# Planted Tanks > Plant Talk > Aquatic Moss Club >  Found some moss growing on land

## whoppie

Found the following moss growing under a tree. Anyone knows what type of moss it is and also, can I put it in my tank or must I wait till it turns into immersed form?

The moss looks like its already in immersed form, can anyone confirm?

Thanks  :Very Happy:

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## zmzfam

Lincoln,

can't view the pics. plants growing out of water will have a different form from its immersed form. some transformation will take place when you immersed it.

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## whoppie

Oops sorry, fixed the link already.  :Opps:

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## A.Rashid

Lincoln,


I have been using moss that I collect from the land emersed form, and normally I will soak them for w few days and change water using the water from my fish tank... this is to ensure that there's no poisonous chemical that sometimes pets control guys use to disiinfect the areas or any diesel or petrol that the grass cutter use.

after that when I am confident of no more traces.. I will place them in my tank. I have made some experiment those that I place them at the flow of the filter outlet seems to grow better and faster than those that are not and they grow slower..
so now I cultivate them but place them on wire meshes with net over it place them where the water outlets are and in two weeks they spread fast..

you can view mine here: http://www.nus.edu.sg/cfa/moss.html

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## whoppie

Hello Rashid,

Just tied them to a piece if rock after soaking for 2 days.

How is the growth rate for the moss and also, will too much light kill it?

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## A.Rashid

too much light wont hinder the growth, I dont experience any of that. Like I said in my previous reply. if you can place them where the water outlet from your canister you'll have faster growth rate, that's my observation. 

As those moss are in emerse form, it may take awhile till they adapt to their new atmosphere, so have patience...

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## whoppie

How long did you wait before you noticed any growth?

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## RonWill

> How long did you wait before you noticed any growth?


Hi Lincoln, if you read between the lines, you'd have noticed Rashid saying, "...and in two weeks they spread fast.."

Personally, I have driftwood sticking out of the water surface and the emersed form are left growing on it. Those that reach the waterline slowly adapts and changes to the submerged "leaves", which makes the open concept tank more interesting.

I do take the necessary precautions in not introducing pests and chemicals.

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## wks

Hi Lincoln, I suspect the "moss" which you collected maybe a liverwort. However I'm no expert in this species, so I can't tell you the name.

Why I think its a liverwort. Firstly, moss leaves are usually simple in shape, a good example is the java moss. Your "moss" has deeply toothed leaves which is a typical characteristics of liverwort. Secondly, liverwort leaves have their leaves arranged in two lateral rows (this is evident in both pictures) while moss leaves are seen spiralling around the stem.

I hope my deduction is correct, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Regards,
Jason Wong

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## timebomb

> I suspect the "moss" which you collected maybe a liverwort. However I'm no expert in this species, so I can't tell you the name.


Jason,

I think it's a moss. I can't explain why I think it's so but I have seen enough to know a moss when I see one :smile: Anyway, intrigued by the pictures that Lincoln and Rashid posted, I took a close look at the emersed Christmas Moss growing on a piece of driftwood in my terrarium tank. 

The Christmas Moss, when grown emersed loses it triangular shapes. Heck, they look just like the moss that Lincoln and Rashid found. Here are 2 pictures, one is a close-up. 





The only difference, if there's any, is that there are many capsules (those brown comma-like stalks) growing on mine.

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## TS168

Thanks Mr Loh and all,

It seen the moss is now all island. Think it come with the soil bring in to singapore. Cause i found all this most in Bishan, Sembaswang and AMK HDB area.

And i have collect a handfull of palm size and after this few days of rain, it growing very green and bushy.

But today when i go back to check i found them not so nice and abit dry.

Think best time to harvest is during raining season.
Oh No. Moss price gonna be dropping.

Cheers TS

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## kc

Lincoln,
I called the moss that you found as "HDB" moss. I think Choy also found similar moss and he called it " Bukit Timah Moss". I think they are the same and are found everwhere in Singapore.

BTW, The "HDB" or "Bukit Timah " moss looked like the Willow moss that are being sold by Chan before you grow them submerged.  :Surprised:

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## timebomb

> It seen the moss is now all island.


Yes, it seems like the moss can be found everywhere. I was working somewhere around Bukit Merah this morning and I saw many patches of the moss growing almost everywhere in between the grasses on a slope. Now that we know that this moss isn't just confined to the Bukit Timah area and housing estates, I would suggest we drop the "Bukit Timah" and "HDB" names. 

Loh K L

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## hwchoy

why are we surprised? moss and allied plants can be found through the world, even in the arctic. what is interesting is whether they can adapt to an aquarium.  :Cool:

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## timebomb

I brought my camera along to work this morning to take pictures of the moss I saw yesterday. Up close, I discovered that there are actually 3 types of mosses growing wild all over the place. Here are some pics:


This looks like the moss which Teck Song got from a fish shop owner. It doesn't have pointed tips but its wavy edges make it look like Willow Moss or something.



This looks the same as the one many hobbyists have found growing all over Singapore. It looks like Christmas Moss grown emersed. Similar to the Christmas Moss that I have in my tanks, there were also many capsules sprouting from the moss.



Another picture of the moss with the capsules clearly shown.



This one didn't look like moss at all unlike I examined it up-close. I thought it was lichen at first but they have individual fronds.

Loh K L

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## kc

KL,
Have you managed to find the moss man of Singapore, Dr Benito Tan? Now that his name is published in the newspaper, I guess he will be having a lot of e-mail and phone calls.
We can learn alot of from him.  :Very Happy:

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## Green Baron

> KL,
> Have you managed to find the moss man of Singapore, Dr Benito Tan? Now that his name is published in the newspaper, I guess he will be having a lot of e-mail and phone calls.
> We can learn alot of from him.


FYI, Dr Benito Tan will be giving a talk next Friday, 6th Feb 4pm at SBG Garden Briefing Room. Unfortunatley I will be away ;-( 
Maybe you guys can attend and bring some samples for him to compare and ID.

By the way the moss I collected from my condo looks more like the moss that NA sells than Christmas moss. I will check out West Coast area in the next few days to see if I can find any other type of mosses like what Mr Loh has found.

The link below shows a pic of the moss grown without CO2 in a low light, low maint tank

http://www.arofanatics.com/members/gancw/moss/

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## hwchoy

what kind of talk is that? 4pm Friday doesn't sound like the kind of talk meant for the general public. anyway how can we register?

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## kc

I checked with SBG. It's open to staff only.  :Confused:

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## Green Baron

> I checked with SBG. It's open to staff only.


The title of the talk is "Mossy Forests, Mosses and Moss Database". 
Didn't know it is not open to public. I was invited becasue I am a member of NSS Plant group. If any of you are really keen and willling to take half day off on Friday, I can try and see if I can get a few seats for you.

Gan

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## timebomb

> If any of you are really keen and willling to take half day off on Friday, I can try and see if I can get a few seats for you.


Gan,

I should be free to attend the talk and I would appreciate it very much if you can get me a ticket. I intend to bring some of the mosses from my tanks for Mr Benito Tan to identify and clear up, once and for all, the mystery surrounding the names of the mosses. If there's anyone who can identify them, it should be Mr Benito.

Loh K L

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## hwchoy

I am a sleeping NSS member  :Smile:  I'm not sure if Dr Benito Tan would be very tickled to see commercial interest in mosses. There is always a potential that people will go out and strip the place clean of mosses  :Shocked:  

Alternatively it could be very interesting if hobbyist and researchers work together. For example I am quite sure that many of the mosses found in cloud forest would adapt well to aquatic conditions, given the high levels of precipitation in its natural environment. We could help to try cultivating some of these mosses and see if they do well in aquarium. The reason we should work together is that we wouldn't want to reveal where the mosses are collected (I can think of the highlands and peaks in Pahang and Mt Kinabalu).

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## timebomb

Choy,

Speaking of adaptation, I found some mosses this morning that look very much like the Christmas Moss grown submersed. The heavy shower yesterday washed off a lot of mud so most of the moss I saw yesterday were covered with debris but the rain also exposed some moss which has faint triangular shapes. Here's a pic:



Loh K L

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## whoppie

> *'Moss man' of S'pore gets top award* 
> 
> *NUS scientist Benito Tan is the first in Asia to receive the prestigious Richard Spruce Award, for his work on mosses in the region* 
> 
> By Chang Ai-Lien 
> 
> SMALL is beautiful to scientist Benito Tan, 52, who has spent most of his life studying Earth's simplest and most ancient plants - mosses.
> 
> 
> ...

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## Green Baron

> I am a sleeping NSS member  I'm not sure if Dr Benito Tan would be very tickled to see commercial interest in mosses. There is always a potential that people will go out and strip the place clean of mosses  
> 
> Alternatively it could be very interesting if hobbyist and researchers work together. For example I am quite sure that many of the mosses found in cloud forest would adapt well to aquatic conditions, given the high levels of precipitation in its natural environment. We could help to try cultivating some of these mosses and see if they do well in aquarium. The reason we should work together is that we wouldn't want to reveal where the mosses are collected (I can think of the highlands and peaks in Pahang and Mt Kinabalu).


I have checked with Dr Tan and he said the talk is open to public ! and he will have some very nice closeup photo of mosses. 

He is very keen to look at our mosses but not during the talk. I will make arrangement with him and revert to you guys once I confirm a date with him. It will be on a Saturday morning at NUS.

Gan

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## Green Baron

> I am a sleeping NSS member  I'm not sure if Dr Benito Tan would be very tickled to see commercial interest in mosses. There is always a potential that people will go out and strip the place clean of mosses  
> Kinabalu).


On the contrary, he has a student doing a study of the trade of mosses and ferns in Singapore ! Knowing what is being traded is the first step towards conservation. With that info, he can potentially work on a project to make growing those mosses commercially viable and who knows maybe we can play a part in it ;-)

Gan

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## hwchoy

it would be great as he could provide us samples of mosses from the cloud forest :wink:

So you'd arrange a private discussion with him?

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## Green Baron

> it would be great as he could provide us samples of mosses from the cloud forest :wink:
> 
> So you'd arrange a private discussion with him?


I am sure we can work out something with him ;-) I look forward to see his collection of mossess. He is very keen to see our aquatic mosses as he has only heard of 'Javan Moss'  :Shocked:  I am sure he has seen them but not by the name of Christmas/Erect/Mini/Willow/Taiwan Moss  :Smile:  

Yes, I will be arranging a private session with him. KL has indicated he is keen. Anyone else interested in meeting Dr Tan ?

Gan

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## hwchoy

count me in. :wink:

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## kc

I'm not qualified to meet him as my mosses are in bad shape.  :Opps:  
You can slot me in the last of the queue, if there is still a vancany.

KL, Gan, Choy.. etc :
Pls try to get some new species of mosses for our aquariums.  :Evil:  
We can help him to propagate.  :Very Happy:

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## timebomb

> KL, Gan, Choy.. etc :
> Pls try to get some new species of mosses for our aquariums.  
> We can help him to propagate.


Kim Cheng, I don't know if it is a good idea to ask Dr Tan for new species of mosses as it would be the first time we are meeting him. My priority is to ask him for help in identifying several mosses I have in my tanks, namely, Christmas, Erect, Willow and a new one I got recently that goes by the name of "pope moss". I'm also keen to find out if the so called "HDB/Bukit Timah" moss that you and Choy found is the same plant as the Christmas Moss. I collected a few specimens of wild moss yesterday and I intend to show them to Dr Tan together with the other mosses that are growing submersed in my tanks. The correct scientific names of the various mosses should be of great interest to many planted tank hobbyists.

Sia Meng also raised a very interesting question about how we can use moss extract to kill fungi, a point that was mentioned by Dr Tan himself in his interview with the press. This should be very interesting information to killifish breeders as fungi is one of our greatest enemy. 

Gan, I will be delighted to meet Dr Tan at any time at his convenience. If it's going to be on a Saturday morning, it will mean that I have to apply for annual leave. I wouldn't mind using up a precious day of my leave if I get to meet the man personally. It will be an honour and a great pleasure. Thanks for helping out with the arrangements. I hope we are not putting you through too much trouble.

Loh K L

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## whoppie

Since we we talking about moss, how is the growth rate of erect moss and also, can ity survive under high light + cool water?

Tks

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## timebomb

Lincoln,

We had a discussion about this recently and you can find the thread here:

http://www.killies.com/forum/viewtop...?t=248&start=0

Loh K L

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## A.Rashid

Wo... I didn't know, talking about moss would go this far... very interesting... if the talk is in NUS and if I am free that day would surely like to join...will try bring some of the moss I found near my estate..

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## Green Baron

> Gan, I will be delighted to meet Dr Tan at any time at his convenience. If it's going to be on a Saturday morning, it will mean that I have to apply for annual leave. I wouldn't mind using up a precious day of my leave if I get to meet the man personally. It will be an honour and a great pleasure. Thanks for helping out with the arrangements. I hope we are not putting you through too much trouble.
> 
> Loh K L


KL,
No problem. I am looking forward to meeting the man as well.
The date will probably be the Sat after the talk. Will advice once I get a confirmation from him.

Gan

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## Green Baron

> Wo... I didn't talk about moss would go this far... very interesting... if the talk is in NUS and if I am free that day would surely like to join...will try bring some of the moss I found near my estate..


The talk is at Singapore Botanical Garden

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## fishnut

Hi all, 

this is my 1st posting. Just want to thank everyone who has posted in this forum for making this one of the most informed and educational aquatic forums around (especially on mosses and killies).  :Very Happy:  

This may be stale news; but through the pictures that have been posted here, I've found what I think is mosses at my school in Tampines as well ( can't reveal the name of the school for security reasons; sorry)  :Very Happy:  . 

Will try to take some pictures of them and post them here so that everyone can compare... Really looking forward to reading the outcome of the meeting between the moss experts, so watch this space! :wink: 

Wei Leong

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## timebomb

Gan C W who had problems posting messages to this forum sent me this email which should be of interest to those who want to meet Dr Tan.

_Hi KL,

Is there something wrong with the forum, I am unable to post an entry. Clicking on new topic, reply or quote brings me back to the forum homne page.

Just want to inform you that the meeting with Dr Tan has been confirmed for 7th Feb 10am so that you can apply for leave. 

Dr Tan will advice the loction of his lab later.
_

Thanks, Gan. I will definitely be there to meet Dr Tan. I will be bringing many samples of mosses for him to identify. I believe it may take him some time to study the mosses and find out their scientific names so I will be packing them separately in small plastic bags and I will mark the samples clearly. I hope Dr Tan will clear up the mystery if Christmas, Taiwan, Mini, Bukit Timah and HDB moss are actually one and the same plant. Personally, I do believe the first 3 are the same. They appear different only because they were grown under different conditions. 

Loh K L

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## timebomb

Teck Song sent me this private message and I quote:




> HI Mr Loh,
> 
> Saw you guys talk alot of mosses lately, not sure if u have really see n feel taiwan moss.
> there is a shop at amk ave 10, this guy has taiwan moss brough in my a friend from taiwan and i was there that day and see him tied it to the wood. That was about 2 mth back and it has grown until he has cut some out.
> 
> Look very same as xmass moss if both are growing very well in the tank but the different is the texture of the feel of both plant.
> 
> If you keen, maybe u can drop by and take a look at it.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tip, Teck Song. I was at the shop a few hours ago and they definitely have many different types of mosses. I chatted with the shop owner for a while and he's a nice guy. I also bought some of his "Taiwan Moss". To tell the truth, I feel the pinch very badly whenever I have to pay for mosses. Over the years, I have given away so many kilograms of mosses it hurts like hell when I have to pay for them. But for the sake of clearing up the mystery about mosses' names, I guess the money I paid was worth it. Here's a pic of the Taiwan Moss I bought:



As Teck Song said, the texture of the moss seems to be different. It feels a lot softer than the Christmas Moss I have in my tanks. The triangular shapes seem similar to the Christmas but the fronds are shorter. I think the texture and the shorter fronds are due to different growing conditions. I'm quite sure this is the same as Christmas and I will be bringing some of it to Dr Tan to identify. I will also tie this Taiwan Moss to driftwood and grow them in my tank that has the Christmas Moss Wall. I do believe, that when they are grown in the same tank, they will, over time, look exactly the same.

Loh K L

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## timebomb

> this is my 1st posting. Just want to thank everyone who has posted in this forum for making this one of the most informed and educational aquatic forums around.
> 
> Wei Leong


Wei Leong, welcome to the discussion. I'm glad you decided to move out from lurking mode and make a post. We know that quite a few people lurk in this forum and we hope they will join in the discussions whenever they can. Everyone has something to offer, even if they are new to the hobby. If Teck Song had not told me about the Taiwan Moss available in the fish shop in Ang Mo Kio, I wouldn't have known about it. 

We'll be looking forward to seeing the pictures of the moss you found in your school. If you have problems posting them to the forum, send them to me through private email and I will upload them for you.

Loh K L

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## Green Baron

Thanks KL for posting on my behalf. Not sure why I couldn't post earlier.

I took a walk around my place today and saw lots of mosses all over the palce.




I saw 3 different type of mosses :

1. This is the common one growing all over the place and looks like Christmas/Taiwan moss when grown submersed.


2. I am not sure if this is a moss but it grows in damp places.


3.This one looks very different and is only found at one particular location. Also not sure if it is a moss.


This is how they look like side by side :


Anyway I am going to try growing them submersed and see how they look like. Can't wait for the expert to unravel the mystery

Gan

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## timebomb

Thanks for the pics, Gan. The mosses look like the same ones I saw somewhere around the Bukit Merah area, at Telok Blangah Park, to be exact.

If it's not too much trouble, please bring some samples along with you when we meet Dr Tan. I will bring those that are growing submersed in my tanks while you can bring those in your pictures. How about that?

Loh K L

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## TS168

> Thanks for the tip, Teck Song. I was at the shop a few hours ago and they definitely have many different types of mosses. I chatted with the shop owner for a while and he's a nice guy. I also bought some of his "Taiwan Moss". To tell the truth, I feel the pinch very badly whenever I have to pay for mosses. Over the years, I have given away so many kilograms of mosses it hurts like hell when I have to pay for them. But for the sake of clearing up the mystery about mosses' names, I guess the money I paid was worth it. Here's a pic of the Taiwan Moss I bought:
> 
> As Teck Song said, the texture of the moss seems to be different. It feels a lot softer than the Christmas Moss I have in my tanks. The triangular shapes seem similar to the Christmas but the fronds are shorter. I think the texture and the shorter fronds are due to different growing conditions. I'm quite sure this is the same as Christmas and I will be bringing some of it to Dr Tan to identify. I will also tie this Taiwan Moss to driftwood and grow them in my tank that has the Christmas Moss Wall. I do believe, that when they are grown in the same tank, they will, over time, look exactly the same.
> 
> Loh K L


Mr Loh you are fast, You are a lucky guy that he sold to you. By the way, he is the only owner of the shop. I visit his shop so often that i have nearly know in n out of his shop. hehe. But i am a poor customer of his.

I did not buy his Taiwan moss afew day back as i felt i will not have the capability to grow it at current environment which i have. 

So will you also check the moss that i posted the last time? Love to know what moss is that. 

I also lucky to have a feel of the taiwan moss sometime back and have seen it grow up from a small patch on the drift good. hehe.

Cheers.

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## Green Baron

> Thanks for the pics, Gan. The mosses look like the same ones I saw somewhere around the Bukit Merah area, at Telok Blangah Park, to be exact.
> 
> If it's not too much trouble, please bring some samples along with you when we meet Dr Tan. I will bring those that are growing submersed in my tanks while you can bring those in your pictures. How about that?
> 
> Loh K L


Will do. 

Gan

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## wks

Mr Loh, I salute you for taking so much effort to clear up the names of these beautiful mosses. Please post the results of your meeting with Dr Tan and share the knowledge with the rest of us members.  :Smile:  

Can you help everyone here to find out whether Lincoln's plant is really moss and what species?

Regards,
Jason Wong

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## timebomb

> Can you help everyone here to find out whether Lincoln's plant is really moss and what species?


Jason, I think the plant Lincoln found is a moss and not a liverwort but if you really want to know what's the difference between the 2, check out:

http://www.kaimaibush.co.nz/Bryophyt..._frameset.html

When I meet Dr Tan, my first priority is to ask him for help in identifying the aquatic mosses that we are growing in our tanks. Identifying mosses that we find growing emersed everywhere in Singapore is second priority because chances are Dr Tan already knows of the existence of such mosses and have studied them in detail. The article in the Straits Times mentioned that in his search for mosses, Dr Tan travels to hot spots around this region. I believe chances are he would be familiar with the mosses found in Singapore but maybe he haven't looked in the fish shops yet  :Laughing: 

I would definitely post the details of my meeting with Dr Tan but I think it will take a while before he can give us definite answers. As far as I know, it's not easy to identify mosses, even for a bryologist. Sometimes, the only way to identify a moss accurately is to split its capsules and examine the spores under a microscope. 

I don't know if any of you read the Chinese papers but there's an article today that mentioned Dr Tan and his work on mosses. According to the article, there are something like more than 90 different species of mosses in Singapore alone. And in Malaysia, the number is even higher.

So it looks like we are only beginning to scratch the surface. 

Loh K L

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