just like the pentazona, partipentazona, hexazona, the T-barbs, etc. The johorensis, lineatus and gemellus (another stripe barb) are systomins.

According to the description papers, the johorensis should have 5-6 stripes when adult. Most important difference is that the lineatus do not have rostral barbels (i.e. the chiu on the upper lip), they only have chiu at the corner of the lower lip. The johorensis have 2 pairs of chiu, one pair on upper lip and one pair at lower lip (maxillary barbel).

The one from Nicky is a johorensis, I can see 2 pairs of chiu, just like lao-fu-zhi.  :Laughing: 

check out the drama over at petfrd.


here you should be able to see the two pairs of chiu:

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## kuching

btw,both species r found in blackwater.i saw p.lineatus swimming in school under my feets....if i got underwater camera,i will take such as beautiful scene...except the water is red in color.

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## hwchoy

how do you tell lineatus from johorensis when they're in the water?

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## kuching

huh...the 2nd pix i posted is not p.johoresis?I'll go back to check out the barbel of my puntius.....what species do u think?

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## kuching

ok,when u saw them in the wild,u can see the stripe of p.lineatus expecially those stripes on the upper part of the body is more than 3...a few stripes.....&amp; they swim in school ...about 10 or more!while p.johorensis(i assume is this species)is swimming alone &amp; when u see it from above,u only can see 2 stripes...the other stripe near the abdomen is not so clear when u saw them from the above.

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## hwchoy

[quote:4f5763b54b="kuching"]huh...the 2nd pix i posted is not p.johoresis?I'll go back to check out the barbel of my puntius.....what species do u think?[/quote:4f5763b54b]

I think simplest is to check for the chiu. 1-pair = lineatus, 2-pairs = johorensis. If body big big > 6cm also johorensis.

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## kuching

ok,tonight i'll observe the barbel &amp; take pix of these 2 species....check it out tomolo!(i'll post the pix here)

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## kuching

Hi choy....i got a BIG problem to identify the puntius!!!Both species got the 2 pair of barbels...see the pix.first 2 pix is p.lineatus(i assume)...the next 2 pix is p.johorensis(i assume)....so...how to identify?For the last 2...that puntius got a band running across the eyes both for species on the first 2 pix...doesn't got any band...but it got more stripes than the species on the last 2 pix....

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## hwchoy

well, one possibility is the first two pics are _Systomus gemellus_ given that the stripes are thinner. what size is it anyway? Anything bigger than 6cm ought to be _Systomus johorensis_.

I can't really see that eye-band you mentioned. Apparently there is also a species _Systomus trifasciatus_ that might be similar. if you can get a good side profile shot would help, and indicate the size.

I will try to invite Heok Hee over to have a look. Did you check out that link I gave for petfrd?

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## hwchoy

Michael, the first pair could be either _Systomus gemellus_ or _S. johorensis_. The second pair should be _Systomus trifasciatus_, what is the size of this second pair?

If you want to discuss it further with Heok Hee suggest you bring it over to the thread at petfrd discussing the _Systomus johorensis_.

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## kuching

for the 1 in the 1st 2 pix,the size is 12cm!The next 2 pix,the size is 5cm &amp; it'll keep on growing....

ok,we can discuss in petfrd...but got to wait...cos i'm in the office....can't do anything i wanted...

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## hwchoy

[quote:441a8645ad="kuching"]for the 1 in the 1st 2 pix,the size is 12cm!The next 2 pix,the size is 5cm &amp; it'll keep on growing....

ok,we can discuss in petfrd...but got to wait...cos i'm in the office....can't do anything i wanted...[/quote:441a8645ad]

confirm first pair johorensis, apparently gemellus not found in kalimantan. 12cm is the right size for adult johorensis. the second pair is trifasciatus and it will grow to about the same size as johorensis 10-12cm. it should still have the barred pattern at up to 3-4cm.

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## kuching

thanks choy.....i also pst some pix of these 2 species of barb in petfrd,take a look.

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## hwchoy

[quote:d94cb75366="kuching"]thanks choy.....i also pst some pix of these 2 species of barb in petfrd,take a look.[/quote:d94cb75366]

yup, saw it. anyway you already know HH right.

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## kuching

Which HH you mentioned above?Got 2 HH.The "HH" that i know is THH.I guess you know him,right?The other one is NHH....i am not knowing him that much as Mr Tree does.Anyway both HH is very important person to us!

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## hwchoy

[quote:5be3b618b9="kuching"]Which HH you mentioned above?Got 2 HH.The "HH" that i know is THH.I guess you know him,right?The other one is NHH....i am not knowing him that much as Mr Tree does.Anyway both HH is very important person to us![/quote:5be3b618b9]

NHH. Never see THH around forums.

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## kuching

oh i forgot to tell u.Yesterday when i was observing the barbs....they "show up" their barbels when i'm feeding them.Otherwise,they are just stck very close to their lips.So the best time to shoot the pix of barbs' barbel is the feeding time!My camera is not that good so...the pix is a bit "blur"....(the "close up"pix.)

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