# Killies Import > Planted Tanks >  10 gallon UGF

## ruyle

Hi folks,
Thought I'd share my recent effort in planted tanks. This has just gravel
substrate and I'm using Flourish Excel, macros are KNO3, KH2PO4, and
traces with added iron, using the Estimative Index.





I'm getting 1-2 bigger tanks that will have CO2 injection (DIY, to start
out with) and hope to move some of these plants to them, like the E.
stellata which will quickly outgrow this little tank, providing of course, it doesn't die in the interim  :Opps:  

Compared to the SG guys planted tanks, this is certainly a "Freshman"
effort  :Laughing:   :Laughing:  

Bill

ps KL one downoi has sprouted in my wife's tank, a minor miracle considering it probably got frostbitten enroute! Hope to post a pic
when it grows out more.

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## erirku

Sorry to sound offensive, but aren't UGF bad for a planted tank? The plants need the mulm for root nutrients! And have it there takes up alot of room for the roots to grow. Just my opinion!

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## ruyle

Well, this is an experiment, and I have a problem in believing absolutisms.
Plus, this is not like the plate-style UGF, so the roots can grow all the way
to the bottom. And the mulm will not be drawn below a plate where it
doesn't benefit the roots. There's a guy on Barrreport.com that has posted
a pic of his UGF (pvc similar to this) who has quite a nice-looking tank. A
lot of Taiwanese tanks I've seen on the net use this kind of filtration. There's one site in particular that I wish I hadn't lost the URL to where I
could post it here. Who knows, I may not like it, and start with a new
setup. It is, after all, only a 10 gallon tank.  :Wink:  

Thanks for your opinion,

Bill

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## timebomb

I like your setup, Bill. Your aquascape doesn't look too bad. I'm sure everything will turn out nicely for you. 

Glad to know one of the Downoi's survived. Here's wishing you have lots of Downoi babies  :Smile: 

Loh K L

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## Piscesgirl

Looking very nice, Bill! I've heard of plenty of planted tank folks having UGF -- I'm sure it won't present a problem at all.

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## ruyle

KL and Deborah, after seeing pics of *your* tanks, you're being 
way too kind. Still, I hope the experiment is successful--I'll post more
pics if it grows in like I want.  :Wink:  KL, the Downoi has a better chance in 
my wife's tank, so we'll have to see how it goes, keeping my fingers crossed! 
Also, this 10 gallon is hers, now, too  :Wink:  

Bill

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## FC

I am a equipment craze, so, I can count on my opinions  :Wink:  .

Good UGF job! Bill. I have thought of this and put in my mind for my future planted tank, if I ever invest one. I hope you have drilled the holes at bottom side of those under-gravel tubes.

My idea is to allow slow flow of filtered (from canister filter) water to enter this same design UGF (but reverse flow). I would inject CO2 prior to that. This create 3 advantages:
1) Maximum filtration
2) Maximum CO2 dissolve rate
3) Acidify the gravel to stimulate the plant's root.

The UGF would take a few months for the gravel to collect enough mulms and mature with bacterias. Only then will the plants benifit from it. Keep the flow rate low, about 1 tank cycle an hour. For your tank (40 litres?), use 60 litres/hr pump.

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## RonWill

> Well, this is an experiment, and I have a problem in believing absolutisms


Don't worry over it, Bill. UG manifold, for normal or reverse flow, does work but I think you'll lose more CO² with that hang-on-tank overflow filter than with a sponge-ended powerhead (if RUGF).

Neat plumbing job and do keep us updated.

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## ruyle

> Good UGF job! Bill. I have thought of this and put in my mind for my future planted tank, if I ever invest one. I hope you have drilled the holes at bottom side of those under-gravel tubes.


I sawed grooves approximately 1/3 of the way through on the bottom,
Freddy. This is an idea I got from the Australian Cichlid site as trying to
drill holes (even with a drill press) is a total PITA.




> The UGF would take a few months for the gravel to collect enough mulms and mature with bacterias. Only then will the plants benifit from it. Keep the flow rate low, about 1 tank cycle an hour. For your tank (40 litres?), use 60 litres/hr pump.


The NANO back filter is 15 gph, nearly dead on to your recommendations.
I'll probably only use the Flourish Excel in this tank, so I may be going to
a small powerhead (RIO 50) about 4" off the substrate and use a spray
bar for the return, or go RFUG, dunno yet. I wanted something that is
hidden, but functional, which is why I went this route. If it doesn't work
out, back to the drawing board:-)

Bill

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## ruyle

> Don't worry over it, Bill. UG manifold, for normal or reverse flow, does work but I think you'll lose more CO² with that hang-on-tank overflow filter than with a sponge-ended powerhead (if RUGF).
> 
> Neat plumbing job and do keep us updated.


Thanks, Ronnie, I'll keep you all posted, however it goes. 


Bill

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## stormhawk

Hi Bill,

Great job with the UGF. I once had a UGF plate in my 1st attempt at a planted tank minus the base fertilizer layer. The plants loved the added water circulation around their root layer and proceeded to grow like weeds. I had great growth with my cheapo swordplants and even crypts loved it.

When I switched to a base-fert setup with ADA Aquasoil, I had very dismal results.  :Confused:

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## ruyle

> When I switched to a base-fert setup with ADA Aquasoil, I had very dismal results.


Jianyang,

There's people in the states that can't wait to use ADA products, thinking
that it will solve all their problems with planted tanks  :Rolling Eyes:  There's one
outfit in Texas, ADG (Aquarium Design Group) that is stocking ADA items.

Bill

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## stormhawk

:Laughing:  Well its not a cure-it-all. I can testify to that.

Other than that, Aquasoil's pretty good for acidic blackwater species. Other than that it doesn't do much for plant growth. The size of the granules? are rather large so it doesn't help in anchoring roots, especially if the depth is a little too low. It practically turns into a mud-like substance if crushed or pressurised. In fact it does turn into "mud" over time. 

Just a little press and them pellets can turn right into a cloudy mess. I think there's more than one fella out there who got really pissed when he/she tried to rinse the stuff.  :Confused: 

In short, overpriced and overhyped items.  :Rolling Eyes: 

I'm contemplating a switch back to the ol' UGF system but probably not at the moment.

Alas, you remember how people freak out when they see algae? I'm content seeing algae. They're part and parcel of a natural ecosystem.  :Laughing:

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## whuntley

I have long ignored the know-nothings who say a UGF isn't for planted tanks.

I have had both regular and reverse UGFs in some of my most lush planted tanks.

One of the most interesting used a stunt I learned from a Betta friend, some years ago. I had what is called a 15 High, which is a 10G footprint but 50% higher. Just like Bill's but 1.5 times taller. Great shape for some plants.

It had regular UGF plates, but I covered them with fiberglass woven material normally used for laying up boat hulls. This allowed use of a finer-than-normal substrate, without the sand falling through the slots. As I recall, the main substrate was Flourish over a layer of Schultz Aquatic Plant Soil (unwashed to not remove fines).

The unique aspect of this tank was total freedom from visible algae! I believe it was because I used Lew Heifner's trick and placed a 13W CF in the cabinet right under the tank, so the area under the filter plates was brightly illuminated. I had inefficient CO2 injection (via a porous glass diffuser) and regularly dosed with TMG and supplemental nitrates and phosphates. 

After a few weeks, the lower lamp, which was on 24/7, produced a thick, lush growth of algae where detritus would normally collect below the plates. The upper tank was illuminated by a 40W CF with a Silverlux reflector for about 14 hrs a day, as I recall. [It was far more light than any sensible planted tank ever needs.]

I had a good school of Lampeyes in the tank, and they revelled in the high oxygen levels produce by both plants and algae. They gave me lots and lots of eggs. They enjoyed the currents, too, from the Power heads used instead of an air lift to run the UGF.

Lew's half-baked theory behind putting a lamp under the tank was that you could encourage a growth of algae there (like a planted sump), get more oxygen into the return water, and discourage the growth of algae above, where the light was off for half the time and nutrients particularly needed by algae were already partially depleted.

It would require an under-tank fan in the SG climate to compensate partially for the 13W "heater" running full time. Nevertheless, I think this was one of the healthiest tanks I ever kept and suspect it is a concept worth some additional tinkering.

Wright

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## hobgoblin

Hi folks,

I started this hobby with my first tank using an internal filter by Rena. I thought that when I get myself an external filter, I will reach another stage in this hobby. To me, 'good' (branded) equipment equates better aquarium.

Well... not till I came to this forum. I am envious of the success you guys are having with simple DIY methods. Right now, I am enticed by Bill's UGF method.

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## ruyle

a, (could you tell us your name?)

This UGF is very easy and cheap to make and the NANO back filter is only
$7USD. Right now the tank has completely cleared to a clarity that it looks
like there's no water in the tank, just plants! Somewhere, I think maybe
in the killies forum I posted pics of this UGF filter. I'm trying to learn ways
to growing things that don't require a lot of store-bought items. In less
than 3 years I will have a job in Keang Nai, Thailand teaching school and
the stuff that's available in the US, won't be available over there  :Wink:  Also
AZOO has filters ready-made like this, but shaped in a serpentine.

Regards,

Bill

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## hobgoblin

I beg your pardon Bill. In my excitement, I forgot to sign off. 
Well 'a' is short for andrew, and i normally sign off as drew in the forums. 

Initially, well a few weeks ago in fact, I had intentions to buy an external filter. I changed my mind however, when I read of the Henri deBryun (http://www.killies.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=656) post. After all, the tanks in my possession 2ft and less. What else can be more enticing than the feel of satisfaction and achievement? 


Drew

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## ruyle

Drew,
Ronnie Lee has made several de Bruyn filters and could give you pointers
on what's available for their construction. He's one of the moderators and
you probably saw the pics of his filters in the thread I started.  :Smile:  

Regards,

Bill

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