# Other Aquarium Forums > Equipment and Accessories >  DIY CO2 System Aquarium Plant Kit CO2 Diffuser Generator

## bikersoy

excuse my English

I bought a kit at home to Co2.
Use citric acid + sodium bicarbonate, when mixed react and produce Co2.
With this system you can get more pressure and is stable in its production.

Can achieve high pressures necessary to use 1.8 bar CO2 atomizers.
Hope you like

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## dc88

How long does the mix last ?

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## seudzar

What is the ratio of critic acid to sodium bicarbonate ?

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## bikersoy

200gr sodium bicarbonate+200ml water
200gr citric acid+600ml water

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## bikersoy

I'm testing for spray work, we need a lot of pressure, the mixture is used almost only for this.
I'm hoping some glass diffusers for further testing
This is the official product page

http://www.51co2.com/web/

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## bikersoy

This is the duration according to the manufacturer

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## seudzar

Interesting....

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## heeroyu16

Another method in case you guys not aware, simple sugar and yeast (for making bread) mixture can produce co2 too.

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## seudzar

Tried yeast and sugar method before, it did not work that well for me.

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## bikersoy

> Another method in case you guys not aware, simple sugar and yeast (for making bread) mixture can produce co2 too.


This mixture is used but not stable in its production.
Is a biological reaction depends on the reproduction of the bacteria of yeast.
It takes a while to start production, has great production the first few days and then goes into a decline.

This chemical reaction is, in 5min this list and remains constant until the reactants are depleted.

I do not sell the product just seems odd to me to comment.
I use pressurized co2, so I have months of tranquility

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## felix_fx2

> Tried yeast and sugar method before, it did not work that well for me.


Bro, you only used yeast an sugar?
I failed too before, read up after that found many people try mixtures. Some use baking soda to stabilize the yeast... I tried the jello recipe with good results on low bps.

TS also just doing experiment and sharing.  :Smile:

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## seudzar

> Bro, you only used yeast an sugar?
> I failed too before, read up after that found many people try mixtures. Some use baking soda to stabilize the yeast... I tried the jello recipe with good results on low bps.
> 
> TS also just doing experiment and sharing.


Nope... i used yeast with baking soda and sugar. It did not really work that well for me. No problem, i understand TS is sharing too. cheers

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## chansl

i wonder if rice can be used with yeast .. I mean cooked rice .. currently i am using yeast with sugar .. tried but the pressure is not huge enough .. end up have to connect the mixture to the diffuser straight .. to produce minimal CO2

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## bikersoy

Check your bottle, home systems fail by leakage
That type of diffuser is using?

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## dc88

I have been exclusively using sugar and yeast and baking soda for a long long time for my main tank.
I use a super-size 3L plastic coke bottle. Took half a day to startup to get stable but last >2 weeks at 1 bps. I connect it to a spring-loaded one-way check valve and feed into a reactor. The spring-loaded one way valve allow some back pressure and give a very stable CO2 bubbling. 
I still have the empty pressurized cylinder lying around, too lazy to send for top up.
DIY top up at home (3 cups sugar, 1 tsp baking soda, 1/2 tsp yeast, fill with tap water) take only 10min. Do it at night the next day it already start bubbling.
The baking soda is to stablize the PH of the yeast culture and limit the yeast growth to a steady rate. The amount of yeast determine the bubbling rate. I find 1/2 tsp yeast is the best (produce ~1 bps) and last the longest.



If your DIY not successful 99% is due to the leakage at the cap connecting to the air tube.

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## ATM2013

I am planning to buy the D301 model of this, I think it is an upgrade of what you have. Anyway, I'm really happy that someone in the hobby did actually use this.

How is it doing so far?

How long did one solution last?

Thanks

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## bikersoy

If the new model is now available.
I bought it just as curious as I use pressurized CO2 cylinder
Other partners are using and it has made ​​some themselves
Aquarium Plant Kit CO2 Diffuser Generator

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## ATM2013

Thanks a lot for the reply.

I just went ahead and order a set of the new model.

It seems that is the next best thing to a pressurized system, not sure yet.

I will try to document, how it works when it arrives.

Nice Tanks by the way.

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## ken90ken

I'm worried about the stability of the CO2 production, and the pressure build up inside the bottle. 

Can someone explain to me how is this system more stable in production compared to yeast systems?

I find this very interesting and would like to use it for my tank as well!

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## ATM2013

I am not really sure if I am the right person to answer your inquiry. I will try to shed light on this system the best way possible. I did watch the video both from this site and to the manufacturer's site many times. Unfortunately, the video from the manufacturer's site is in Chinese. You are from Singapore maybe you can understand what the guy from the video is saying.

This is how I understand the process:

When acetic acid or vinegar is mixed with baking soda, it really gives a burst of CO2 in a very short time. I have seen some videos of this on some sites (I myself tried it in small amount), although the purpose is for planted green houses, to supplement the CO2 of their outdoor plants. No problem for their purpose. They just close the greenhouse and mix acetic acid and baking soda at a considerable amount and just let it circulate inside the the greenhouse. So I had this thought, if I could only capture the released CO2 in a container and release it slowly in a planted tank, it would be the best DIY CO2 setup for a planted tank. 

To make the long story short, I search the net and found a gadget that is being sold on the net that uses acetic acid and baking soda as a component. I got so interested, and started to search for reviews about the gadget and this is when I found the only site that has one.

Going back to the gadget specific. As seen in the video there are two containers both of which are 2 liters. The first one contain acetic acid or vinegar and the second one is the baking soda mix. In order for these two component to produce CO2 they need to mix together, this is done thru the tube connecting the two bottles. By releasing the needle valve the two component mix, when the needle valve is release gas is release in the environment coming from bottle B in effect letting the acetic acid from bottle A to siphon to bottle b, does mixing the two component and producing CO2. This process is done until the pressure gauge reads 1.4 or 1.5 Kg/cubic cm. Then the release valve is lock and no mixing of acetic acid and baking soda is possible so no production of CO2 but then you have enough CO2 in the bottle for you to release in in your tank. As you consume the CO2 in the bottle the pressure gauge reads lower and slowly acetic acid from bottle A slowly transfer to bottle B the baking soda, so increasing CO2 again as the CO2 builds up the transfer from the two bottle stops again. Thus, producing a continues source of CO2 until the components are gone. 

So, this is how I understand the system thru the video. I hope you will watch the manufacturer's video and also shed light on this gadget. Maybe you will understand it more, if you understand Chinese. Anyway, I am waiting for my order to arrive. And give more info once it is here and it put into use. Hope I did help somehow.

It seems, that there will be no problem with pressure build-up. I think what will be more of a problem is how long will it last. I hope it last for a reasonable time before mixing another set again.

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## ken90ken

I did order it 2 hours ago, thought i would try it out too! I do understand chinese but it isn't the best..  :Sad: 

Your explanation helped alot, i thought the same way but just wasn't sure at all on the pressure and siphon portion. Thanks for clearing it up!

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## ATM2013

Glad to help. Let us cross our fingers, wait for the item to arrive. Maybe you will be able to receive yours ahead of me. Hope to hear from you, how it works.

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## Hilde

> I did order it 2 hours ago, thought i would try it out too! I do understand chinese but it isn't the best.


In Ebay search for DIY CO2 system with CO2 pressure guage. With in lowest price the second seller has a video on it.

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## ken90ken

Just received my set yesterday!

Tried to set it up last night. Took ages to get it working.

On first try it was tough to understand how it worked. It was like a learn from your failure kinda thing to me.

So here are some pointers i derived from my findings:
1. Try not to use diffuser when pressure gauge below 1.5 as pressure not strong enough to consistently push CO2 out of the ceramic.
2. Try to dissolve more of the Sodium Bicarbonate because it settles down to the bottom of the bottle easily and the buried reagents can't react with much of the acid coming from bottle A.
3. Use a check valve. The liquid constantly tries to flow into the aquarium along with the CO2 gas.

Stuff to try out:
1. Substitute Sodium Bicarbonate with coral chips/gravel to increase reaction surface area thereby stabilizing production and prolonging the system as vinegar can now react with most of the base instead of being unable to react with the buried sodium bicarbonate and having to shake the bottle every now and then.

Material Cost:
2 litres of white vinegar - $4
400g of sodium bicarbonate - $1.80

System Maintainance Cost:
Each time you change the bottle contents, it will cost you $1.30. Refer to earlier post on how long set up will last you as it depends on your bubbling speed.


**Note: Information here is purely my finding, any inputs and constructive opinions will be greatly appreciated especially from anyone who has tried and tested this product. Please be nice!

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## ATM2013

Good to hear from you again.

Sad to hear that you had a hard time understanding and setting up the unit.

Thanks a lot for the pointer. I have a few questions. Can you really dissolve sodium bicarbonate with water? If the sodium bicarbonate settles down to the bottom, would it be advisable to lessen the water or let go of water entirely so that the vinegar can react more with it. Do you have a better understanding now why you should dissolve the the sodium bicarbonate with water, I really don't know why? About the coral chips, interesting but I really do not have any idea about it. If you could try one, maybe you could make this system into a better DIY-CO2 system. Would rate this system better than yeast DIY-CO2?

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## ken90ken

> Good to hear from you again.
> 
> Sad to hear that you had a hard time understanding and setting up the unit.
> 
> Thanks a lot for the pointer. I have a few questions. Can you really dissolve sodium bicarbonate with water? If the sodium bicarbonate settles down to the bottom, would it be advisable to lessen the water or let go of water entirely so that the vinegar can react more with it. Do you have a better understanding now why you should dissolve the the sodium bicarbonate with water, I really don't know why? About the coral chips, interesting but I really do not have any idea about it. If you could try one, maybe you could make this system into a better DIY-CO2 system. Would rate this system better than yeast DIY-CO2?


Sodium Bicarbonate is able to dissolve in water but definitely not 200g in 200ml of water. At most about 200g in 90 d celsius water. 

The reason i say to dissolve more of it is because sodium bicarbonate dissociates into Na+ and HCO3- ions in the water. H+ ions from the acid will react with HCO3- to form water and carbon dioxide. If you don't dissolve it in water, it can still react with the citric acid, but because most of your base reagent (sodium carbonate) sinks to the bottom, it is unavailable for reaction unless you shake/stir it up.

If you were to do this experiment in a pail, pouring vinegar into baking powder, you would notice the reaction would stop after a short time. Now, if you were to poke a hole into the center of the clump of baking powder that settled, the vinegar can now react with a little bit of the baking powder that's buried inside.

So in conclusion, the reason i would like to test out coral chips is because there is more surface area for a reaction to occur hence stabilizing reaction speed over time.

(I also don't think you should lessen the water as you want the reaction bi-product (sodium citrate) to dissolve in the water as well, so more of the baking powder can be accessed for reaction)

--Overall, I would rate this system better than yeast DIY CO2, as production is more stable, you can use a solenoid with this system (tested). 

It is however more dangerous as there is a chance of the bottles exploding, so i wouldn't recommend reusing the bottles more than a few times.

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## ken90ken

Sorry just noticed my mistake, 200g in 1L of 90 degree celsius water.. in the first line

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## ATM2013

Thanks for clarifying everything.

So, if I use 1 litter of water instead of 200 ml. the sodium bicarbonate would dissolve completely in water. Do I need shake the solution vigorously to dissolve the sodium bicarbonate? Where you able to try this your self? After some time does the sodium bicarbonate solution still needs stirring if I use 1L. of water? What is the volume of the vinegar?

I really like hear about the coral chips in the future.

Very happy to hear that is system is better than the yeast DIY-CO2 system. If you can use solenoid with this system, does it mean you could completely close the valve, let say at night when lights are close, in a way extending the life of the solutions?

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## ken90ken

> Thanks for clarifying everything.
> 
> So, if I use 1 litter of water instead of 200 ml. the sodium bicarbonate would dissolve completely in water. Do I need shake the solution vigorously to dissolve the sodium bicarbonate? Where you able to try this your self? After some time does the sodium bicarbonate solution still needs stirring if I use 1L. of water? What is the volume of the vinegar?
> 
> I really like hear about the coral chips in the future.
> 
> Very happy to hear that is system is better than the yeast DIY-CO2 system. If you can use solenoid with this system, does it mean you could completely close the valve, let say at night when lights are close, in a way extending the life of the solutions?


Yes, i did close the valve for 10 hours (overnight) to try. Pressure remained constant as explained by you in the previous page. This system is pressure driven. If the CO2 cannot escape, there is no decrease in pressure to drive the acid to enter the other bottle.

I realised something else now, as distilled white vinegar is only 5% acetic acid it is suggested to either use more of it or switch to citric acid.
Not only is the concentration a whole lot lesser, in a balanced chemical equation, more acetic acid is required to produce an equal amount of CO2 as compared to citric acid. 
If you do use vinegar, you can actually decrease the amount of baking powder you use, thereby being more cost effective.

I would propose that if you were to try citric acid, you can try modifying the formula such as:
150g citric acid in 800ml of water, and 200g baking powder in 400ml water.

Do note that you do not need all of the baking powder to dissolve, you just want to lower the depth of the sediments.

Important Note: I do not recommend that you use such a high amount of liquid as everything from bottle A will flow into bottle B. If the height of liquid in bottle B is too high, you might get yourself an unstable system.

**If you somehow manage to dissolve the sodium bicarbonate, which is highly unlikely as you would require constant heat and many hours of stirring. (Unless of course you have the equipment) It would be more potent, but still the best option is to find a way to continuously stir the contents inside bottle B.

Edit: I might get some coral chips to try tomorrow. I'm going to try using citric acid (aq) and coral chips with about 100ml of water. (No idea how much would water help because calcium citrate is practically insoluble.)

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## ATM2013

This system is really getting a lot interesting than expected, specially with you around.

Really appreciate the info again.

If I can get citric acid here locally in our city, I will also try it. But for now, when my unit arrive, the easiest is vinegar for me, it is a different kind of vinegar than the one you used. I could lessen the amount of sodium bicarbonate as you have suggested. I will adjust concentrations as I go along to find the best ratio for me. 

Exited to hear, what happen with the coral chips, I hope there will be significant improvement over the sodium bicarbonate. 

Thanks for sharing your trial results, though I hope there is a way for this system to maintain the 2 kg/cubic cm. pressure without shaking the sodium bicarbonate bottle, enough to drive diffuser.

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## ken90ken

> This system is really getting a lot interesting than expected, specially with you around.
> 
> Really appreciate the info again.
> 
> If I can get citric acid here locally in our city, I will also try it. But for now, when my unit arrive, the easiest is vinegar for me, it is a different kind of vinegar than the one you used. I could lessen the amount of sodium bicarbonate as you have suggested. I will adjust concentrations as I go along to find the best ratio for me. 
> 
> Exited to hear, what happen with the coral chips, I hope there will be significant improvement over the sodium bicarbonate. 
> 
> Thanks for sharing your trial results, though I hope there is a way for this system to maintain the 2 kg/cubic cm. pressure without shaking the sodium bicarbonate bottle, enough to drive diffuser.


If possible, and for safety and efficiency reasons, i would advise strongly against using a diffuser. 

I only used a diffuser initially to test if this system was pressurized enough to drive it. My apologies if this might've led anyone to think this system is compatible with a diffuser. The amount of pressure required is too dangerous for a plastic bottle to hold! (If you can find a stronger bottle that can handle greater pressure, this might be possible though.)

A diffuser isn't a very good way to diffuse CO2 in your tank compared to other methods. I am currently bubbling my CO2 straight from the outlet tube into the inlet of my canister filter. 
Other methods you can opt for when using DIY CO2 could be a bubble ladder, feeding into inlet of canister, feeding into outlet of canister by means of a CO2 reactor (can be bought from shop).

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## ken90ken

> If I can get citric acid here locally in our city, I will also try it. But for now, when my unit arrive, the easiest is vinegar for me, it is a different kind of vinegar than the one you used. I could lessen the amount of sodium bicarbonate as you have suggested. I will adjust concentrations as I go along to find the best ratio for me.


You can try sourcing for citric acid in your local supermarket. It has many food uses, ranging from baking, beverages, jams. There are other uses for it besides for consumption but i won't go into that.

If you're looking at the foods section, you can keep an eye out for sour salt. This is the common name for citric acid.

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## Hilde

> If you're looking at the foods section, you can keep an eye out for sour salt. This is the common name for citric acid.



Googling citric acid I found it is sold at Ace Hardware as Mrs. Wages® 5oz Citric Acid

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## ken90ken

> Googling citric acid I found it is sold at Ace Hardware as Mrs. Wages® 5oz Citric Acid


That's nice! Too bad we don't have Ace Hardware at singapore and philippines. If you're going to try it that's great though!

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## ATM2013

Actually we have Ace Hardware in the Philippines, particularly in our city. We'll see if they have one our branch.

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## ATM2013

*ken90ken*,

Any news on the coral chips trial?

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## ken90ken

> *ken90ken*,
> 
> Any news on the coral chips trial?


Nice that your have Ace Hardware at your location! I was too busy to get some coral chips to try it out. However, i'm reconsidering the idea as Calcium Carbonate may not be a good substitute chemically as it would produce less CO2 for the same amount of acid/vinegar used.

Have you received your set by the way?

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## ATM2013

Okay. Still waiting for my unit to arrive, so I would not be able to contribute any info. Although my tank is doing fine with the yeast DIY-CO2 for now, it has been running for 8 days now.

So, how is it doing so far with the sodium bicarbonate base system? Is it consistent up now? More or less, what is the average pressure that you get?

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## ken90ken

> Okay. Still waiting for my unit to arrive, so I would not be able to contribute any info. Although my tank is doing fine with the yeast DIY-CO2 for now, it has been running for 8 days now.
> 
> So, how is it doing so far with the sodium bicarbonate base system? Is it consistent up now? More or less, what is the average pressure that you get?


Yes it is still consistent but requires me to shake the bottle a few times a day. The pressure is for you to choose when you set up the system. 

> pressure = more dangerous, more stable system.
< pressure = safer, less stable system.

I notice that pressure does fluctuate when i close the outlet valve on this system overnight. It will either suffer a +/- 0.05 kg/cm3. (Not much effect on bps at the moment but might affect overtime.)

Before closing the valve, i suggest that you shake it up to prevent latent reaction in bottle B to prevent buildup of pressure when valve is closed. 
This shaking before closing of the valve would also help dissolve some contents in bottle B to prevent drop of pressure when valve is closed.

I suggest you buy a cheap air valve to open/close the valve manually at night if you want to. Tweaking the valve provided by the package is not recommended as the valve is not very sensitive and it took me 20 minutes in order to get my 1bps.

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## ATM2013

Very good info once again. I won't over do the pressure specially at night, I really do not want to have accidents. Maybe I could it at 1.5 Kg./cu. cm. Good to hear that it is stable.

I thought so, too. I don't mind shaking the bottle a few minutes before shutting the the valve at night. Very good suggestion on the additional valve for shutting it down. If it took you 20 mins. to tweak it at 1 bubble per second. It might even take longer for me to do that. I might as well prepare and buy the valve tomorrow. 

Do you think, that closing the unit at night will make unit eventually unuseable?

Anyway, I have learned a lot already even before the unit arrive. So, thanks for all the suggestions.

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## ken90ken

> Very good info once again. I won't over do the pressure specially at night, I really do not want to have accidents. Maybe I could it at 1.5 Kg./cu. cm. Good to hear that it is stable.
> 
> I thought so, too. I don't mind shaking the bottle a few minutes before shutting the the valve at night. Very good suggestion on the additional valve for shutting it down. If it took you 20 mins. to tweak it at 1 bubble per second. It might even take longer for me to do that. I might as well prepare and buy the valve tomorrow. 
> 
> Do you think, that closing the unit at night will make unit eventually unuseable?
> 
> Anyway, I have learned a lot already even before the unit arrive. So, thanks for all the suggestions.


The only disadvantage of closing the unit at night i can foresee is the pressure change that would occur maybe after a total of 3 nights shut off. 

This pressure change will affect your bps so you might have to tweak their needle valve to adjust to your desired speed again. 

There are 2 ways the fluctuating pressure can make your unit eventually unuseable. 

1. Pressure drops too low to siphon liquid from bottle A to bottle B. (For this to occur pressure must drop to 0)

2. Pressure goes too high. Bottle explodes. (Please make sure you use a strong plastic bottle, go to supermarket and try to squeeze bottle with your hands. You will notice some mineral water bottles can be pressed easily. Those cola bottles cannot press in so well. Try to aim for that.)

Both of these unlikely.. But if 1. occurs, just restart the system again without changing the contents of the bottles. No problem.

Usually the pressure will drop due to the sodium acetate and CO2 dissolving, or might have some very small leakage somewhere. The difference is barely noticeable in 1 night.

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## Maysara

Hello,

Ken or any other person knowledgable. I recently purchased this system, but after setting it up within a few mins nearly all the citric acid mix has gone to bottle B. is this normal? Does it mean i need to make the solution again. I thought it was supposed to last for 1 month? I've got the needle valve on the smallest opening so I'm not using too much co2 my drop checker shows a nice emerald green. What am I doing wrong? Please help i don't know who else to ask.

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## ken90ken

> Hello,
> 
> Ken or any other person knowledgable. I recently purchased this system, but after setting it up within a few mins nearly all the citric acid mix has gone to bottle B. is this normal? Does it mean i need to make the solution again. I thought it was supposed to last for 1 month? I've got the needle valve on the smallest opening so I'm not using too much co2 my drop checker shows a nice emerald green. What am I doing wrong? Please help i don't know who else to ask.


Hi, i have stopped using the system due to my current tank requirements but i'll share what i know.

Initially with the recipe given, and the start up requirements, this is normal. The way you squeeze and release the bottle/pressure definitely affects how much is mixed before the set up is ready, but this would not be much difference.

1 month is an huge overestimate as that value is most likely derived from the amount of gas it can potentially produce. In my own experience, the set up has only been able to stably last me 2 weeks.

If you would still want to try to reach for 1 month, you can try concentrating the reactants or increasing the set up volume. (i.e. double the amount of reactants and use a 2L bottle)

Another way is to introduce pressure through another method... Either chemically.. adding dry ice? Or mechanically.. use a pressure pump sprayer and modify it?

I've seen people use this system with a pressure pump sprayer but i've never tried it before.

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## Maysara

thank you for the quick reply it really helped. I realised the co2 tube was not tightly secured to the needle valve outlet with the screw. The English instructions aren't very good and as i am clueless i didn't realise how to secure it tightly, but I've figured it out now. 

I am new to fish keeping so my tank is only 63 litres ill see how long this mixture lasts in my tank. I may add more water than they suggest, as you have stated its better to add a bit more, but not too much as it may become unstable in a 2 litre bottle.

I'm not sure how to use the other methods you mentioned i would need an instructional video or images.

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## ken90ken

> thank you for the quick reply it really helped. I realised the co2 tube was not tightly secured to the needle valve outlet with the screw. The English instructions aren't very good and as i am clueless i didn't realise how to secure it tightly, but I've figured it out now. 
> 
> I am new to fish keeping so my tank is only 63 litres ill see how long this mixture lasts in my tank. I may add more water than they suggest, as you have stated its better to add a bit more, but not too much as it may become unstable in a 2 litre bottle.
> 
> I'm not sure how to use the other methods you mentioned i would need an instructional video or images.


No worries. Teflon tape if necessary  :Wink: 

I saw a video on a pressure sprayer, can't find it anywhere now though. From what i recall, basically substitute the 1.5L bottle B with that sprayer. Drill 2 holes into it, 1 leading to bottle A, another to your CO2 reactor or diffuser. 

When your mixes are in both bottles, ensure all valves are closed, then start pumping the sprayer until desired pressure.

Slowly tweak the needle valve, and there you have it.

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## Maysara

Interesting stuff ken thanks for the details!

is diy co2 safe around kids? What dangers are there i have small kids. I shold have thought about this before but was so eager to get started i simply forgot.

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## ken90ken

Pressure wise shouldn't be a problem, don't think they will be able to raise the pressure of the set up.

The only problem might be them opening the bottles and getting it on/in themselves? Since it's only common screw-cap bottles.. 

I have no idea though, i don't have kids! sorry!  :Confused:

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## dominikm

I have had this setup for a while now and found it reasonably cheap, clean and easy. I'm using two 1.25 soda bottles, with the chemical quantities reduced in proportion. At one bubble per second, it gives me around two and a half weeks of CO2.

I thought that I would share some pointers to make it easier for others: 


Use citric acid. Vinegar does not work nearly as well.Citric acid can be found reasonably cheaply in large quantities. I pay around $10 per kilo from a swimming pool chemicals supplier. A kilo lasts me 6 months and makes around 650g of CO2.You need to dissolve all of the citric acid.Sodium bicarbonate only needs a quick shake, it can remain piled up in the bottom and will dissolve as needed.I have a solenoid turning off the CO2 flow at night and have not had any issues or pressure build up.The soda bottles can easily hold 4kg/cm2 of pressure. They can even go up to more than 8kg/cm2 without exploding, but suffer structural damage and should be replaced.I found that I need about 25% more sodium bicarbonate than citric acid to fully use up the ingredients.If you seem to be using up the chemicals way too quickly, or if the pressure drops rapidly, check for leaks.The rate of the reaction can be controlled by varying the quantity of water initially added to the citric acid. The more water, the slower the pressure rise. If you find your bottle pressure slowly building up over time, then add more water next time. Or, if your pressure never seems to remain up, add less water.If I find my bottle pressure building up too high (usually towards the end of a cycle), I put the citric acid bottle down horizontally, so that the tube end is clear of the liquid. This allows the CO2 to leave the bottles without more being created.The needle valve supplied with the kit is basic at best. I ended up replacing mine.

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## ken90ken

> I have had this setup for a while now and found it reasonably cheap, clean and easy. I'm using two 1.25 soda bottles, with the chemical quantities reduced in proportion. At one bubble per second, it gives me around two and a half weeks of CO2.
> 
> I thought that I would share some pointers to make it easier for others: 
> 
> 
> Use citric acid. Vinegar does not work nearly as well.Citric acid can be found reasonably cheaply in large quantities. I pay around $10 per kilo from a swimming pool chemicals supplier. A kilo lasts me 6 months and makes around 650g of CO2.You need to dissolve all of the citric acid.Sodium bicarbonate only needs a quick shake, it can remain piled up in the bottom and will dissolve as needed.I have a solenoid turning off the CO2 flow at night and have not had any issues or pressure build up.The soda bottles can easily hold 4kg/cm2 of pressure. They can even go up to more than 8kg/cm2 without exploding, but suffer structural damage and should be replaced.I found that I need about 25% more sodium bicarbonate than citric acid to fully use up the ingredients.If you seem to be using up the chemicals way too quickly, or if the pressure drops rapidly, check for leaks.The rate of the reaction can be controlled by varying the quantity of water initially added to the citric acid. The more water, the slower the pressure rise. If you find your bottle pressure slowly building up over time, then add more water next time. Or, if your pressure never seems to remain up, add less water.If I find my bottle pressure building up too high (usually towards the end of a cycle), I put the citric acid bottle down horizontally, so that the tube end is clear of the liquid. This allows the CO2 to leave the bottles without more being created.The needle valve supplied with the kit is basic at best. I ended up replacing mine.


Very helpful pointers! Might go back to using mine soon after reading this!

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## Maysara

Hello

Can the yeast and a sugar method be used with this system? how all the yeast recipes seem to use one bottle for the mixture not two. So if i want to use yeast sugar and baking soda what mix goes in bottle a and what in bottle b please?

I'm disappointed with the citric acid method. Ie tried it several times it only lasts about a week if that. The assertion it could last a month in a 60 litre tank is far fetched.

The citric acid method is more expensive it seems because. Lot more is used 200g. yeast is usually 1 tspn or less. Sugar is about 200g but its not as xpensive S citric acid and bicarbonate mixed.

so please tell me way mixes to use in bottle a and b for the yeast method of co2 production please. I may as well give it a go before i decide to ditch this diy product, seems like a bad purchase.

Thank you once again ver helpful on this forum and polite too.

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## bikersoy

If only lasts a week check the system for leaks.
Hydrochloric acid can be used is cheaper and easy to find in supermarkets.You can use this system to produce co2 yeast, but if not repair the leak will not have co2 in the aquarium.

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## ken90ken

I'm not sure if you can really get hydrochloric acid (HCl) at your supermarket but, i would advise against it as it's highly acidic and anything above 5M in concentration will start to burn through plastic. 

I work in a lab and i am pretty sure it's a dangerous chemical. At 4 grams of HCl per 1000mL, it's already corrosive, and at that quantity, i doubt it would drive the reaction well.

I do hope someone can advise you on converting this to an yeast system, all the best!

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## bikersoy

Here you can find at any supermarket under the name Salfuman or etching.
a solution is not 100% Is a 25% solution
http://www.makro-haccp.com/es/data/e...ice/775333.pdf



If the system you want to use for yeast co2, simply put lebadura mix and sugar in the first container, for gas to generate pass to the second bottle, which only make the bubble counter function.



You can also put two bottles in parallel and generate more Co2

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## Maysara

thank you for your help.


I can't see any leaks i will double check. I have managed to set up the yeast method following a recipe online which claims to last 3 weeks. I've never used yeast, it did take 2 days to get bubbles, i was about to give up. It doesn't generate bubbles as fast, and it doesn't seem to create as much pressure. Also the bubbles are smaller than those created by the citric acid method. Turning the needle valve doesn't get the bubble counter going much faster either,guess to do with the lower pressure?

It seems messier too, its the yeast and sugar. Citric acid is cleaner, but i don't mind as long as it goes for a few weeks.

Failing that i will have to save up for a pressurised system. Are there any sold on ebay from china that are cheaper than versions in the uk? in the uk they can cost from £60.00 and more. My tank is small just 63 litres.

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## bikersoy

I recommend a pressurized system if you search find good prices
http://www.ebay.es/itm/Dual-Gauged-A...item4174aa79a5

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## bikersoy

here has different kits and prices
http://www.ebay.es/itm/Complete-DIY-...item3f1c3aced3

http://www.ebay.es/itm/Pro-DIY-CO2-s...item3f1c65ff1f

http://www.ebay.es/itm/DIY-Aquarium-...item3a82344564

http://www.ebay.es/itm/Pro-DIY-CO2-k...item5d3ef28b4c

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## Maysara

Thank you so much!

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## kimcheng123

I bought the system after reading the post.
The pressure is set to 1kg , 3 sec per bubble for 24 hours. 

IMG413.jpg IMG419.jpg

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## Emkay

It seems like a newer version with 304 stainless steel canister is now available. Anyone is using this?

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## Hilde

I think this product cost too much.

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## p0ip0i

This is something that i did,
i bought the following items,
1x DIY CO2 D301 Model at $27 sgd on ebay
1x WYIN CO2 Magnetic Solenoid Valve Low temperature Generator Dedicated 220v at ard $16
1x U shape Co2 Diffuser set around $5
2x bottle of 1.5litre cola bottle.
1x A bubble counter for $2
Phoon Huat Bicarbonate & Citric Acid. ard $10 (For 600grams each packet)

currently running on test at my room, just running 8hrs per day on/off using timer. So far so good.. No Increase of pressure of the bottle which i check every morning. 
this system like what above has stated, its only creating CO2 as it is needed. No Extra pressures. Might need to give it a shake alittle of the bottle to prime it again.
Oh ya, its been 3 days now..

So is it worth to diy or to get yourself a co2 regulator w/solenoid or canister?
i'm new here by this im spent around $50 excluding the ingredients.
or should i get myself a co2 system probably $200 +/-?
or a 2nd hand system $80-150?

Im sort of new to this hobby, but as i love to DIY stuffs. 
Probably in future ill get myself a system if this doesnt work well for me when time to come.

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## Emkay

> This is something that i did,
> i bought the following items,
> 1x DIY CO2 D301 Model at $27 sgd on ebay
> 1x WYIN CO2 Magnetic Solenoid Valve Low temperature Generator Dedicated 220v at ard $16
> 1x U shape Co2 Diffuser set around $5
> 2x bottle of 1.5litre cola bottle.
> 1x A bubble counter for $2
> Phoon Huat Bicarbonate & Citric Acid. ard $10 (For 600grams each packet)
> 
> ...


I got the D301 from eBay about USD15. No solenoid for me so I got the dymax nano co2 reactor from seaview at $6 .. and connect to a 2w submissable pump which is connected to timer. 

When the light and pump is running it will just circulate and dissolve co2 from the chamber. When light and pump is off, the chamber will just act as storage for generated co2. 

I adjusted my output to 1 bubble per 5 second so during the first few hours, the reactor will use mainly from the stored co2 in the chamber.




Sent from my GEM-703L

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