# Killies Import > Planted Tanks >  question regarding the water to be used for changes.

## louis_last

i am considering replacing 750ml from my 20l planted tank every day with bottled highland spring mineral water as the healthiest wild aquatic mosses i have seen are in natural springs and it seems that the added minerals may be beneficial for shrimp, however I want to make sure that this wont create unhealthy levels of dissolved minerals in such a small tank. 
the average quantities in mg/l of Highland Spring are  :Arrow:  

Ca -40.5
Mg -11.6
K -0.9
Na -9.4
Cl -8.1
SO4 (small 4) -6.4
NO3 (small 3) -2.4

T.D.S at 180c -158

Any advice would be greatly appreciated, the catchment area for the spring this water comes from has been certified by the organic soil association so it is very pure and filters for 15 years before being bottled but i don't want to accidentally kill my aquatic mosses due to an oversight.

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## FC

Hi Louis,

Is there any other reason that you are considering spring water? Is it that the water you have at home is too hard or something?

I do not have my reference table with me, I cannot be sure but it seems that the spring water is quite soft which is not a bad thing. The rest of the composites seems good to me.

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## louis_last

My tap water is ok, the only reason for me to do it is if there might be some benefit to my plants and shrimp.
I have since discovered that the pH of the bottled water is about 7.6, do you think that tannins from the bog wood, leaf litter and CO2 addition would be sufficient to cancel out this alkalinity?
cheers fc.

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## FC

Hi Loius,

The main reason for checking/monitor PH is to know the CO2 concentration in the water. I do not see a problem with the bottle water PH of 7.6. BTW, your spring water has hardness of about 2.5 dkH which is soft and good for most plants.

What is your water temperature?
Is there any problem in plant growth (slow?)?

I wish to share with you my little 25 litres tank ( I will post an update of this tank soon).


It is a low-tech tank whereby no CO2 is added. The water hardness is about 3 dkH. The water temperature is about 26~29 degree celcius. I add traces once a week. The light used is 18 watts (I used to have 11 watts) flourescene. I have moss on the wall, hair grass and glosso on the ground. There are about 15 shrimps and 5 fishes. the plants grow well and need trim once every 4~6 weeks.

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## louis_last

i like your tank freddy and would love to see an update, presumably that is christmas moss in the moss wall? it has a very healthy deep green colouration to it. very refreshing. How well is your dwarf hairgrass doing? and is that also hairgrass underneath the wood?
I intend to create a similar aquascape in my current tank by using a mixed Vesicularia ferriei and V. montagnai moss wall with Homalia sp., Barbula sp., Riccardia chamedryfolia and Fissidens fontanus on two driftwood pieces. I have been considering dwarf hairgrass on the substrate also But this will be my first proper planted aquarium with shrimp so it seems that there may be something to be said for keeping things simple. 
My tank will be around 22 degrees celcius with 22 watts of light provided by two small dennerle plant bulbs, a yeast reaction CO2 ladder and a daily drop of dennerle nano fertiliser. 
My reasons for keeping the temperature at the lower end of the scale is so that i might have a better chance of cultivating some of Scotlands native aquatic mosses and liverworts as I am fortunate enough to have a large waterfall running through my garden, from which several specimens seem to be growing well at the moment under 22 watts of lighting with CO2 so i am optimistic.

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## FC

Hi Louis,
Thanks for the kind comments. They are "Singapore" mosses.
The hairgrasses were dormant for the last nearly 3 months  :Sad:  , that is when I decided that the 11 watts lamp need upgrade. Since 2 weeks ago, I am using the new 18 watts lamp, the hairgrass response with slightly better growth. I guess it would need 4~8 weeks from now to form the lawn I have been waiting for :P .
There isn't any hairgrass underneath the wood, instead, the glossostigma filled the void.
Our administrator, Mr Loh KL (Timebomb), has a tank that filled with lots of shrimps and lots of breeding going on there. This tank has only one plant type, mosses (on the ground and woods). For some reason, I find shrimps look great and at home with mosses.

I agree that your tank should do well with the 22 watts of light (is it incandescent?) and the ladder diffuser works well here too. However, I think the 22 degrees celcius may be a little too low for metabolism. You will likely to experience slow but nice growth. In my opinion, the daily trace drop is an unnessary hassle/routine. In my observations, plants uptake of nutrient is more efficient when traces are at certain concentration and it is much higher than the daily drop's concentration. And in any case, plants do not need nutrients all the time (everyday) and they do store nutrients. With this in mind, I practice weekly routine.
I wish you success!  :Very Happy:

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## Robert

Hi Louis,
your temperature is ok. If you live in Scotland, your home will have about 18-23°C in winter I guess. It is possible to run a shrimp tank without a heater in normal heated room. Most of our dwarf shrimps come from subtropical regions like southern China, Taiwan, etc. and they don't need a constant temperature of 24°C or so. So 20°C would do and if it is more, OK. Caridina species do very well in temperatures of 15-25°C while Neocaridina species even survive very well 30°C. There is actually no need to heat your tank. Your plants will grow well, too. 

22W for a 20l tank is quite a lot of light. Your mosses will grow well but there will be algae, too. The yeast reaction CO2 is a bit unstable and can cause fluctuations of the pH. Your shrimps won't like it but probably survive it. For the mosses you don't need it. In a low light tank without extra CO2 you would have slower plant growth but less problems with algae.

If you live in Scotland and your tap water is free of additives, there is no need for extra bottled water. The soft tap water will do. You just have to add some liquid fertilizer for aquarium use (e.g. easy-life ProFito) for your plants. Half of the quoted amount will do. These fertilizers are safe for shrimps.

Here is an example of a low light tank without extra CO2:



Click on the link to get more information about the tank: http://flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3041120684/

best regards
Robert

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## louis_last

thank you for the advice Robert, your tank is impressive for a low tech aquarium, i'm sure i can see some Riccardia sp. on the left but it is not listed on your flickr page?
you may be interested to know that my tank is actually from Germany, it is one of the new Dennerle specialty shrimp and moss tanks, i have thus far been very impressed with the quality of Dennerle plants and equipment, it must be the notorious German craftsmanship. 
Have you ever seen the film Baader?

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## Robert

Hi Lous,
the liverwort-like plant on the left piece of dirft-wood is the Lomariopsis lineata fern prothalium. I had Riccardia growing in this tank but it's too small for such a large tank.

The new Dennerle tanks are nice. I own one, too. But it's the 10l version and I use a hang on the top filter and a custom-made 7W PL light. It's enough light for the tank. It's just a photo tank with some Anubias, fern, cryptos, E. tennelus, a downoi and Riccardia sp. ... 

Regarding the movie, I'm no big fan of cinema. I can count the films I've seen in the last view years on the fingers of one hand. I've not seen it.

Can you show us a picture of your tank? I'm interested in the layout.

My tank looks two months after set-up like this:



You will find more information about it here: http://flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/3089044889/

best regards
Robert

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## Viper007

> 


This is a low tech tank I would like to have too.. Care to share more pix on it??  :Smile:

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## FC

Viper,
You can find how I set up in:
http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...ad.php?t=50358

Last taken (Nov) before trim:


Last taken (Nov) after trim:


I had changed the scape few days ago using only hairgrass (the same Japanese hairgrass as above) and Narrow leaf Java fern. It looks promising, I think.

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## Viper007

Hi Fred,

Yup I have already read your setup early... But since then no new updates of your tank pix... That was why I ask you to post. Anyway, I like the overall tank looks.... I intent to build something like your's in the near future... Cheers  :Smile:

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