# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Characins >  Where to buy Dwarf Neon Rainbowfish

## Ryan Peh

So i really want to put some dwarf neon rainbow fish in my new tank and i only found a shop at pasir ris fish farm selling at $2 per fish and idk if thats expensive or not!
Has anyone came across any LFS that sells those fishes?

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## TheAquarist

Fishybusiness have i think, contact them before going down!

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

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## Tmark

Maybe you can try nanyang (seaview)

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## Ryan Peh

Hey! So I bought 6 of them from Arowana Avenue at Clementi yesterday and this morning all the fishes seem to be dwelling at the top but they were eating and the colours seemed fine. 

However, there was this one fish that is tilted with its mouth towards the surface and it constantly swims near the surface. I'm not sure if it had eaten any of the pallets I fed to the others. 

Anyone know what's wrong?

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## tetrakid

> Hey! So I bought 6 of them from Arowana Avenue at Clementi yesterday and this morning all the fishes seem to be dwelling at the top but they were eating and the colours seemed fine. 
> 
> However, there was this one fish that is tilted with its mouth towards the surface and it constantly swims near the surface. I'm not sure if it had eaten any of the pallets I fed to the others. 
> 
> Anyone know what's wrong?


Make sure you cover the tank with some netting.
I have experienced them jumping out and have lost quite a few previously.

Can you show a picture of yor tank? What type of filter are you using?

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## Ryan Peh

Here's a picture of my tank 
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1444960476.054060.jpg

It's 4ft long and I'm using a sump filtration system. That was a picture taken before I added the neon dwarf rainbows.

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1444960519.942140.jpg

This was the rainbowfish when I just added them. I don't have a picture of the one skimming the surface as I'm not home now.

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## tetrakid

Do you have any filter for the tank?

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## Ryan Peh

It's an overflow system! So it's connected to a sump tank. 
There's bubbles from the outlet pipes so yup there's plenty of filtration and I'm using a 4000litre/hr pump!

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## tetrakid

There may be insufficient oxygenation. I am a nut when it comes to oxygenation. I like to max the oxygen level.

You can try adding an air bubbler to boost the oxygen level. 
Just a simple air tube will do but make sure the water surface has plenty of agitation and spreads to the whole surface area.

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## Ryan Peh

If it was insufficient oxygenation, shouldn't my 6 corydoras and 5 other neon dwarf rainbowfishes be at the surface too? 
My corydoras are still scavenging at the bottom and the other 5 rainbowfishes are swimming around the middle level! 
So I don't really think it's insufficient oxygenation, plus there is plenty of agitation from the overflow system to the sump and the outlet pipes. 12 fishes in 175 gallons of water shouldn't be suffering from a lack of oxygenation right..?

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## tetrakid

I see. I had thought your fishes are staying at the top.  :Smile:

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## seudzar

I thought Overflow slump system is one of the best oxygenation system

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## Ryan Peh

Yeah i think it is!
Anyone has any idea what's wrong with my fish

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## Urban Aquaria

If the fishes are actually gasping at the water surface, then thats a sign of depleted oxygen in the water... but if they are just swimming near the top while the other fishes are still swimming normally in the middle and bottom of the tank, then most probably the oxygen levels are okay. Probably those fishes are just waiting for food being dropped from above or naturally like exploring the top level of the tank or something.

That being said, if the new fishes were previously subjected to high toxic ammonia levels in a LFS tank (very common due to their high stocking densities in the retail shops), some of them may get ammonia poisoning and suffer from damaged gills which makes it more difficult for them to breathe. In this case, the damage is already done and they may still exhibit breathing difficulties in a tank that has ample oxygen. That could be whats happening to that one fish that has its mouth constantly tilted towards the surface.

Not much you can do but just try to maintain clean and stable water conditions, and perhaps run an air stone to further oxygenate the water, hopefully can help the affected fishes recover over a period of time if the damage was minor (though if the damage is severe its permanent).

Btw, although your tank has a large water volume, do also check its ammonia levels with a test kit too, just to make sure and narrow down the possible causes.

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## Ryan Peh

I was thinking if it could be ammonia or nitrate since I left a dead shrimp in the tank as recommended by one of the forumer to increase my ammonia in order to better cycle my tank due to the lack of bio-load... 
Now I'm worried if the shrimp is actually causing major problems...

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## Urban Aquaria

Better to remove the dead shrimp since you are already using livestock to cycle the tank... no need for additional ammonia from decomposing shrimp, which could end up releasing more than what the existing beneficial bacteria can handle safely.

Using rotting fish/shrimp or food to generate ammonia is meant more for the fishless cycle method, whereby there are no livestock in the tank which could be affected by the excess ammonia.

Do get a test kit set to measure the tank parameters, so that you'll have a more informed idea of your tank's water condition.

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## Ryan Peh

One just died in front of me and there's another one still swimming tilted to the surface... 
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1445011914.821365.jpg

While the others are schooling just fine...
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1445011941.684926.jpg

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## Ryan Peh

Just tested for ammonia! Currently it's at 0.5ppm and I'm doing a 20-25% water change nowwww! 

Also I fished out the dead shrimp!

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## Ryan Peh

Alright so the fish is no longer at the surface but it's still tilted... Anyone knows why? 
And should I take it out just in case it's a disease or something? 

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1445015753.722401.jpg

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## Urban Aquaria

> Just tested for ammonia! Currently it's at 0.5ppm and I'm doing a 20-25% water change nowwww! 
> 
> Also I fished out the dead shrimp!


Wow... okay, looks like we underestimated the "rotting" power of a dead ghost shrimp, even in a large tank volume.  :Opps: 

I guess the existing corydoras in the tank could already have been the limit for the still-developing tank cycle, those additional rainbow fishes and dead ghost shrimp probably tipped the ammonia levels over the edge. The fish-in cycling method really does require very slow introduction of livestock in stages and it has to be spread out over a much longer period of time.

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## Urban Aquaria

> Alright so the fish is no longer at the surface but it's still tilted... Anyone knows why? 
> And should I take it out just in case it's a disease or something? 
> 
> Attachment 50819


If the fish is swimming tilted then most likely its a swim bladder issue... or could be due to a bunch of other issues too. The fish in your photo does look skinnier than the others though, so could be internal parasites or illness.

I guess you could transfer it to a hospital tank to try treating it and prevent any possible infection spreading.

Btw, i was at Arowana Avenue today and saw their dwarf rainbow fish tank. Noticed the water was stinky and alot of the fishes were in bad condition with some even had visible sores and cysts, along with a few dead ones were just left decomposing in the tank too. So i guess the fishes you bought from that tank probably aren't the healthiest from the start.

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## Ryan Peh

Swim bladder? Hmmm I see. Anything I can do about the one that I've isolated..?

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## Urban Aquaria

> Swim bladder? Hmmm I see. Anything I can do about the one that I've isolated..?


If its swim bladder issue, some people say just don't feed for a few days or feed unshelled pea (which is abit tricky to do), clean water conditions usually help them recover on their own too... but if its some other internal parasite or infection then have to watch for indications and treat with the corresponding medication.

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## Ryan Peh

Does neon dwarf rainbowfish gets a curved spine?? Cuz I notice it's spine is starting to curve... Anything I can do??

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## Urban Aquaria

> Does neon dwarf rainbowfish gets a curved spine?? Cuz I notice it's spine is starting to curve... Anything I can do??


Sounds like a genetic/growth issue or perhaps illness causing physical deformity to appear (ie. Fish Tuberculosis). I guess not much you can do... either just leave it be or cull it.

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## Ryan Peh

That's so sadddddddddd... 
But is there any reason why it happened? 
Like how can I prevent it from happening again?

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## Urban Aquaria

> That's so sadddddddddd... 
> But is there any reason why it happened? 
> Like how can I prevent it from happening again?


If its birth deformity then just a matter of picking healthier fishes... if its due to illness, then just have to check all new fishes closely before purchase (along with the overall tank conditions they are kept in at the LFS) and quarantine/treat the fishes before introduction into your main tank.

Like i mentioned in my earlier post, the tank conditions i saw those fishes living in at the LFS you bought from was really poor, that would greatly increase the chances of the fishes spreading infections and succumbing easily to illness, especially in a tank that is still cycling.

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## Ryan Peh

The dwarf neon rainbowfish died last night... 
I'm not gonna buy anymore of them if they keep dying off like that

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## aza

I'm sorry about your lost Ryan. The first few fishes are always the hardest. My worst lost happened to a little precious scarlet badis which got crushed on its second day while I was doing tank maintenance. 

The best thing about this hobby is learning what happened and reminding ourselves how to prevent another unwanted death.

Keep us updated on your tank conditions ya.

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## Ryan Peh

I added more gravels today and added a new driftwood! Which led me to digging up shrimp carcasses... 
The ammonia in my tank from the shrimp carcasses were probably the reason my neon dwarf rainbowfish were dying...

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## Ryan Peh

Hi guys! I think I sort of figured out the problem with my neon dwarf rainbowfish... 
The one swimming at the surface isn't suffering from too much ammonia.. Cuz I actually transferred all my rainbowfishes out from the bigger tank into my nano tank thinking I can keep the water cleaner for them.. But apparently the ammonia level was higher in the nano tank after I tested. 

I'm now thinking could it be that there isn't enough flow rate in the tank? Because the water only flows down at the left corner of the tank so that's where the bubbling are while the right side of the tank doesn't have much movements (although that's where the water overflows into the sump) 

Could it be that there's a lack of flow and causing the water to not be properly oxygenated??

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## Urban Aquaria

You could run an airstone to increase surface agitation and improve oxygenation, see if it helps... though its abit odd that oxygen levels in such a large tank volume could be depleted so quickly by just those few fishes. Either way its always better to generate more oxygenation rather than less.

Since its only one of the fishes showing such behavior, it'll be tough to draw much conclusions from it. If its really lack of oxygen, then all the other fishes will also be hanging out at the surface too.

Like what i mentioned earlier, it may not be due to your current tank issue, it could be due to the fish gills already being damaged in the LFS tank due to high ammonia levels in the retail tank, so its already weakened even before you even bought it. I guess the best you can do now is to maintain clean water conditions and hope it can eventually recover on its own.

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## Ryan Peh

Oh right......LOL okay I think I just made myself sound dumb for a moment...

I'm just trying really hard to find out what's wrong with that one neon dwarf rainbow hanging at the surface and the 3 that died before it... SIGH
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1445438062.883781.jpg

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## Urban Aquaria

Yeah, i would also be concerned seeing a fish constantly swimming at the water surface too. Try running an airstone and see if that improves the situation.

Anyways, you are not alone on this, i have also had my fair share of bringing home weak or sick fishes and having to find ways and means to try to cure them. Its all part of the learning experience.

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## Ryan Peh

Actually the other neon dwarf rainbows swim constantly swims around the area that the sump flows into the tank (where there is bubbling) 

How would an air stone work? Is that something I connect to an air pump? 

Or is it better if I get a wave maker?

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## Urban Aquaria

Yeah, an air stone system basically consists of an air pump + silicon air hose + air stone. Place the air stone in the tank and the fine air bubbles coming out will create additional water agitation to improve surface gas exchange.

Wave makers could help too, if you direct it to push water towards the top of the tank it can also generate surface agitation. Do note that small fishes and shrimps may get drawn into the wave maker impellers though, so you might need to factor that in.

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## Ryan Peh

Oh damn okay I think I'll just get an air stone! 
Do they come in a package? And how long are the air hoses?

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## Urban Aquaria

> Oh damn okay I think I'll just get an air stone! 
> Do they come in a package? And how long are the air hoses?


Most LFS sell all the parts separately, just mix and match them. 

Silicon air hose are usually packaged in large rolls. Buy a few meters of it and cut to the length you need for installation (they are cheap anyways, can keep the extra hose as spares).

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## Ryan Peh

Alright!! Hopefully that would help  
Thanks again UA!

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## Ryan Peh

Is it possible that dwarf neon rainbowfish need more oxygen in the water than my corydoras..? 
Another one died this morning and the other 2 are gasping at the surface while my corydoras are still at the bottom scavenging for food

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## Urban Aquaria

> Is it possible that dwarf neon rainbowfish need more oxygen in the water than my corydoras..? 
> Another one died this morning and the other 2 are gasping at the surface while my corydoras are still at the bottom scavenging for food


Its a possibility... corydoras can actually swim to the water surface and take gulps of air to store and use (they hold the air in their stomachs and the oxygen dissipates through the thin lining), thats how they can survive in lower oxygen environments.

If your 2 other rainbow fishes are gasping at the surface, then quickly run an air stone to improve oxygenation in the tank.

I still do find it abit odd that just 2-3 rainbow fish would encounter oxygen issues in a large volume 4ft tank (if thats really the case, then your tank setup will really need some adjustments to ensure sufficient oxygenation, especially since you plan to add even more fishes in the future), maybe also check your tanks ammonia and nitrite levels again just to make sure its not due to spikes in those parameters.

Btw, do you have any photos or video of the sump filtration and also the overflow section and the ouflow pipe? Just curious to see how how its setup and the possible tweaks that could be done.

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## Ryan Peh

Hmm alright I'll take a photo or a video of the entire water flow system when I'm free!

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## Ryan Peh

Hey so this is a few photos of the sump and where the water overflows!! 
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1445522806.585839.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1445522817.108730.jpgImageUploadedByTapatalk1445522886.638822.jpg

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## Ryan Peh

And here's a photo of the newly added air strip!! 
It's effective and it's pretty 
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1445522954.321183.jpg

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## Ryan Peh

Alright it's been a couple of hours but why is my neon dwarf rainbow still at the surface 

Also, I tested my ammonia and it's around 0-0.25ppm

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## Ryan Peh

Well looks like oxygen wasn't the issue...
Another one died this morning and the one at the surface is still at the surface. THATS 5 DEAD OF THE 6 I BOUGHT 

Is it cuz of ammonia??? Is 0.25ppm too much for them?? 
When I bought them from Arowana avenue, they still look rather lively and active. Why is it that they are only dying and swimming at the surface in my tank...

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## Urban Aquaria

Best to still run the air stone just in case. Btw, you can also run the air stone or air strip inside the sump tank too.

Seems like it could just be weak fishes that couldn't survive the transition, sometimes that happens. I have bought tetras from one LFS which died within a short time and then bought tetras from another LFS which lived on for the next 2+ years (both in the same tank conditions), so it could also be a batch issue.

As for your ammonia levels, you can do more frequent and larger water changes to help reduce it. Adding more fast growing plants or floating plants will also help to consume it too.

Do also check if your tap water itself has ammonia content too, because some place may exhibit this effect (especially those buildings with older water pipes and water tanks).

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## Ryan Peh

Just an update! My last dwarf neon rainbowfish has recovered and it's no longer Swimming at the surface! 
It's swimming around the rest of the angelfishes that I have! 
Looking to get more soon if not the fish look so sad being alone. But I'm still trying to find where has good quality neon rainbows... If y'all know where can find please let me know!!

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## tetrakid

Recently I saw some at Bishan Aquarium. Best to call and confirm before going there.

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## Ryan Peh

I'm LFS hopping now HAHA from Y618 down the red line to Toa Payoh. So might as well take a look there! 
Thanks btw!! Almost missed Bishan in my plan

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## Ryan Peh

Whoa amazing. I bought 5 neon rainbows today from Bishan Aquarium. They may not have the cleanest looking aquarium but their Neon dwarf rainbows were only $1 each!!! Let's hope they don't die this time

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