# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Cichlids >  New Tank for cichlids!

## sen_jie

Hi guys, 

just received my tank from N30 on friday. 



fish tank set up: 2 tier, top tank is 3x1.5ftx1.5ft braceless tank 10mm glass


bottom tier is the same as the top, just that it is divided into 3 compartment for my apistogrammas :Grin:

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## sen_jie

With a budget of 200 bucks on a satuarday night i proceed to C328 to get some stuff

started off with the most important thing, canister filter. Doesn't have enough budget for a ehiem, thus plan to settle for a jebao. However uncle recommanded ATMAN instead. After going to take the ATMAN down from his store, he realised that his ATMAN is out of stock! Thus brought down a dolphin canister for me. He claimed that it is a japanese design but manufactured in China. With a limited budget on hand, i agreed to it.


Having a canister filter with no media for it sounds dumb yea?
so i gotten myself this -->



Next, it is shopping for lighting
i got a 3ft PL light. plan to have it for the top tank.
plans for my top tank?
Looking at cory+angel+rummynose combi. So with that in mind, i got some substrate which is cory friendly



So more or les the top tank is settled. lets move on to the bottom tank. Did i mentioned above it is for apistogramma?
How to miss this out when you are keeping apisto!

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## Aquanoob

Nice tank for your apisto. Any particular apisto you are looking at? By the way, can pm me the cost of your tank and stand?

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## mobile2007

Nice tank ! wondering how much it cost u to make that ?? 

Another mini LFS opening in progress..... :Wink:

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## sen_jie

Just the tank and the rack cost me 500 bucks.

But i got thicker glass as i am looking at braceless tank and thicker material used for the rack (usual is 1inch by 1inch, mine is 1.5inch by 1.5inch) that is why it is solid as a rock!

particular apistogramma?
-Norberti Or Panduro
-manti red bit
-(have not decide)

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## sen_jie

Other additional purchase which i got




Time to do some setting up now! stay tune!

End month (after payday) my shopping list will be:
- DW from GC
- Air pump
- 5kg more of sudo sand
- 3kg more of biohome


Stock list to get:
- Either wild discus OR angel for top tank
- Short nose cory (which are more tolerant to room temperature)
- Shoal of rummynose and some jumbo cardinal
- A couple of zebra ottos


May need a couple of months to get the whole tank running. Hope it will be operational ready and viewable by July  :Smile:

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## exotic_idiot

Starting smoothly and Looking good...
Quick get it started soon..
Can't wait for the full setup with fishes in...

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## tetrakid

Very nice tanks. Good design too, especially the corner angled reinforcements on the glass and the vertsatile 3-compartments below. The last time I got a 3ft tank was when I kept my bumpless Loahan fish. Now I only have a 2ft tank plus a couple of nano tanks.

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## stormhawk

sen_jie, the workmanship is evident. Rack looks solid and tanks nicely done. By the way, for the top tank, don't need such a thick layer of sand if you don't want to plant anything. You can go cheap and tie Java Ferns etc on the driftwood.

By the way, nice shorts.  :Laughing:

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## Jitticus

wow, this is more impressive in scale that that picture you showed me.  :Very Happy:  
3 feet gives you so many alternate possibilities and fish choices. 

Tetras - Bleeding heart, Weitzmani, 

Plecos - bristlenoses (L144, 181, 183), bulldog plecos, L037 (hypostomus but remains small)

Cory - this one is a big headache. Which one to choose???  :Very Happy: 

Angel or Discus - I find that angels are the easier choice because they almost never fall ill (once quarantined properly) and aren't picky about any food.

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## sen_jie

Thanks all for the kind comments

stormhawk: erm.. thanks for the comment about the shorts. From SAF wahaha. Any suggestion, if i am jus doing some plants such as ferns, do i need a PL Light? Or just a LED light or FL light will be good enough? Is there a need to get seachem flourish too? 

Jit: this pictures are taken using my compact camera instead of my phone camera. Yea actually i am more incline towards german rams + angel fish (peruvian? or any others to recommand?; please spare a thought on my wallet....) combination, rather than discus.

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## illumnae

For a 3x1.5x1.5, I would agree angels would give you more room to play around with. Max number of adult discus you can keep is probably 5 (and even so, not those xlg kind) - and that will still leave you with not much space to play around with for tankmates. Nonetheless, if you do get 5x 4-5 incher discus, you can still go ahead with rams and some tetras as dithers.

For angelfish, Peruvians are nice of course...but so are Manacapurus, or even some leopoldis if you can find them (not sure if C328 still has stock of them left from a few weeks back). Some other interesting wildcaughts are the Altimiras (Xingu) ones I got recently from JZX. Don't think there are any left though. I personally have kept leopoldis and I think they're a unique choice and cute to boot  :Smile: 

If you're going for a realistic Amazonian setup, then it would be best to go without plants and with the woodscape you planned. You won't find Java ferns or Anubias in S. America for sure  :Smile:  However, it depends on how strict you want to be with your biotope set up. You can be liberal with floating plants like frogbit though. The fish will appreciate the shade/cover.

Just a suggestion for a simple blackwater biotope (choice of fish are my personal preferences...you can swap around similar species):

6-7 x Pt scalare/leopoldi OR 5 x Symphysodon discus/aquaefasciatus
4-5 x Microgeophagus ramirezi
20 x Paracheirodon axelrodi / Hemmigrammus bleheri
6-10 x Corydoras duplicareus
1 x L52 Dekeyseria sp. / L183 Ancistrus sp.

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## sen_jie

morning Illumnae,

thanks for the suggestion. Sounds like a great plan which you have suggested. most likely i will go ahead with 

4x angel
1 pair of rams
a couple of male apistos
and some cories 

any suggestion on the lighting? Is PL too strong? i am actually looking at some LED lights which i can attached on the side of the tank (as it is braceless i love the sleek look, thus does not want to make the top too complicated. actually i am looking at those LED bulbs from IKEA to be attached (1 on each side) shining in at a certain angle. Do you think it will look weird?

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## illumnae

I think the IKEA bulbs may end up too dim. Having both shine in from either end would look weird as in nature, usually you won't find the sun shining in opposite angles. I personally love LED lights for biotope tanks, and have been using either DIY or Maxspect Mazerra for over a year. Perhaps you could DIY your own LED setup using the frame from an existing PL fixture?

As for the fish, sounds good...I tend to like "busier" looking tanks so I have my tanks stocked more tightly. However, I would recommend at least 5 angels to spread aggression.

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## tetrakid

The more I look at the tanks you bought, the more I like it. 

If I have a fish room or more space, I will definitely be getting two sets to be placed side by side, perhaps with one side having the big tank placed below, to be used as a daphnia culture tank.

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## sen_jie

out of those angels which you have recommanded, which breed is the smallest? (doesnt want to push my filter system to the limit as i am only running on 1 1100/h canister)

and may i know where i can DIY the lightings?


(this is getting really exciting haha)

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## sen_jie

> The more I look at the tanks you bought, the more I like it. 
> 
> If I have a fish room or more space, I will definitely be getting two sets to be placed side by side, perhaps with one side having the big tank placed below, to be used as a daphnia culture tank.


Thanks for the compliment  :Smile: 

anyway just a short update, i have already filled the bottom with ADA soil  :Smile: 

not sure is it me who feels this way, the soil seems dirtier as compared to the past. I wash it around 4 times and it is still very very dirty. So i gave up and just throw it into the bottom tank. (Have yet to add water in)

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## illumnae

It's not the speed of the pump that counts, but the amount of filter bacteria (aka your media). I think you should be fine in terms of filtration capacity - just make sure you cycle properly.

In the long run, Pt leopoldis would be the smallest. Pt scalare variants generally end up about the same size, and are larger than the Pt leopoldis. The Pt leopoldis are seasonal though, so they may not be readily available.

In terms of DIYing the lightings, search around in the DIY section - there are a number of threads where other forumers have DIY-ed and showcased the process. I personally went with Meanwell drivers and China LEDs (cheaper, but not as efficient as CREEs). You can order them in from www.cutter.com.au or www.rapidled.com. I may have some spare Meanwells that I'm salvaging from my previous DIY (which I've since decommissioned and upgraded to Maxspect Mazerra sets instead). I'll need to go take a look.

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## Aquanoob

I don't think there is a need to wash the ADA soil, in fact, you shouldn't wash any aquasoil.

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## sen_jie

> I don't think there is a need to wash the ADA soil, in fact, you shouldn't wash any aquasoil.


Morning! Oh really? But it is really very dirty. lots of wood shaving, and the water is as dirty as carbon. eye sore! but after washing it is still the same.. lol. maybe just managed to remove the woods shavings thats all haha

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## |squee|

Aquasoil *cannot* be washed! Your tank should be extremely murky now. You have to do a ton of water changes and try not to disturb the substrate anymore. In simple terms Aquasoil is like hardened clay pellets, that's why you cannot wash them. By right the water should be very clear if you set Aquasoil up properly.  :Smile:

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## stormhawk

When you wash the Aquasoil, you are basically breaking it down into "mud". Not a good idea, and definitely not standard practice with such soils. Lay them as you wish, then place the bag over the soil and pour water in slowly. Rushing it will not help. Like what squee said, if you set it up properly you won't have an issue at all.

By the way, the pieces of wood and twigs are normal. They typically float to the water surface after the tank has been filled. All you need to do at that time is net them out.

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## sen_jie

Thanks for the advise. i think i just "slap myself in the face" No wonder how hard i wash, it is still so murky.

tonight shall pour the rest of the soil in and fill it with my old tank water!

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## alfredliow316

Since it's a new tank without any fish, do a WIWO-Water In Water Out. 

Just need 2 hoses to do it. One hose from the tap, the other hose to siphon out water. The hose letting in water, think of a way to block out the water pressure entering the tank so that it doesnt disturb the substrate anymore. Do it till you see clear water in your tank. Then you can start cycling the tank.

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## driftbaker

hi guys, would like to seek advice on the topic of the aquasoil. you guys said no need to wash? is it true for all type of sand?

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## Aquanoob

It is for those soil which is clay-based, like ADA, GEX, etc those brown-black or orange colour soil. For those inert type like black quartz, sand, I think you can wash them before use as they won't turn muddy.

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## Don90

> Thanks for the advise. i think i just "slap myself in the face" No wonder how hard i wash, it is still so murky.
> 
> tonight shall pour the rest of the soil in and fill it with my old tank water!


Bro just pour in the soil, then pour in the water. Theres no need to wash aquasoil.

wait for a few hours or overnight and wait for the particles to settle at the bottom. For those floating particles or small pieces of floating fiber, just use a net to scoop it out.

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## sen_jie

Anybody knows of any angelfish homebreeders around? looking at some fake altums to placed in my tank  :Smile:

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## illumnae

haha what do you define as "fake altums" bro? JZX is supposed to be expected a batch of F1 or F2 Manacapuru angels. No idea when the ETA is though.

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## sen_jie

Erm.. something like pervuvian angels or Manacapuru. Looks like altum but without altum price tag hahaha

Oh! thanks for the head up, time to send lianho a sms

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## illumnae

They've arrived and look good  :Smile:  Do note however, that Manacapurus look like typical scalares when adult, just with red colouration. If you're looking for altum lookalikes, you want peruvians or those from Santa Isabel (very rare and more expensive than altums!!!)

Altums are also cheaper than most, if not all, wild scalare/leopoldis  :Smile:

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## sen_jie

Thanks for the heads up bro.

Will drop by lianho's place to take a peep. He have already watsapp me a sneak preview. Looks awesome!

However i may move towards peruvian angel or maybe the real altums  :Smile:  still lots of plans in my mind. going through what i really like as well as what my wallet really like.

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## illumnae

You definitely should drop by to take a look. I saw the sneak preview too and it's great  :Smile: 

After some further thought, I would think manacapuru would be good for you. 1.5ft height is too low for altums. I used to keep my old 2008 batch in 2ft depth and they maxed out at 11 inches height - definitely not their maximum potential. My current batch is in 2ft 4 inches height and even when young I see better finnage.

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## sen_jie

So can i assume that Manacapuru even when fully grown the total height is one of the smaller species of angelfish around?

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## sen_jie

And idea on how to sex the angel?

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## stormhawk

Not easy to sex. Adult males may form the nuchal hump, but only in a few. Best to buy around 6 pieces and see if you're lucky to get a pair. If I was you, I'd buy Pt. leopoldi. When in good shape they are stunners, and IMO the most beautiful of the wild angels.

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## illumnae

The metal blue "blusher" on leopoldis is indeed beautiful. They also stay smaller than scalares and their beauty is often understated. My opinion differs slightly in that I don't think that they're the most beautiful when compared with altums and some scalare variants, but their reputation of being the "ugly duckling" of the Pterophyllum genus is definitely undeserved. That being said, I feel that they can definitely hold their own easily in terms of attractiveness when compared to their larger cousins. Each species is just beautiful in its own way.

To answer your earlier question on height, Manacapurus will reach nowhere near the height of altums, and not even Santa Isabels. I don't think they reach the height of Peruvians either, though I may be wrong. I would say that they are the size of a normal Pt scalare angelfish, no more no less.

If you want "smaller", I would still highly recommend Pt leopoldi.

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## sen_jie

sounds cool, thanks to all the advise given thus far especially to illumane and stormhawk.

learn quite alot over here.

One more question. How do i differentiate Pt leopodi and mancapuru?

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## illumnae

Leopoldis are more elongated in shape (they are known as long-nose angelfish), and one distinct characteristic is that they have a rather large blotch on the body just below the dorsal fin. Specimen in good condition will also exhibit metallic blue cheeks. They also have larger scale size than altums and scalare on their bodies.

Try googling both species, the most distinctive traits to me are the body shape and the blotch, which you can clearly see from the google images.

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## sen_jie

sure! i am googling now. then as for peruvian angels, is that their scientific name? or is it a trade name as it is collected in peru? 

From what i read thus far seems like angelfish have 3 main category, seems like scalare, altum and leopoldis. In this case, where does manacupuru and peruvian stands?

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## illumnae

Peruvian angels are Pterophyllum scalare, they are a variant found in Peru that are exceptionally "tall", hence the name "Peruvian Altums". They also usually have spotted bodies. 

There are 3 species of angelfish, as you have listed. Peruvians and Manacapuru are both scalare variants. Manacapuru are known for having red blotches on the upper part of their bodies, a trait of the fish from that locality. scalare variants from the Santa Isabel, Rio Cuini and Tapajos are also known for having various amounts of red on parts of their body.

P.S. I think JZX came in a batch of leopoldis, so you can choose between Manacapuru scalare and leopoldis when you drop by.

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## sen_jie

Your deep knowledge on angelfish is indeed amazing!

Maybe one day we should meet up at ABC market (If my memory didnt fails me, you did mentioned you live near that area- i live near there too )

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## illumnae

No la, lots of people know more than me. I just have taken an interest in S.A. cichlids, especially discus and angelfish (and to a lesser extent pikes and eartheaters), so I've been reading up on them a little more.

Seems like we live at the same area  :Smile:  Should definitely meet up for coffee or a meal to catch up one of these days! Jiayong also mentioned he has known you for ages...I go to JZX rather often nowadays so we could meet up there too if you want. When are you going to check out the Manacapurus and leopoldis? I'm planning to make a trip down either tonight or tomorrow

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## mordrake

wah senjie still so into apistos.
still remember ard 10 years back sold you a pair... can't remember which var though.  :Razz: 
i was living at Stirling Rd then.

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## sen_jie

> wah senjie still so into apistos.
> still remember ard 10 years back sold you a pair... can't remember which var though. 
> i was living at Stirling Rd then.


Hi Melvin

yea tat was my first pair of apisto, If my memory never fails, it was a pair of trifaciata. Are you still keeping apisto?

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## sen_jie

> No la, lots of people know more than me. I just have taken an interest in S.A. cichlids, especially discus and angelfish (and to a lesser extent pikes and eartheaters), so I've been reading up on them a little more.
> 
> Seems like we live at the same area  Should definitely meet up for coffee or a meal to catch up one of these days! Jiayong also mentioned he has known you for ages...I go to JZX rather often nowadays so we could meet up there too if you want. When are you going to check out the Manacapurus and leopoldis? I'm planning to make a trip down either tonight or tomorrow


I will try to stay clear of JZX until my tank is ready. I have yet to set up the tank totally. THis sat will be going down to c328 to get more sands. As well as more filter media.

by sat night my tank should be up and running. Will try to stablise the water first before adding any new fishes in. 

anyway my contact is 90044411, feel free to arrange a meet up anytime

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## driftbaker

i see! thanks alot!




> It is for those soil which is clay-based, like ADA, GEX, etc those brown-black or orange colour soil. For those inert type like black quartz, sand, I think you can wash them before use as they won't turn muddy.

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## doppelbanddwarf

Nice tanks, Senjie.
Saw some nice dwarfs at c328 today. T.candidi, N.anomala and a small tank full of Discrossus filamentosus too! 
I got 2 unknown apistos from the Discrossus tank, must have come in as contaminants.

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## mordrake

> Hi Melvin
> 
> yea tat was my first pair of apisto, If my memory never fails, it was a pair of trifaciata. Are you still keeping apisto?



Now only have a pair of caca orange flash. 
10 years everything also tried from aros to CRS to reef tank. 
Still back to favourite discus and accompanied by apisto.  :Very Happy: 
Just went JZX today and got 6 manacapuru angels. Swee.  :Smile:

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## sen_jie

Oooo mana! just cannt wait for my tank to start running!

today just added in around 9kg of sudo sand. got 2L of ehiem substrate + 1L of biohomes and some CR into my canister filter.

Tank condition is super milky now. Added in a few teaspoon of Seachem purigen. Hope that the tank will mature and clean up soon.

And also just "transfered" my dirty unwashed sponge filterS into the the tank. (cheering on to the BB, hope they can colonise fast.)

As of now, water PH is ard 7.4, Nitrate level seems on the high side. (Will test again with my API test kit in 3 days time)

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## mordrake

Add Purigen to water? Wrong la!
Put in old sock and put in filter or tank with water flowing through.

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## sen_jie

> Add Purigen to water? Wrong la!
> Put in old sock and put in filter or tank with water flowing through.


 Hi bro, 

yea yea what i meant was i didnt not add it into my canister, instead attach a coffee filter to the rainbar and placed the purigen in the coffee filter, so that it will be "exposed" to more water movement :Grin:

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## Sinubux

Cannot wait to see your tank in an up and running state.

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## Blue Whale

> Oooo mana! just cannt wait for my tank to start running!
> 
> today just added in around 9kg of sudo sand. got 2L of ehiem substrate + 1L of biohomes and some CR into my canister filter.
> 
> Tank condition is super milky now. Added in a few teaspoon of Seachem purigen. Hope that the tank will mature and clean up soon.
> 
> And also just "transfered" my dirty unwashed sponge filterS into the the tank. (cheering on to the BB, hope they can colonise fast.)
> 
> As of now, water PH is ard 7.4, Nitrate level seems on the high side. (Will test again with my API test kit in 3 days time)


You have to wait if you want apistogramma. Currently JZX left with Inka. Next batch of apisto comes in 2 weeks time. If you have time, goto FB and search for their page and like it. He would be posting up the new photos. You could get the L200 Highfin if you like it.

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## sen_jie

Update as of this morning, water is slowly clearing up. May need to do a slight twig to the canister, although it mentioned its around 1100L/Hour, the flowrate seems to be faster than my previous jebao which on paper, its flowrate is 1300L/H

seems like its a little too powerful for my future fishes

Just on a side note, was relatively impressed with the Dolphin Canister, great design and power. For 75 bucks really cannot complain. Only drawback maybe during maintenance. As the canister motor casing is screwed together. Thus if there is a need to remove the propellor to wash, you may need the help of a screwdriver.

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## Blue Whale

> Update as of this morning, water is slowly clearing up. May need to do a slight twig to the canister, although it mentioned its around 1100L/Hour, the flowrate seems to be faster than my previous jebao which on paper, its flowrate is 1300L/H
> 
> seems like its a little too powerful for my future fishes
> 
> Just on a side note, was relatively impressed with the Dolphin Canister, great design and power. For 75 bucks really cannot complain. Only drawback maybe during maintenance. As the canister motor casing is screwed together. Thus if there is a need to remove the propellor to wash, you may need the help of a screwdriver.


Ho Ho...tuition fee. Well, now that you have a guide, you'd have time to search for a more suitable one for the future. Dolphin will not last, so can plan for the future lor. We all pay tuition fees always, even if we are old.

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## doppelbanddwarf

If the flowrate is too strong you can turn the rainbar towards the side of the tank.

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## Blue Whale

But algae will build up. Difficult to clean.

Use a driftwood or Stone after the flow to cushion the strong flow. You can remove it for maintainence (hot water treatment), if need be. Easier ....for the time being.

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## sen_jie

Actually i am already mentally prepared for the flowrate to decrease by around 10% after afew months of usuage. 

So as of now during the initial cycling period, i will switch it on at full blaze. maybe infuture will adjust the flowrate using the value. But come to think about it, i guess if i am keeping cory, they may appreciate it yea?

Hi blue whale, have you used dolphin canister before? any reviews? I did a search online and find that there are mixed reviews on it. Just try my luck and see how things goes. Actually i was planning to get ATMAN or Jebao series (in order to fit into my budget of 100 bucks) But Mr Toh from C328 actually suggested Dolphin to me, saying it have a bigger media capacity as well as its japan design (but made in china) Thus i just went ahead with it.


Will keep you guys update on the fish, tank and dolphin filter.

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## Blue Whale

> Actually i am already mentally prepared for the flowrate to decrease by around 10% after afew months of usuage. 
> 
> So as of now during the initial cycling period, i will switch it on at full blaze. maybe infuture will adjust the flowrate using the value. But come to think about it, i guess if i am keeping cory, they may appreciate it yea?
> 
> Hi blue whale, have you used dolphin canister before? any reviews? I did a search online and find that there are mixed reviews on it. Just try my luck and see how things goes. Actually i was planning to get ATMAN or Jebao series (in order to fit into my budget of 100 bucks) But Mr Toh from C328 actually suggested Dolphin to me, saying it have a bigger media capacity as well as its japan design (but made in china) Thus i just went ahead with it.
> 
> 
> Will keep you guys update on the fish, tank and dolphin filter.


I used Dolphin at early stages. Ok ok lor...not good not bad kind. You should set higher standard for yourself next time. Improving one step at a time. But again I say, at your own pace, don't rush. There is no happiness if you force your way through. To each, the learning curve differs.

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## sen_jie

Any recommandation for me?

Thus far i have used only Jebao, atman and dolphin. 

Ehiem, tetra etc are alittle too expensive for me to handle

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## Blue Whale

Future tanks if you want to keep small fishes, then a small one like GEX Slim Large will do. Hang on filter. Easy maintenance.

For large fishes, it depends. The tank might not be suitable in the first place. So it depends more on your intentions and specific needs of the fish and plants then. But you can look into Ehiem, GEX.
Jebao isn't lasting. Atman I no comments, never use. Dolphin you know so-so only, you know more as time progresses.

These ain't just the only few brands around. You can read more in equipment section. Just subscribe to the threads and camp there to read. That would be easier for you. Eye power only. Else, do more walk about through different LFS. See, learn, ask.

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## illumnae

I have heard Dolphin and Atman are pretty good brands if you're looking for a canister on a budget. Of course they won't last as long as Eheims, but you can buy 3-4 of them for the price of an equivalent Eheim, so I guess the cost evens out - just increased risk of filter malfunction flooding your room or killing your fish.

In terms of flow rate, I wouldn't worry. After media and head loss, I am pretty sure your flow rate will not be higher than 900L/hr (in fact it's probably less). based on your water volume of ~180L, that's a mere 5x flow per hour. Remember, flow rate is likely to be much less than 900L/hr so in actual fact you are probably looking at a figure of perhaps 3x flow per hour, which is very low.

Just as a reference, I run my biotope tanks with the following pumps: 4ft - Eheim 1262 & 6ft - Ocean Runner 6500. Flow rate in each tank is definitely more than 5x per hour, and the wild fish love it. If you're keeping angel fish as your main tank, they would appreciate more flow.

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## Blue Whale

I only got Ehiem when I was having a 3ft back way way back. Okie, get external only if I need chiller. Else, Hangon Canister or Hangon Filter will suffice. I am not training champion now...not yet...heh heh. There is always a poisonous element there. Heh Heh...

Idea is, know what you need, know what you want, know how deep is your pocket, know when the equipment will roughly give way.
For Fish and Plants! (King and Country!)

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## sen_jie

Hi Illumnae,

Oh i am surprised that Angels will appreciate high flow rate. Bais on the rational that they have a tall body I assumed that they will prefer slower water flow. I don't think i need to worry much for the cories either.


Just a short update. the tank water seems to clear up quite a fair bit. Will continue to run in the tank, and do a test on friday.
In the meanwhile, Water change from my existing tank goes directly to this main tank.

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## Blue Whale

Angel fish can survive in fast and slow flow rate. How come? Now in the natural environment, say one of the tributeries of amazonia river, depending on season, flowrate can go fast and slow. So it adapts to both kinda of environment. But you saw during feeding time...they are fast because they are predatory class. They can hunt alone or in group. So endlers and cardinals shouldn't go near angel fish - fish food.

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## sen_jie

Any Kind soul can recommand me places to get branch Driftwood? (Farms or LFS etc)

I know GC selling, but the woods which they are selling is totally out of my budget  :Sad:

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## Sinubux

> Any Kind soul can recommand me places to get branch Driftwood? (Farms or LFS etc)
> 
> I know GC selling, but the woods which they are selling is totally out of my budget


C328 perhaps or Nature Aquarium.

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## ciaossu

seaview got lots to choose from also.

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## Blue Whale

> Any Kind soul can recommand me places to get branch Driftwood? (Farms or LFS etc)
> 
> I know GC selling, but the woods which they are selling is totally out of my budget


Supposed you goto C328 and buy vegetables, look for those which are tied. It comes with a driftwood. Just pick one that is within your budget.
Usually these DW are pretty decomposed or near decomposition and are very suitable to culture algae, as in if water parameters allows, the algae will grow on the DW instead of the glass... unless it is frantically out of parameters that is. This is how I collect my wood in the first place. Big or small, they are all useful. 

If the plants being eaten or maybe died due to improper care, you can still take that piece out for drying. But best with water treatment before you wind dry over newspaper and wrap them up for storage for future use.

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## jervinphua

Bro post some pictures of your tank leh...

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## sen_jie

> seaview got lots to choose from also.


 
Hi bro

went over there over the weekend. the woods which they are selling are different fromt he one which i am keen in. Apparently only 3 places sell the woods which i like, however 1 is over prices, the other one stop business and my last hope, they mentioned that they didnt import much wood recently.

So guess i still have the wait for the right chance

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## sen_jie

> Bro post some pictures of your tank leh...


Hi bro, the tank water now have cleared up and with a layer of sudo sand. Have not added any lifestock or scaping materials in.

Will do so once i start to add things in  :Smile:

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## sen_jie

All pictures are taken as at 15/04/2012
Initial tank when i filled it up with water and sand (Top tank). 50% of water are from my old seasoned tank. another 50% is tap water with 2x dose of seachem PRIME



After 1 week (With filter media and Seachem purigen)



Bottom tank(when initially just filled up it was so black that i cannot see my fingers in the water.
*thus never take pictures*

Now

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## sen_jie

transfer window opens in May'12. Potential target
For bottom tank
-Apistogramma Hongsloi
-Apistogramma Bit Menti red
-Apistogramma Eliz

For top tank
-German Rams
-Either Mana angel / Altum angel / wild discus
-Corydoras

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## Aquanoob

Big project coming up... Where will you be getting the Hongsloi, I am also interested in getting a pair.

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## alfredliow316

Many many pairs from Malaysia!  :Smile:  

Senjie,
Ask your 'good friend' to bring them to you!

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## sen_jie

> Many many pairs from Malaysia!  
> 
> Senjie,
> Ask your 'good friend' to bring them to you!


Bro did he breathe any words on the bretbinden which i am looking for? wahahaha :Grin:

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## alfredliow316

Wanted to pass you my pair which have gave me one spawn. But unfortunately the female has caught pop eye. No worries, I think he'll able to net one pair from his tanks. (i think)

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## sen_jie

Just some small updates

draft 1 of my main tank


got some small fishes over the weekend. anybody can help with the ID for those cute cory? i know the polka dot is a melini, got 2 more unknown speicies

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## sen_jie

I simply love the XXL size bleeding heart. huge and fast!

Once water is stable i will get more DW from GC, more ferns from GC and throw in adult size apistogrammas and angels  :Smile:

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## stormhawk

sen_jie, the Corydoras are as follows:

polka dot, black stripe on eye, greyish-white body = C. atropersonatus
diagonal stripe from dorsal fin to base of lower tail fin and eye stripe = C. melini
same pattern as melini but added spots in the middle of body = C. loxozonus (in pic 3 closest to a rummynose tetra)

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## sen_jie

Thanks bro stormhawk.

can i ask what is the difference between a atropersonatus and a kanoi (both looks almost identical!)

On a side note, getting some Metae to join in the platoon this sunday ^_^

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## stormhawk

See the following pics by Benny:





In kanei, the spotting is more fine and closer together. They extend into the caudal fin and into the dorsal fin. The presence of the faint black mark extending into the dorsal fin is another identification marker. There are several C numbers which look similar to kanei and atropersonatus, but basically, looking at the spot pattern and the tail is enough to tell them apart.

I personally love C. atropersonatus. Had about a dozen or so when I had them some years ago. Very beautiful cory.

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## sen_jie

thanks for the clear explaination!

seems like i got a long way to go to understand the cory community better

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## Jitticus

Psst, this one taken by burlpen..i stole his video.  :Very Happy:

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## ciaossu

wow nice pair, thanks for sharing.

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## doppelbanddwarf

Can't wait to see your setups when they are filled with fish, especially the bottom tier!

And nice elizabethae Jitticus!

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## Sinubux

Sen Jie, am looking forward to viewing your completed masterpiece.

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## Lexz_10

Nice & neat setup. thanks for sharing  :Smile:

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## Jitticus

Got space for these?

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## sen_jie

nice!

but no more space at the time being.. left 1 tank, awaiting for eliz....

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## sen_jie

Thanks to all the kind comments. I will further update over the weekend when my new "family members" arrive.

stay tune!

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## Aquanoob

Jitticus, what apisto is that? A pity I have no more space left.

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## mer2623

Nicholas, did you get your hongsloi already?

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## sen_jie

> Jitticus, what apisto is that? A pity I have no more space left.


 
Hi, that should be a Apistogramma Borelli

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## Aquanoob

No, this coming Saturday. Did you contact Senjie or you want to join me this Saturday? you can sms me for more detail.

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## sen_jie

> Sen Jie, am looking forward to viewing your completed masterpiece.


Honsgloi form 2, and papagei formed pairs are in individual tanks already  :Smile: 

anyway you have a nice adoketa as your picture. Are those yours?

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## sen_jie

Sneak preview of my papagei pair tank

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## mer2623

Senjie, hows your hongsloi from jit? Mine are already start to court and in breeding colors..

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## sen_jie

> Senjie, hows your hongsloi from jit? Mine are already start to court and in breeding colors..


 
same here it is in breeding mood too. when i got it i saw only a little redness. but now the rednesss have alr covered 10% of the body  :Smile:  female is yellowish too

but i need to find space for them. as they are sharing tank with Bernie's pair of hongsloi too.

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## sen_jie

Temporary set up for my apistogramma, (untill i managed to source for nice DW, this will be their temporary "furniture" at the moment)


My tenant:
taking the Corner left unit


Middle tenant.

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## ciaossu

wow nice tenant. may i know where you got them from?

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## stormhawk

sen_jie, nice and simple setup, however I'd suggest you get bigger sponge filters. This small one primarily for fry tanks, will not be sufficient for filtration in the long term.

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## doppelbanddwarf

Looking good. You might want to put some floaters like frogbits or hornswort to shade a bit of the light. I got plenty to spare so if you don't mind coming to Yishun I can pass you some.

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## sen_jie

Ciaossu: i got the papagei from Bernie and the left piece also belongs to Bernie just that i help to foster it at the time being haha

Stormhawk: will do so, i am looking at hanging my Eden canister at the back of the tank soon, but well maybe will start "operation" when my papers are over. In the meantime i shall be more hardworking and do 2x weekly water change

Chongyu: thanks for the kind gesture, but yishun is kind of far from me (i am lazy  :Smile:  ) Shall collect some from GC when i passby there on sat evening.

Anyway i just gotten some bogwood from a forumer. New scape on the way! (Awaiting for the bogwood to sink)

Does anybody have a fast method to remove the blue green algae from bogwood? the bluegreen algae is on the bogwood and dried up since 3 years ago

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## sen_jie

Last night saw that my females are very aggressive and went to take a peep. Apparently my Hongsloi females had spawn and took the fries out for a walk  :Smile: 

then i saw her flaring at my papagei female who have also turned yellow, and also brought her fries out for a walk too  :Smile: 

both are first time parents and very young female. Thus far thi only managed to count around 10 fries from each of the honsgloi and the papagei spawn

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## mer2623

Wow..congrats bro

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## doppelbanddwarf

Congrats bro!

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## Aquanoob

Congrats Senjie. Your Hongsloi very hardworking, my side no good news yet.

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## Jitticus

holy crap.... !
congrats senjie!

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## ciaossu

congrats man  :Smile:

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## doppelbanddwarf

With so many hobbyists getting A.hongsloi from Jitticus, lets hope we have a good line of this species going on this side of the causeway soon.

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## sen_jie

Spot the frys!

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## stormhawk

Can see 3 fry at least in the last pic. Congrats sen_jie. This one should be the papagei?

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## Lexz_10

Congrats bro  :Smile:

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## sen_jie

> Can see 3 fry at least in the last pic. Congrats sen_jie. This one should be the papagei?


 Yup there are around 8 fry. These are hongsloi babies. didnt managed to snap the pictures of the papagei.

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## anarchy78

Wow i envy your set uP bro :Smile:  very nice congrats with your apisto! :Smile:  im also starting to keep apistos really interesting fish :Smile:

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## sen_jie

> Wow i envy your set uP bro very nice congrats with your apisto! im also starting to keep apistos really interesting fish


thanks for the kind comments

yea without doubt they are very interesting fishes. Welcome you to the apisto - world  :Smile:

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## sen_jie

Latest update, papagei fries all gone -_-"

hongsloi fries have a total headcount of 10  :Smile:

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