# Other Aquarium Forums > Fish Care, Nutrition and Water Management >  Where to buy freshwater copepods in Singapore?

## Griffith DreamWalker

Currently looking for freshwater copepods for my pipefish. Does anyone sell or know where to buy them from. Also, copepods and ostracods look similar, but are two different species.

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## AQMS

ooh you manage to find your pipefish,where di you get it?

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## Griffith DreamWalker

Got it some time ago from Arowanna Avenue. Stock long gone. The seller didn't know how to care for the pipefish. I suspect that majority died in the store. That's why I am searching for more to breed him. Plus more varieties of live food for him.

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## AQMS

Thanks... ..

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## marco

I have both seed shrimps and copepods

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## Griffith DreamWalker

I your tank I assume? Can I have some?  :Smile:

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## Urban Aquaria

I was at Arowana Avenue yesterday and spotted those freshwater pipe fishes in their retail shrimp tanks (they probably restocked them?)... i observed the pipe fishes happily chasing and snapping up all the tiny shrimplets (including shrimplets in the higher-grade CRS shrimp tanks, rather expensive meals), so i guess you could maybe look at starting a small breeding tank for low-grade cherry or malayan shrimps and generate a supply of shrimplets as live food for them.  :Very Happy:

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## AQMS

Thanks UA,going there today.... :Well done:

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## Griffith DreamWalker

Holy... THANKS BRO OTW NOW 

By the way guys. Don't put them(pipefish) with shrimps. I used to see CRS shrimp attacking them in Arowana Avenue. Also, when I placed it in my shrimp tank, the amano, cherry, neon green and tigers attempted to snack on it....

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## Bern C

You can feed them with Moina/Boon, which is available in LFS, Y618, C328, OTF, Seaview(weekends).

As for seed shrimp... most of the small fish don't eat them due to their hard shell. So better don't introduce seed shrimp to your tank as you gonna have trouble with seed shrimp boom if there's predator.

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## Griffith DreamWalker

I already feed them moina, I simply want a better diet for my pipefish as in the wild, their main food is copepods according to scientific studies.

I'll have to disagree with you on that point. I already have seed shrimps since the start of my nano tank(with shrimps only) and when I added mosquito rasaboras, they ate 90% of my ostracods. Later on I removed the rasaboras and the seed shrimps are repopulating which I am glad for as ostracods are scavengers and can get into small crevices to eat leftovers and rotting plants.(My shrimps can't get into the gravel to eat the mulm) Another fact is that before I knew about the moina, my single gulf pipefish was fed only seed shrimps. Just now I fed another batch of seed shrimps and the pipefish snapped it up right infront of my eyes.

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## Bern C

> I already feed them moina, I simply want a better diet for my pipefish as in the wild, their main food is copepods according to scientific studies.
> 
> I'll have to disagree with you on that point. I already have seed shrimps since the start of my nano tank(with shrimps only) and when I added mosquito rasaboras, they ate 90% of my ostracods. Later on I removed the rasaboras and the seed shrimps are repopulating which I am glad for as ostracods are scavengers and can get into small crevices to eat leftovers and rotting plants.(My shrimps can't get into the gravel to eat the mulm) Another fact is that before I knew about the moina, my single gulf pipefish was fed only seed shrimps. Just now I fed another batch of seed shrimps and the pipefish snapped it up right infront of my eyes.


XD I didnt know copepods has better diet than moina. Interesting... Better as in what content??

Hmm... that is strange... I having merah and mosquito in my shrimp tank too but they are not interested in them. Probably different sp of seed shrimp?? Mine is around 2mm in size. Even my guppy & endler spit it out. =_= My samurai gourami at 1st seem to be interested after tried biting and spitting.. XD they are lost interest in them.
Hmmm.. probably yours are smaller seed shrimp??

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## Griffith DreamWalker

I have heard that moina contains a lot of fiber and very little nutrional value unlike copepods, which are well rounded and can be found in the Gulf Pipefish(the type I keep) natural habitat.

My old guppies ate the 2mm sized ones too without care.  :Wink:  I have many sizes. From 0.5-2mm are all available in my tank. When given the chance the mosquito rasabora harassed and ate the 2mm one too. O - O Did you know my Amano shrimps don't discrimminate too? I've seen the Amanos eat live Brine Shrimp, 2mm Ostracods and Daphnia. The other shrimps prefer live brine shrimp though...

PS: Before you all get on my case, I feed my shrimps pellets, boiled egg, leaves, vegetables, live food(as a treat), frozen food and more that I can't remember. So.... yeah. Varied diet.

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## Bern C

> I have heard that moina contains a lot of fiber and very little nutrional value unlike copepods, which are well rounded and can be found in the Gulf Pipefish(the type I keep) natural habitat.
> 
> My old guppies ate the 2mm sized ones too without care.  I have many sizes. From 0.5-2mm are all available in my tank. When given the chance the mosquito rasabora harassed and ate the 2mm one too. O - O Did you know my Amano shrimps don't discrimminate too? I've seen the Amanos eat live Brine Shrimp, 2mm Ostracods and Daphnia. The other shrimps prefer live brine shrimp though...
> 
> PS: Before you all get on my case, I feed my shrimps pellets, boiled egg, leaves, vegetables, live food(as a treat), frozen food and more that I can't remember. So.... yeah. Varied diet.


Interesting... I only know that Moina has 60-70% proteins. Didn't know they has high fiber content. Wonder how's the copepod nutrition value are like. =/

 :Laughing:  That means my guppies, endlers, rasboras & amano are old man fish... don't like hard food. Amano are opportunistic scavenger... I saw my Amanos trying to prey on my sick rasbora merah before.

Mind sharing a picture of your seed shrimps? Kinda interested in the sp. Mine is whole white and black for the tiny one which is less than 1mm. 2 months back I got some new plants and found some seed shrimps while inspecting and cleaning it. The seed shrimps are really interesting as it's in shades of brown. Quite beautiful but decided not to keep them as I got bad experience of seed shrimp invasion.

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> InterestIng... I only know that Moina has 60-70% proteins. Didn't know they has high fiber content. Wonder how's the copepod nutrition value are like. =/
> 
>  That means my guppies, endlers, rasboras & amano are old man fish... don't like hard food. Amano are opportunistic scavenger... I saw my Amanos trying to prey on my sick rasbora merah before.
> 
> Mind sharing a picture of your seed shrimps? Kinda interested in the sp. Mine is whole white and black for the tiny one which is less than 1mm. 2 months back I got some new plants and found some seed shrimps while inspecting and cleaning it. The seed shrimps are really interesting as it's in shades of brown. Quite beautiful but decided not to keep them as I got bad experience of seed shrimp invasion.


Hmm, maybe I have mistaken it with the real daphnia species? Beacause many sites say not to feed to much daphnia lest your fish get diarrhoea and die. I'm not sure if they were referring to all Daphnia species or only certain types. Here, I also found some info on copepods. Check out this link for detailed information (scroll down for nutritional value) . http://www.fao.org/docrep/003/w3732e/w3732e0t.htm 

Indeed, it seems so. Currently the three I have are fighting over a piece of corn. Amano VS RCS- The battle of the night... or something ;D

No problem, I'll try to get a clear picture on all the different sizes of ostracods I have. The largest one I have is around 2.5-3mm and are super clingy. While a typical seed shrimp will run once I remove/touch the floating plant, the large ones will cling to the damned roots even if taken out of water. I have to shake or prod the seed shrimp gently due to this. Small ones(0.1-1mm) will hitch a ride on the SKL and the occasional Amano. 

PS: How do seed shrimps even invade a tank? That sounds strange...

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## Bern C

> Hmm, maybe I have mistaken it with the real daphnia species? Beacause many sites say not to feed to much daphnia lest your fish get diarrhoea and die. I'm not sure if they were referring to all Daphnia species or only certain types. Here, I also found some info on copepods. Check out this link for detailed information (scroll down for nutritional value) . http://www.fao.org/docrep/003/w3732e/w3732e0t.htm 
> 
> Indeed, it seems so. Currently the three I have are fighting over a piece of corn. Amano VS RCS- The battle of the night... or something ;D
> 
> No problem, I'll try to get a clear picture on all the different sizes of ostracods I have. The largest one I have is around 2.5-3mm and are super clingy. While a typical seed shrimp will run once I remove/touch the floating plant, the large ones will cling to the damned roots even if taken out of water. I have to shake or prod the seed shrimp gently due to this. Small ones(0.1-1mm) will hitch a ride on the SKL and the occasional Amano. 
> 
> PS: How do seed shrimps even invade a tank? That sounds strange...


Interesting articles... Copepods and daphnia protein content probably around the same or daphnia might have slightly higher protein which also depends on the homogoblin too. Copepods have higher fatty acid compare to daphnia but not sure if it's both saltwater and freshwater sp. or just saltwater sp. Both are good food. So far I haven't come across bigger freshwater copepods. They are usually less than 2mm. As of Daphnia sp., Monia and daphnia is from different family. Moina seem to be hardier than daphnia and probably can produce more homogoblins to survive in oxygen depleted water.

No sure about the diarrhea. I have been feeding my fishes with daphnia daily, haven't encounter any problem.

A reason why I wanna get rid of ostracod is not just unsighty but also at times they are clinging on my shrimp's tail. My shrimps will try to shake it off. 

For the tank, it probably accidentally introduced from the new plants in the past. But what puzzle me is that my daphnia culture got invaded by tiny seed shrimps even I have taken extra precious after learning from my past mistakes. I have tools for daphnia only. I also sanitized my tank whenever I start a new culture. But when the detritus build up, seed shrimp will starts to appear. I suspect is the tap water or something... Still trying to find out. But usually it will take like months and really lot of detritus build up then seed shrimp will appear. Once appear... I gotta reset my culture again. @[email protected] But another thing puzzle me is that, some culture even after months... no seed shrimps.. So kinda confused... still figuring out. =/

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## Griffith DreamWalker

First picture is ostracods of 2mm-3mm on Marimo.
Second picture is of a nice batch of seed shrimps of various sizes on frogbit.(They're eating the plant roots, if you all are wondering)

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## Griffith DreamWalker

But are the seed shrimps hurting your inverts? I've never seen the large ostracods clinging on my shrimps before. Only the tiny 0.1-0.5mm will cling for a few seconds before scuttling off into the gravel.


Maybe there were always seed shrimps in some batches, just that there were too little to be spotted until there is too much leftovers and the ostracods multiply till visible? I've heard such cases happening with other cultures... Like unwanted stuff appearing once there's an increase in food/ detritus. So do you have any seed shrimps that you can take pics of? Your seed shrimp colors seem interesting.

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## Bern C

> But are the seed shrimps hurting your inverts? I've never seen the large ostracods clinging on my shrimps before. Only the tiny 0.1-0.5mm will cling for a few seconds before scuttling off into the gravel.
> 
> 
> Maybe there were always seed shrimps in some batches, just that there were too little to be spotted until there is too much leftovers and the ostracods multiply till visible? I've heard such cases happening with other cultures... Like unwanted stuff appearing once there's an increase in food/ detritus. So do you have any seed shrimps that you can take pics of? Your seed shrimp colors seem interesting.


Hmm... yours and mine look like similar sp.. For my less than 1mm one which are rounder and black or dark brown.






Strange... >_< I have few batches of guppies and endlers but none eat seed shrimp. I am surprise that your mosquito rasbora eat seed shrimp. Interesting...

I doubt my shrimps got hurts. They looks uncomfortable with seed shrimp clinging on their tails and trying to shake it off.

Hmmm... I don't think so... I always sterilized my tank before I start a new culture. I dose chlorine bleach and hot water to sterilize. Then I netted and rinse the daphnia before adding to the new tank. The new tank using filtered tab water. Still find out the source. @[email protected] It don't happen to all culture but kinda random that some culture will have ostracod pop out.

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## Griffith DreamWalker

Maybe ours are the same species as they sound similar. 

My larger seed shrimps don't bother the shrimps at all (maybe its due to the fact that the other shrimps will eat them once bothered ?) My shrimps and snails are all pretty indiscrimminate, just like this saying," After some time, pets will take after their owners or owners will take after their pets." If you ask me, I'll say its a bit of both.  :Wink:  I've seen my baby shrimplets of 0.5cm fight over food with a 2 inch Amano and win. They're all like that. Daddy's so proud of 'em. :Well done:  :Cool: 

Yeah what I mean is that in the batch of daphnia you net out, there are already a few (lets say 2-10 daphnia) in the starter you're taking from, so when you start the culture and things turn out bad once you're unlucky...

Do you culture Daphnia or Moina anyways? What is the size of the tank, if you don't mind sharing.

PS: Does anyone else know where to get copepods from? Still looking for a good price that isn't above $5... @[email protected]

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## Bern C

> Maybe ours are the same species as they sound similar. 
> 
> My larger seed shrimps don't bother the shrimps at all (maybe its due to the fact that the other shrimps will eat them once bothered ?) My shrimps and snails are all pretty indiscrimminate, just like this saying," After some time, pets will take after their owners or owners will take after their pets." If you ask me, I'll say its a bit of both.  I've seen my baby shrimplets of 0.5cm fight over food with a 2 inch Amano and win. They're all like that. Daddy's so proud of 'em.
> 
> Yeah what I mean is that in the batch of daphnia you net out, there are already a few (lets say 2-10 daphnia) in the starter you're taking from, so when you start the culture and things turn out bad once you're unlucky...
> 
> Do you culture Daphnia or Moina anyways? What is the size of the tank, if you don't mind sharing.
> 
> PS: Does anyone else know where to get copepods from? Still looking for a good price that isn't above $5... @[email protected]


XD Same sp. but different behaviors spotted. Interesting...

Hmmm... Unless those ostracods or resting eggs have the ability to cling on the daphnia else I think the possibility is quite low. I only net out the adults(mid-large size) for the new culture. I have 2 size of sieve, 1st sieve will filter out the 3-4mm adults while 2nd will filter out the 2-3mm. After netting them out, I will inspect for any visible contamination then rinse it and do a last inspection.
I used to have copepods invasion in my culture too, but solved the problem as the source is highly possible from a pond sample which I used to culture green water or another possibility is from the infusoria.

I culturing both. Now more of Daphnia Pulex than Moina. Moina is just a small culture to feed my rasbora, 1-2L jar. For Daphnia, will be 2g tanks and 2L containers. For more info, you can refer to this thread, http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum/showthread.php/120375-Which-LFS-still-selling-live-daphnia-aka-boon

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> XD Same sp. but different behaviors spotted. Interesting...
> 
> Hmmm... Unless those ostracods or resting eggs have the ability to cling on the daphnia else I think the possibility is quite low. I only net out the adults(mid-large size) for the new culture. I have 2 size of sieve, 1st sieve will filter out the 3-4mm adults while 2nd will filter out the 2-3mm. After netting them out, I will inspect for any visible contamination then rinse it and do a last inspection.
> I used to have copepods invasion in my culture too, but solved the problem as the source is highly possible from a pond sample which I used to culture green water or another possibility is from the infusoria.
> 
> I culturing both. Now more of Daphnia Pulex than Moina. Moina is just a small culture to feed my rasbora, 1-2L jar. For Daphnia, will be 2g tanks and 2L containers. For more info, you can refer to this thread, http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum/showthread.php/120375-Which-LFS-still-selling-live-daphnia-aka-boon


Then that's pretty strange... Also thanks for the information  :Wink:  I'll probably culture Moina only when I can start a successfull greenwater culture.

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## Bern C

> Then that's pretty strange... Also thanks for the information  I'll probably culture Moina only when I can start a successfull greenwater culture.


Yeah.. @[email protected] Still trying to figure out the source. Trying to keep my setup as simple as possible to find out the source. No problem, anyway thanks for sharing your experience.

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> Yeah.. @[email protected] Still trying to figure out the source. Trying to keep my setup as simple as possible to find out the source. No problem, anyway thanks for sharing your experience.


One last thing, if you ever get invaded by copepods, I'll be willing to take them off your hands... or tank.  :Smile: 
Where's the pond that produces green water in SG anyways if you're willing to share?

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## Bern C

> One last thing, if you ever get invaded by copepods, I'll be willing to take them off your hands... or tank. 
> Where's the pond that produces green water in SG anyways if you're willing to share?


I haven't see them appearing in my cultures for months. Maybe you can try hay infusion or soil infusion, there is a chance you might get some copepods. My walstads tank had a lots but I had decomm it. Or you can try pond water. Just leave the pond water in a bottle(can be airtight). I collected water from toa payoh town garden and the park beside kk hospital. Copepods did appear after weeks. XD I can't guarantee above method with 100% success. For the pond water, I collected 4times and 2times copepods did appear.
As for the pond that produce green water... It's more of greenish brown instead of green. I just trying to see if I can culture some phytoplankton out of the pond sample. Well.. the result isn't good. XD shifu fireblade's green water is the best. Miss his green water. I still trying to figure out ways to culture green water too.

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> I haven't see them appearing in my cultures for months. Maybe you can try hay infusion or soil infusion, there is a chance you might get some copepods. My walstads tank had a lots but I had decomm it. Or you can try pond water. Just leave the pond water in a bottle(can be airtight). I collected water from toa payoh town garden and the park beside kk hospital. Copepods did appear after weeks. XD I can't guarantee above method with 100% success. For the pond water, I collected 4times and 2times copepods did appear.
> As for the pond that produce green water... It's more of greenish brown instead of green. I just trying to see if I can culture some phytoplankton out of the pond sample. Well.. the result isn't good. XD shifu fireblade's green water is the best. Miss his green water. I still trying to figure out ways to culture green water too.


I'm currently trying out dried lawn clippings but so far its been producing some strange, spidery web layer on the water surface and blurry water for the past three days. Also soil infusion uses plain, unfertilised soil right?

I have heard about a method of culturing green water whch simply uses tank water in an airtight container and facing the sun. After a few weeks, it should start to turn green. I too believe this is true as I went down to a fish shop and saw them selling bags of bettas living in a nicely colored green water. Pity the betta, but in love with the green water. Apparently shop keeper said they didn't change water therefore the suspended algae. Some crazy magic water they got there to produce such nice green water....  :Wink:

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## Bern C

> I'm currently trying out dried lawn clippings but so far its been producing some strange, spidery web layer on the water surface and blurry water for the past three days. Also soil infusion uses plain, unfertilised soil right?
> 
> I have heard about a method of culturing green water whch simply uses tank water in an airtight container and facing the sun. After a few weeks, it should start to turn green. I too believe this is true as I went down to a fish shop and saw them selling bags of bettas living in a nicely colored green water. Pity the betta, but in love with the green water. Apparently shop keeper said they didn't change water therefore the suspended algae. Some crazy magic water they got there to produce such nice green water....


Those should be fungus and bacteria. The problem with hay infusion will be the smell. It can smell like garbage. Try not to add too much hay. If the infusion is too strong, then dilute it. As for soil, I am using organic potting mix.

Yup, it can be simple but that only works for small culture. Also I am not sure if I don't have luck in it, I hardly can get pea green kinda green water. So I think thinks it only works to a certain extend. Still exploring...

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> Those should be fungus and bacteria. The problem with hay infusion wilI be the smell. It can smell like garbage. Try not to add too much hay. If the infusion is too strong, then dilute it. As for soil, I am using organic potting mix.
> 
> Yup, it can be simple but that only works for small culture. Also I am not sure if I don't have luck in it, I hardly can get pea green kinda green water. So I think thinks it only works to a certain extend. Still exploring...


That makes sense. It really does smell like garbage too. I've tossed away a batch as the thing stank to high heavens and decided to simply try out the method of leaving a jar of tank water in bright sunlight. This is a rather small jar so hopefully once it works out, I can start seeding other bottles to get a constant supply of green water. 

Maybe starting a small culture and then using this 'starter' culture to seed other tanks/containers? I've seen tanks of healthy goldfish purposely kept in green water tanks to promote good growth. You can apparently do the same with 5G tubs/buckets if the fish is healthy and there's plenty of sunlight.

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## fireblade

I heard my name being mentioned.. :P...
my nice green water tank is gone... 
but I got another tank of green water with angels :P

my shrimps tank also suddenly boom alot of seed shrimp... damn ugly... sian..
throw in mosquito rasaboras, the seed shrimp disappear overnight.. and when I removed the mosquito rasaboras, the seed shrimp reappears again...
wonder if pygmy cory will eat that or not and also will they eat my shrimplets...



Bern C, show you something....
anyone interested to collect?

green water fall in.. :P

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## Bern C

> That makes sense. It really does smell like garbage too. I've tossed away a batch as the thing stank to high heavens and decided to simply try out the method of leaving a jar of tank water in bright sunlight. This is a rather small jar so hopefully once it works out, I can start seeding other bottles to get a constant supply of green water. 
> 
> Maybe starting a small culture and then using this 'starter' culture to seed other tanks/containers? I've seen tanks of healthy goldfish purposely kept in green water tanks to promote good growth. You can apparently do the same with 5G tubs/buckets if the fish is healthy and there's plenty of sunlight.


But for large culture, best is to have aeration, else the phytoplankton will congregate in one area. Also if lack of CO2 and sunlight, it will turn brown and culture die off. Didn't water parameter and nutrients will yield different kind of phytoplankton and algae.
The airtight container I have encountered culture starts to turn brown. The best is like shifu fireblade, able to maintain a few tanks of green water.





> I heard my name being mentioned.. :P...
> my nice green water tank is gone... 
> but I got another tank of green water with angels :P
> 
> my shrimps tank also suddenly boom alot of seed shrimp... damn ugly... sian..
> throw in mosquito rasaboras, the seed shrimp disappear overnight.. and when I removed the mosquito rasaboras, the seed shrimp reappears again...
> wonder if pygmy cory will eat that or not and also will they eat my shrimplets...
> 
> 
> ...


WOW!!!!!! You have stock up your new batch of green water!!!!! XD But I haven't stock up new batch of Daphnia @[email protected] few weeks back restarted my cultures and still growing the culture. Will let you know again when I have stock up my Daphnia.

>_< Why all my fishes don't eat seed shrimps. I only can remove them manually to reduce the population. I never see my mosquito eat seed shrimps but they go for smaller preys like copepods and dero worms. Until lack of copepods in the tank then they learn to eat dry food. But if they able to eat seed shrimps, isn't that means that they're able or might eat shrimplets?
I thinking of getting some cory to fight the seed shrimps after I shift my shrimps to new tank. @[email protected] I super anti-seed shrimps now!! btw your seed shrimps same sp. as ours, the white 2mm seed shrimp?? Yeah cory should be a better choice if they do eat them as they will dig out the seed shrimps hiding in the substrate.

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## fireblade

not sure if it same species...
this is the best I can get..

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> But for large culture, best is to have aeration, else the phytoplankton will congregate in one area. Also if lack of CO2 and sunlight, it will turn brown and culture die off. Didn't water parameter and nutrients will yield different kind of phytoplankton and algae.The airtight container I have encountered culture starts to turn brown. The best is like shifu fireblade, able to maintain a few tanks of green water.
> 
> >_< Why all my fishes don't eat seed shrimps. I only can remove them manually to reduce the population. I never see my mosquito eat seed shrimps but they go for smaller preys like copepods and dero worms. Until lack of copepods in the tank then they learn to eat dry food. But if they able to eat seed shrimps, isn't that means that they're able or might eat shrimplets?


Maybe that'll happen, but from what I've read and seen online people will maintain a few 1.5L bottles of green water and start a new culture every 2-3 days as to prevent crashing and to ensure fresh bottles of green water for their culture every alternate day. I plan to do that instead of using a tank to culture the green water actually. Also, is C02 really necessary? Online stuff and vids always say that using fertilizer (like Miracle Gro) helps green water reproduce faster. The aeration for bottle can probably be done by cutting holes and using the air line to pump in air through from what I've seen.

Bad luck bro, my mosquito rasaboras eat everything (from egg yolk to ostracods) but they like bullying my RCS. I used to see one of them nip the shrimp's tail and try to drag it (somewhere? ) but the adult RCS is like D: and runs away. All other fishes, no matter the size, will eat shrimplets. Apparently the only one that doesn't is the Oto, but that fish only eat algae anyways (and is too fragile).



> I heard my name being mentioned.. :P...
> my nice green water tank is gone...
> but I got another tank of green water with angels :P
> 
> my shrimps tank also suddenly boom alot of seed shrimp... damn ugly... sian..
> throw in mosquito rasaboras, the seed shrimp disappear overnight.. and when I removed the mosquito rasaboras, the seed shrimp reappears again...
> wonder if pygmy cory will eat that or not and also will they eat my shrimplets...
> 
> 
> ...


I doubt that pygmy cories will be that effective in eating seed shrimps as they are bottom feeders while the seed shrimp will literally run all around your tank (s).

Also, very nice batch of green water you got there. How do you maintain your green water if you don't mind sharing?  :Wink:  Do you also maintain your green water with C02 and light like Bern C says? (Is the C02 D.I.Y or storebought if you use it?)

By the way, can I have some of your green water stock? I'm culturing some Moina here
PS: That's the same species as Bern and me you've got there. I wish I could suck up all the seed shrimps and bring them back for my pipefishes. They love seed shrimps. :Grin: (And so do I)

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## Bern C

> not sure if it same species...
> this is the best I can get..


XD Hard to tell... probably it's the same sp.. Your tank wall has thick algae for them cling. Same happened to 1 of my tank but after cleaning away the algae they usually stay at the substrate savaging or swimming around. Hmm.. I was thinking is it due to the calcium in the water that cause my seed shrimp shell to be so hard that my small fishes avoid? I maintain my GH at 7-8.




> Maybe that'll happen, but from what I've read and seen online people will maintain a few 1.5L bottles of green water and start a new culture every 2-3 days as to prevent crashing and to ensure fresh bottles of green water for their culture every alternate day. I plan to do that instead of using a tank to culture the green water actually. Also, is C02 really necessary? Online stuff and vids always say that using fertilizer (like Miracle Gro) helps green water reproduce faster. The aeration for bottle can probably be done by cutting holes and using the air line to pump in air through from what I've seen.
> 
> Bad luck bro, my mosquito rasaboras eat everything (from egg yolk to ostracods) but they like bullying my RCS. I used to see one of them nip the shrimp's tail and try to drag it (somewhere? ) but the adult RCS is like D: and runs away. All other fishes, no matter the size, will eat shrimplets. Apparently the only one that doesn't is the Oto, but that fish only eat algae anyways (and is too fragile).


As for small bottle culture, you required to manual aerate it by giving it a shake daily or couple of time a day. For 1.5l bottle, it's better to have aeration unless you don't mind brownish green culture. It's really hard to get pea soup kinda of culture. It also gotta take a week or more to harvest the culture. Yup.. like plants, CO2 will helps to promote their growth. They do respire too.
I only stick to 500ml bottles to culture green water. Also, if you are not using aeration, i find that it's best to place the bottle horizontally so to have larger surface area.

XD It's also good that my small fish are not interested in seed shrimp so I don't have to worry about them eating my shrimplet. I not sure about my guppies and endlers but my rasbora will leave the new born shrimplets alone and have no interest in them even they swim by. As for adult, endlers at times are just curious about the adult shrimps but never see my guppy or endler attack the shrimp before.
Yeah.. Oto is sensitive... Initially I lost 2 of them as my tank isn't mature enough and I realized my mistake of picking unhappy otos from LFS. XD It's best to pick those with a round belly.

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## fireblade

really can't stand the sight of the seed shrimps.. so off I went to C328...

yesterday after I throw in the fish (Sundadanio axelrodi)..

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## fireblade

video taken this morning.. think all seed shrimps went into hiding...

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> As for small bottle culture, you required to manual aerate it by giving it a shake daily or couple of time a day. For 1.5l bottle, it's better to have aeration unless you don't mind brownish green culture. It's really hard to get pea soup kinda of culture. It also gotta take a week or more to harvest the culture. Yup.. like plants, CO2 will helps to promote their growth. They do respire too.
> I only stick to 500ml bottles to culture green water. Also, if you are not using aeration, i find that it's best to place the bottle horizontally so to have larger surface area.
> 
> XD It's also good that my small fish are not interested in seed shrimp so I don't have to worry about them eating my shrimplet. I not sure about my guppies and endlers but my rasbora will leave the new born shrimplets alone and have no interest in them even they swim by. As for adult, endlers at times are just curious about the adult shrimps but never see my guppy or endler attack the shrimp before.
> Yeah.. Oto is sensitive... Initially I lost 2 of them as my tank isn't mature enough and I realized my mistake of picking unhappy otos from LFS. XD It's best to pick those with a round belly.


Hm, but C02 is too troublesome for me. I think I'll stick to fertilizer. I've seen an online vid with a guy maintaining a few bottles of pea soup/emerald green water in 1.5L bottkes with lighting and an air pump. It worked out pretty well for him if you ask me. @[email protected]

Lucky you. My old Neon Tetras, Endlers and Guppies love chasing and eating shrimplets. I lost ten overnight when I added the fish in.




> video taken this morning.. think all seed shrimps went into hiding...


I doubt the seed shrimp'll all be gone though. Once the fish is gone the ostracods will return. Also, your tank has alot of algae- you don't use otos or nerite snails?

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## fireblade

> I doubt that pygmy cories will be that effective in eating seed shrimps as they are bottom feeders while the seed shrimp will literally run all around your tank (s).
> 
> Also, very nice batch of green water you got there. How do you maintain your green water if you don't mind sharing?  Do you also maintain your green water with C02 and light like Bern C says? (Is the C02 D.I.Y or storebought if you use it?)
> 
> By the way, can I have some of your green water stock? I'm culturing some Moina here
> PS: That's the same species as Bern and me you've got there. I wish I could suck up all the seed shrimps and bring them back for my pipefishes. They love seed shrimps.(And so do I)


look at my video... all seed shrimps think went hiding in the gravels.. so cories might be able to do the job hopefully...

As for green water, I do not have any secret... it comes from my angel fish bare bottom 2 feet tank.. maybe light and high bio load create the green water, filter is sponge filter. maybe the o2 from sponge filter helps...think most important is light, the tank is just next to the window and then my lights is on from 6pm to 12am, so maybe long hours of light. no CO2 for this tank

you are welcome to collect the green water from my corridor.. I leave it outside to water my land plants...

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> look at my video... all seed shrimps think went hiding in the gravels.. so cories might be able to do the job hopefully...
> 
> As for green water, I do not have any secret... it comes from my angel fish bare bottom 2 feet tank.. maybe light and high bio load create the green water, filter is sponge filter. maybe the o2 from sponge filter helps...think most important is light, the tank is just next to the window and then my lights is on from 6pm to 12am, so maybe long hours of light. no CO2 for this tank
> 
> you are welcome to collect the green water from my corridor.. I leave it outside to water my land plants...


But there's always a chance of 1-2 ostracods left unless you leave the fish in the tank permanently. 

I suspect its the high lighting plus bioload from your angels. People also use goldfish to produce a nice green water in tanks/bucket/tub for their cultures. Very long hours of light too seems to help culturing green water.


Where do you live & when can I collect anyways? Do I just bring my own container or grab one of yours? (:

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## fireblade

Anyway, I don't think the seedshrimps are being eaten by the fish... just that they are all hiding... out of sight is out of mind...  :Smile: 

I stay Tiong Bahru area..
you can grab and go..

but the water is in container since Sunday. not sure still ok or not. covered and under sunlight..

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## Bern C

> Hm, but C02 is too troublesome for me. I think I'll stick to fertilizer. I've seen an online vid with a guy maintaining a few bottles of pea soup/emerald green water in 1.5L bottkes with lighting and an air pump. It worked out pretty well for him if you ask me. @[email protected]
> 
> Lucky you. My old Neon Tetras, Endlers and Guppies love chasing and eating shrimplets. I lost ten overnight when I added the fish in.


Using CO2 system is optional. Air pump actually do its works by maintaining the CO2 at atmosphere level and circulating the water. With more CO2 will be better as it speed up the growth. Without air pump, gotta shake shake and it won't be as green.
XD Recently experimenting on some magical powder for airtight bottle culture.

Yeah.. neon tetra quite aggressive. Last time use to keep it and keep seeing them nipping on others tails. XD Not sure about my guppies and endlers.. I think my guppies and endlers will go for shrimplets too but at least they don't go into the heavily planted areas to hunt for food. So I am not so worry about them eating my shrimplets.





> Anyway, I don't think the seedshrimps are being eaten by the fish... just that they are all hiding... out of sight is out of mind...


XD You can try feeling the seedshrimps to you angels. If angels able to eat small snails, probably it will eat them. Seed shrimp shell is as hard as snail shell.. hopefully it's not harder. @[email protected] I read an article that some ostracod can survive after been eaten by fish and pass out. http://www.lbm.go.jp/smith/facts.html#9

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## Griffith DreamWalker

> Anyway, I don't think the seedshrimps are being eaten by the fish... just that they are all hiding... out of sight is out of mind... 
> 
> I stay Tiong Bahru area..
> you can grab and go..
> 
> but the water is in container since Sunday. not sure still ok or not. covered and under sunlight..


Tiong Bahru very big, where specifically? 

Maybe next time when there's fresh stock then PM me or something then.  :Wink:  I think the greenwater may be too old(a bit risky since its been there for nearly a week. I'm feeding the moina culture another mixture and so far its been working quite well. 

When I fed it yeast(it crashed), I fed it carrot+spirulina algae(it crashed). But so far with this new concoction the moina have recovered from a close to total die off.  :Jump for joy: 




> Using CO2 system is optional. Air pump actually do its works by maintaining the CO2 at atmosphere level and circulating the water. With more CO2 will be better as it speed up the growth. Without air pump, gotta shake shake and it won't be as green.
> XD Recently experimenting on some magical powder for airtight bottle culture.
> 
> Yeah.. neon tetra quite aggressive. Last time use to keep it and keep seeing them nipping on others tails. XD Not sure about my guppies and endlers.. I think my guppies and endlers will go for shrimplets too but at least they don't go into the heavily planted areas to hunt for food. So I am not so worry about them eating my shrimplets.


Ok that's good then. I may try the air pump + coke bottle culturing method to see if it works for me. Good luck with your experiment!

Heavily planted is a hard thing to achieve for me. Must be because I still am new to aquascape and still can't decide on a design...

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