# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Invertebrates >  Seller said keep BKK with fan

## vynax

Hi all,

I just get to hear from my friend whom he was told by a King Kong reseller in this forum that King Kong shrimp can be kept with fan only. 

Has anyone sucessful in keeping and breeding King Kong shrimp with fan and without chiller? Or the BKK reseller is trying to make a fast one?

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## eviltrain

who is this reseller wor? 

it is possible
1) if the ambient temperature is below 26-27 degree C.
2) seller top up the water diligently which is evaporated by fan
3) keep the water parameter very consistence without any fluctuation

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## avex30

Mind sharing this very experience seller?? Pm if you think it is not suitable to name out here I m curious to know this expert

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## nasty12

im also keen in hearing who is it sia. Do pm me as well !
but i agree with What bro Eviltrain has said!
i ever kept bkk at a constant temperature around 28degrees for around 2 months.

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## Yulbrainer

I tried crs with fan only, can last for 1 month only.

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## cheetf

Another secret way of keeping BKK!

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## goody992828

Hmm that should be a good news if it is true..... keeping CRS with fan is already a great challenge, dont mention BKK. Alot of ppl has failed keeping it with chiller.....

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## Yulbrainer

> Another secret way of keeping BKK!


Is this a hint of the seller, bro?

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## cheetf

Hahaha. Only the thread starter will know who the reseller is. I think he should disclose the reseller so that people will not get suckered buy such unscrupulous sellers.

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## Navanod

Really is CSB (Cool Story Bro, borrowed from Eat Drink Man woman forum of Hardwarezone).
The question is not whether BKK can be kept with a fan anot, but what temperature can be achieve with a fan in the case of the BKK buyer. Did this seller find out? I doubt that its possible to estimate from a seller's prospective since its dependent on so many factors

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## newlife

That's my hero HuiZhong....
With fan and feeding with goldfish food....
Hee...
10 pieces all survive and happily swimming.....

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## rcw

can keep but I don't think that it will breed,the colour will change too,then slowly die....

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## cheetf

> Is this a hint of the seller, bro?


The seller has revealed himself.

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## Navanod

> That's my hero HuiZhong....
> With fan and feeding with goldfish food....
> Hee...
> 10 pieces all survive and happily swimming.....


Survive yes...happily? I sincerely doubt so

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## cheetf

Putting an eskimo in the desert.

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## xconnect.

I am keeping my fire reds with fan for 8months and they are breeding.but bkk fan i cnt belive cause two bkk can buy one chiller my as well avoid the hassle to maintain water parameters

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## SeahSengYong

I believe maybe the seller refers to certain seasons.
It might be possible in HongKong if the season is cold.
I went HongKong the temperature quite low, 16 degree.

But in Singapore only got one season which is super hot.
If anyone can breed normal CRS with fan here, he must be very good and I should say LUCKY too.
I hope it is not some unethnical seller just want to make quick bucks from bringing in KK.
A lot of people even myself experience CRS keeping with fan, but CRS will slowly die one by one.
If kk can survive without chiller, that will be a big news.

Do keep us updated.
And maybe share the power seller.

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## eviltrain

Bro ssy, you should say using fan at room temperature. Aircon confirm can.

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## alvinchan80

60x45x45cm tank in aircon room without fan can reach 22deg celsius previously in my room.. With fan maybe lower? BUT once aircon is off during the day it can rise to 28-30deg.. Haha...

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## eviltrain

Why ts no talk? (-,-)

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## huizhong

Hello guys, sharing my experience. My first bkk which is a present from my friends, is with me for 2 months plus to 3 months with fan only. Still survive. My wr was added in after about 1 month plus and 1 of them got berried but very few eggs. And another got berried last week.

Recently added a few more bkk to join my lonely bkk. They were alright in the tank for a week or 2. But after that I shifted all my bkks and wr to another newly setup tank 2 weeks ago. Also with fans only. 

However a week ago I saw my wr colour not so good. I think they are stress already. With my new tank or prolong high temperature I am not sure. I also couldnt count my full strength of bkks. 

So just last Saturday when I came home(I am home only once every week), I set up my chiller.
Last counted my bkk and I think 3 were missing. my advice is better to use chiller in the long run. 
Oh, please dont mistaken me as the reseller who advice people to use fan. Because in the first place I dont have bkk for shrimplets for sale. Haha. 

A note to all beginners like me: i feel more relieved and and rest my mind in peace after setting up my chiller 2 days ago. Now I don't have to worry about hot weather. :-)

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## newlife

My hero come liao.....
Mr HuiZhong....simply love his Bo chap style.....

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## Yulbrainer

> The seller has revealed himself.


Which one bro?

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## vynax

> The seller has revealed himself.





> Which one bro?


Yes, the breeeder/seller has already posted in this thread......

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## vynax

> My hero come liao.....
> Mr HuiZhong....simply love his Bo chap style.....


If can keep BKK with fan, why must Bro Huizhong installed the chiller 2 days ago after 3 KK missing.....

I think some resellers just want to make quick bucks and push the sales even the buyer does not own a chiller ....By thew way, the buyer is not Bro Huizhong.....

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## Yulbrainer

> Yes, the breeeder/seller has already posted in this thread......


 Sorry bro, i don't want to make a wild guess or make a wrong conclusion.
It will be better if you point it exactly which one to make thing clear.

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## eviltrain

> Hi all,
> 
> I just get to hear from my friend whom he was told by a King Kong reseller in this forum that King Kong shrimp can be kept with fan only. 
> 
> Has anyone sucessful in keeping and breeding King Kong shrimp with fan and without chiller? Or the BKK reseller is trying to make a fast one?


your friend got miss out any points bo? 

-how come so many "help my friend ask questions" recently?-

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## ZackZhou

> If can keep BKK with fan, why must Bro Huizhong installed the chiller 2 days ago after 3 KK missing.....
> 
> I think some resellers just want to make quick bucks and push the sales even the buyer does not own a chiller ....By thew way, the buyer is not Bro Huizhong.....


WhoooHooo... The clone account is out targeting someone again!!!
Luckily this time round the person he shoot is not me.. Hahaha


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## rascal

i think he keep in aircon.. can't be in room temperature... hahha... if he can survive keeping bbk using fan, we can all throw our expensive chiller..hahha

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## avex30

> i think he keep in aircon.. can't be in room temperature... hahha... if he can survive keeping bbk using fan, we can all throw our expensive chiller..hahha


agree on that one

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## newlife

Clone account lei...

But I swear that bro HuiZhong BKK really survive thru weeks or even months.
The last time I heard him saying...all 10 pieces all seen and recover...which was about a week ago...which I was amazed...and feeding with goldfish food.

Have chiller and BKK will survive???
To me...I don't think so....

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## cheetf

> Clone account lei...
> 
> But I swear that bro HuiZhong BKK really survive thru weeks or even months.
> The last time I heard him saying...all 10 pieces all seen and recover...which was about a week ago...which I was amazed...and feeding with goldfish food.
> 
> Have chiller and BKK will survive???
> To me...I don't think so....


Who is the clone? Bro HuiZhong already say that 3 of his BKK disappear, and that was just 3 days ago (look at the post date), what you mean which was a week ago? So what are you saying? 

Are you saying BKK no need chillers to survive? Can you document this? Of course, aircon room with fans don't count.

If that is your belief, do you keep your BKK with chillers?

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## bluebubbles

> I am keeping my fire reds with fan for 8months and they are breeding.but bkk fan i cnt belive cause two bkk can buy one chiller my as well avoid the hassle to maintain water parameters


Might as well buy black chocolate hor? damage not so painful. :Grin:

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## merciwash

I tried that keeping bkk and crs with fan, survive can but the colour and breeding you can forget it. Plus every day you will need to top up water, and nowdays tap water got a lot of chemical.
Every year there will be a heat wave and you will see your temperature shot up. and your bkk starts dieing togather.
Better invest in a chiller it will be a lot cheaper.

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## curryfishhead

This thread is funny and interesting....lol

In one corner, there are genuine forumers sharing their experience in keeping bkk with fan...

In a separate corner, there are another group of forumers witch hunting.....

Guess this make this forum all the more exciting.....

Keep up the good work.....

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## cheetf

> This thread is funny and interesting....lol
> 
> In one corner, there are genuine forumers sharing their experience in keeping bkk with fan...
> 
> In a separate corner, there are another group of forumers witch hunting.....
> 
> Guess this make this forum all the more exciting.....
> 
> Keep up the good work.....


BKK is already difficult enough to keep with a chiller. As a reseller selling his shrimps to people telling them that they can keep with fans is rather unscrupulous. Unlike transit points like LFS, the resellers keep BKK themselves and should know that it should be kept in a proper environment for them to thrive.

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## binniez

Whoever this "expert" is, he might be able to keep bkk without any chillers. I believe he is viewing this thread. Whatever this "expert" can do, does not mean that others can do. Those who kept bkk knows how sensitive they are and will most probably perish without the right conditions. 

Even if they manage to survive, it does not mean that they are in their best condition or given the best habitat. It could be a stroke of luck. If he is out to con newbies into believing that bkk can be kept under certain conditions which others might not necessary be able to perform the same, then I believe that this forumer is just out to make a quick buck. Unscrupulous indeed!

Bkk is already one of the most difficult shrimps to keep without people being mislead. Instead of helping the newbies by giving them proper advice, the expert is giving wrong and misleading statements. Any idea that the people that you are conning, how would they feel if their bkk die piece by piece in front of them. Not to mention only the monetary loss but the shrimp's life is also killed. Indeed, you might not be able to breed or keep them sucessfully even if you do have a chiller. But without a chiller, it makes things even harder and the chances of failing is even higher. If this "expert" indeed insist that it is possible, please post pictures and document that you do keep bkk without chiller like what brother cheetf says. No proof/picture no talk!

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## eviltrain

Aiyoh, how come become point finger session liao.

What TS had said is so unclear. Just say who better mah. Guessing game where got fun?

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## Yulbrainer

Am i guessing the wrong seller?
Sorry bro, will immediately edit my post.

Why, i can't edit my previous post? but this one can?

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## newlife

> Oww, turns out the seller is you bro 
> You should be wise enough not to make comment that will be use to flame you.
> Politics is dirty and ugly, white can be turn to black, be careful next time bro, don't get too excited


when did I sell black king kong to buyers without chiller???
Before pointing fingers at me...

If this thread is not for people to reply...or to pick trouble...
Am I wrong by stating some fact that HuiZhong really make it from what he have shared with me.
I have even replied in HuiZhong's thread before this thread is out to picking on people again.
Not supporting or agree with it. I even pester him to get a chiller ASAP then putting the shrimp on risk and I've even offer to loan him my spare chiller. To prevent any disagreement...HuiZhong did not buy any from me.

Once a month...there will sure to have "some" appointed personal to stirred things up...

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## Yulbrainer

Sorry, bro i mistakenly guess it was you. I ask to ts, and he just give a hint.
I tried to edit my post but seems like i don't have access to edit it  :Sad: 
I know you too bro, you even prevented my buying your prl because on that time there is other seller selling with slightly bellow your price.
That show to me that you are not merely trying to get profit, but you are really sharing the happiness of the hobby.

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## vynax



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## eviltrain

why *BLANK* here ?????? so weird one ? 














this topic started on 14/11/2011.

but the message is from 16/11/2011. weird right?

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## cheetf

The date on the top is the date that which the screen is captured. Nothing weird about that, it is not the date of the conversation. This is not an android.

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## avex30

Missing link? Haha I wonder wonder what is in that missing link??

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## ZackZhou

So what does the msg printscreen proved? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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## nasty12

whats in between the conversation from 5-8??

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## spinex

> So what does the msg printscreen proved?


it proved that android is better then iPhone.

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## felix_fx2

> it proved that android is better then iPhone.


Please do not off topic.
They are talking about other then android phone screenshot.
Btw, no android screenshot?

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## felix_fx2

> Missing link? Haha I wonder wonder what is in that missing link??


Maybe it is not revenant. 
Or it's more thing that can have more flaming?

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## avex30

> Maybe it is not revenant. 
> Or it's more thing that can have more flaming?


Well to me if u want to use that as evidence than nothing should be hidden lo. It make it like there is a missing link that could prove the other person innocent. Maybe bro Newlife got say something else that is of concern to this whole issue and it is not shown than it not that fair to point that he say that keeping Kk with fan is possible.

I ain't here to defense anyone but let me quote a example I ever buy shrimp from him I stay in hougang area he happen he was fetching his wife from
Jalan Kayu so he ask me to pick it up from there. When I reach and get the shrimp he still pack a small bag of ice below the tub containing the shrimp. His way if he sell shrimps that way to such detail hmm I doubt he will say something like that there must be something else not shown. I hope to view the whole conversation lo if not to me there is something hidden truth isn't complete.

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## globalcookie

I seldom comment here, usually read only. This thread interesting. 

Did the reputable seller show buyer the tank?

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## felix_fx2

avex30 bro, could it be communication problem? TS and the real seller.
"Can be kept using fan, but best to have chiller as conditions are much better."

Everyone does have a tendency to hear what they wish to hear (hope you can get what Im conveying)

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## cheetf

> Well to me if u want to use that as evidence than nothing should be hidden lo. It make it like there is a missing link that could prove the other person innocent. Maybe bro Newlife got say something else that is of concern to this whole issue and it is not shown than it not that fair to point that he say that keeping Kk with fan is possible.
> 
> I ain't here to defense anyone but let me quote a example I ever buy shrimp from him I stay in hougang area he happen he was fetching his wife from
> Jalan Kayu so he ask me to pick it up from there. When I reach and get the shrimp he still pack a small bag of ice below the tub containing the shrimp. His way if he sell shrimps that way to such detail hmm I doubt he will say something like that there must be something else not shown. I hope to view the whole conversation lo if not to me there is something hidden truth isn't complete.


Well even without the rest of the story, the seller could have just said yes or no when asked a simple question on if the bkk needed a chiller or not. Why did he have to go tell story that implies that bkk don't need a chiller? Normally people who avoid questions have either something to hide or is out to try to sway opinion. And if he is dealing with a very eager newbie, that would usually help make up the newbie's mind pretty easily as he is using the very good sales pitch of telling the customer what he wants to hear, not what reality might be.

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## nasty12

> Hi all,
> 
> I just get to hear from my friend whom he was told by a King Kong reseller in this forum that King Kong shrimp can be kept with fan only. 
> 
> Has anyone sucessful in keeping and breeding King Kong shrimp with fan and without chiller? Or the BKK reseller is trying to make a fast one?



hmm but weird.. if TS is the one communicating with him why did he start a thread saying i got to hear from a friend? why didnt he just come out to say " i heard from a hobbyist here saying that keeping KK using fan is achievable?" or something along the lines.

what they communicated is still in a grey area. they might have spoken over the phone? met up in between ?

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## binniez

Hmmm.. Honestly, I feel that it doesn't matter if TS mention whether he heard from friend or whether he heard it himself. 

The main point is that the "expert" indirectly mentioned that keeping bkk without chiller is possible. In fact, the "expert" USED Huizhong's name to make an example. Why use other's name when maybe the "expert" himself is unable to keep bkk without chiller? By using Huizhong's name in this context, I personally feel that the "expert" is incorrigable! Why? Presume if the buyer actually purchased the bkk based on the messages, if the bkk dies, will the buyer put part of the blame on Huizhong while the "expert" run scott free simply just because Huizhong has manage to keep bkk without chiller and succeeded?

On top of that, the "expert" avoided the question when buyer asked if they could breed under these kind of circumstances and just replied that they are swimming happily after 2-3 weeks without chiller. If the "expert" is keeping bkk in his tanks with chiller, how is the buyer expected to know all these? The "expert" should have known that bkk given their sensitive nature, should require better conditions than that. Even if the bkk managed to survive for a few weeks, I believe it is expected that they will die slowly but surely. So why did "expert" described them as swimming happily when the right conditions are not provided? Could "expert" understand shrimp language?

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## thxpro98

this thread have many missing holes here and there. anything can happen inbetween. not by just the conversation itself . calls or meet up etc etc
Anyway from the conversation between the seller and buyer, it show that the buyer didnt say yes or no if Bkk can be kept with fan. but he just merely refered another hobbyist in example that his bkk survive with fan.
This statement alone is not enough to say whos wrong/guilty.
and looking at the chat the seller just type out what he wanted to say . from 17.40-17.41 is under a min. i dun think he is avoiding the question if whether BKK can breed without fan.
And from 17.41-20.55 there is a huge time gap.
with so less info on a third party view, In my opinion i dun think is nice to jump into conclusions and start flaming the seller.
i am not trying to be defensive to anyone , but till concrete evidence is found then we can say the seller is making a quick buck right?.
one is innocent till proven guilty right? 

And frankly speaking i myself a newbie is having troubles in keeping Bkk/panda. i lost 5 out of 11 due to my water parameters. even though three is berried and one just release the eggs a day ago i doubt the chance of shrimplet survival is high.
Those new to shrimps should read more and gaining experience before moving on to BKK.

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## eviltrain

Aiyoh. How come you all say like the buyer sound like a super noob?

The screen shot doesn't mean anything lo. So many loopholes. 

You can actually delete PART of the chat and make it the way how you wants it to sound.

Base on the time stamp, they were chatting between 17.39 to 17.41 and suddenly jump to 20.55

What we know is part 1/5-2/5-4/5. We dont know anything about 3/5-5/5.

The expert himeself also post in huizhong's thread ASKED him to get a chiller asap. 

TS 's friend also weird la. Need answer ask himself lo. Still need to bother TS. See la. TS lazy until post screenshot to entertain us nia. -.- 

hopefully TS friend will just come forward and carify the whole thing. 

-so drama-

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## thxpro98

> Aiyoh. How come you all say like the buyer sound like a super noob?
> 
> The screen shot doesn't mean anything lo. So many loopholes. 
> 
> You can actually delete PART of the chat and make it the way how you wants it to sound.
> 
> Base on the time stamp, they were chatting between 17.39 to 17.41 and suddenly jump to 20.55
> 
> What we know is part 1/5-2/5-4/5. We dont know anything about 3/5-5/5.
> ...


aiyo i dont mean that way .. but very hurting for the seller cos no hard truth facts about this sales and what happen . 

and personally think that newbies like me shouldnt jump straight into BKK.. and let them suffer  :Crying: 

must wait for TS's friend to step forward ..

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## eviltrain

Paiseh paiseh. Im refering to broo binniez la. Just that you posted earlier than me.

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## globalcookie

I won't harp on the time lapse, maybe the party busy, maybe forgotten, maybe.

However, how can anyone try to suggest bkk can be kept at Singapore's room temperature with only a fan? In that case, can i also make claims CRS can breed out flowerhead in room temperature? Only newbie will be taken in, as they trust the seasoned hobbyists or the so-called experts.

This thread should set a good example to newbies to read up, do your research, and not blindly believe claims.

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## binniez

Since there are so many doubts and seller is on this thread, why does he not want to come in to clarify and defend himself? If there are really missing parts that seller feels that could prove his innocence then he should post the missing parts like what TS did. But like wad Avex30 said, if seller knows how to pack ice below the tub when delivering shrimps then he should have know better than to give that kind of example. The first reply to buyer's question should be to advise buyer to get chiller before buying just like how Huizhong was advised to buy a chiller. 

If seller is given the benefit of doubt then TS should also be given the benefit of doubt that he is indeed new to bkk keeping. In any other case, based on the last message, seller in the end still decided to sell to TS despite knowing that he has no chiller and that the bkk would most probably perish in one way or another. In this case, I feel that it wouldn't be too much to say that seller only cared about making a few quick bucks and decided to ignore the fact the the shrimps would most probably die. In this scenario, even if seller had advised that the shrimps needed chiller in between the missing parts, seller was still unethical in the end as he sent the shrimps to the maker in exchange for a quick buck.

In any other case, I feel that most bros here would not sell shrimps to buyers that they knew had no means to take good care of them and make them thrive. Most of us are shrimp lovers here and I believe that most of us would try to avoid the scenario as much as possible.

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## felix_fx2

> i think he keep in aircon.. can't be in room temperature... hahha... if he can survive keeping bbk using fan, we can all throw our expensive chiller..hahha


Don't throw. Give to me haha.
Actually, can survive cannot breed and color become sad case.

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## thxpro98

Seeing is believing but however we guys from the forum never saw the transaction or what did they talk about . Without knowing the truth and whole story and just directly base on what we saw in a third party perspective to interpret that he is making a quick buck. 

In my opinion , shouldn't we wait for TS's friend to clarify and then further discuss with the proper evidence ?

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## thxpro98

> Paiseh paiseh. Im refering to broo binniez la. Just that you posted earlier than me.


Hehe nvm I tot is me .. :Sad:

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## avex30

> avex30 bro, could it be communication problem? TS and the real seller.
> "Can be kept using fan, but best to have chiller as conditions are much better."
> 
> Everyone does have a tendency to hear what they wish to hear (hope you can get what Im conveying)


This i have to agree even sometimes i am like that human have the tendency of choosing or reading in between the lines which might cause alot of inconvience to themselves and others. That why TS got to really show everything out in order to justify that bro Newlife did indeed say keeping under fan condition is possible. As i have a talk with a HIGH knowleadge uncle (who still perfer to be known as mysterious well connected uncle hahahaha actually i also uncle la but he look more like a ROCKER to me  :Razz: )just this early week he too agree that sometimes what we post isn't what the reader interpret as that where alot of miscommunication come in.........




> Well even without the rest of the story, the seller could have just said yes or no when asked a simple question on if the bkk needed a chiller or not. Why did he have to go tell story that implies that bkk don't need a chiller? Normally people who avoid questions have either something to hide or is out to try to sway opinion. And if he is dealing with a very eager newbie, that would usually help make up the newbie's mind pretty easily as he is using the very good sales pitch of telling the customer what he wants to hear, not what reality might be.


Yes bro chee i agree but it sorta of contridicting isn't it? a newbie shouldn't he at least do some homework isn't it that way? That sometimes some of us have been slamming newbie for not doing their homework and come here to ask this and that?? If the so call newbie (which i hope he really is and not some clone whom appear once in a blue moon to tanish another name) have at least find out he would not have believe whatever that is mention by Bro newlife. Yes i agree some people are born with the sales mouth they can literately tell you alot of things that is even out of the specs. So if you really bought it and it end up otherwise can we blame the sales? I doubt so right we will normally curse like hell that the best unless we really want to pursuit till small claim court. So i guess if there was ever a transation between Bro newlife and the invisible buyer than i think we can only say it take 2 hand to clap. If the buyer did his homework and bro newlife did make those comment than he would have know on the spot that bro newlife is doing a sales pitch and on a not very responsible ways in another words taking him the invisible buyer for a huge ride around singapore.

But however if the transation did not go thru than i'm really curious what this post is all about since he did not buy and no shrimp dead is he posting here to warn others of it or otherwise? The motive? The objective?

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## eviltrain

Yah lo yah lo. Something like i tell others 

" you can keep shrimps without and and chiller " 

" unless your tank is in aircon room "

If you see the first sentence only, will you think something wrong with me?

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## cheetf

> Yes bro chee i agree but it sorta of contridicting isn't it? a newbie shouldn't he at least do some homework isn't it that way? That sometimes some of us have been slamming newbie for not doing their homework and come here to ask this and that?? If the so call newbie (which i hope he really is and not some clone whom appear once in a blue moon to tanish another name) have at least find out he would not have believe whatever that is mention by Bro newlife. Yes i agree some people are born with the sales mouth they can literately tell you alot of things that is even out of the specs. So if you really bought it and it end up otherwise can we blame the sales? I doubt so right we will normally curse like hell that the best unless we really want to pursuit till small claim court. So i guess if there was ever a transation between Bro newlife and the invisible buyer than i think we can only say it take 2 hand to clap. If the buyer did his homework and bro newlife did make those comment than he would have know on the spot that bro newlife is doing a sales pitch and on a not very responsible ways in another words taking him the invisible buyer for a huge ride around singapore.
> 
> But however if the transation did not go thru than i'm really curious what this post is all about since he did not buy and no shrimp dead is he posting here to warn others of it or otherwise? The motive? The objective?


That is why I said an eager newbie, meaning those that want to keep bkk but they don't have chiller. They know that it might not be possible to keep them without chillers but being a newbie they are not 100% sure. These people are sitting on the fence and when an experienced keeper say that it can be done accompanied with a example, they will think they also can do it. That is the power of telling the customer what he wants to hear. 

Through this event the evidence so far has been that the expert has been saying that bkk can be kept with a fan. Where is the evidence that says otherwise? As you say it takes 2 hands to clap. So if there have been any omissions it can easily be clarified by the other side of the screenshot. If the expert says he doesn't keep any records then it will be up to him to prove the evidence is of suspect.


Motive of it only the TS will know.

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## Yulbrainer

It is obvious that ts have a feud with the seller.
And somehow keep trying to bug seller till seller also tired and fall into this issue.
I know the seller rep, he is a good guy. This time he might be slipped into a 'trap'.
His word is blown up to make this issue.

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## cheetf

> Yah lo yah lo. Something like i tell others 
> 
> " you can keep shrimps without and and chiller " 
> 
> " unless your tank is in aircon room "
> 
> If you see the first sentence only, will you think something wrong with me?


Yah, I would think, what is this fella trying to say???? Hahaha

The expert has his side of the evidence too. Nobody is stopping him from posting it. Is there something more to hide?

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## cheetf

> It is obvious that ts have a feud with the seller.
> And somehow keep trying to bug seller till seller also tired and fall into this issue.
> I know the seller rep, he is a good guy. This time he might be slipped into a 'trap'.
> His word is blown up to make this issue.


That is an assumption.

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## eviltrain

Thats the problem when we spoonfeed the newbies too much until they are too lazy to find out more.

I know the feeling of people keep asking me keeping crs in what parameters, i even posted on my sales thread what parameters i kept them at. 

The previous post i post is "fan and chiller"

----------


## felix_fx2

> Thats the problem when we spoonfeed the newbies too much until they are too lazy to find out more.
> 
> I know the feeling of people keep asking me keeping crs in what parameters, i even posted on my sales thread what parameters i kept them at. 
> 
> The previous post i post is "fan and chiller"


Alot people grow up spoonfed.
ET , you see how often I tell newbies to search the forum. Then think how many really do.

OT abit: more then half of "new to planted" I met. They feel no co2 injection plants cannot be kept.
Hey, I used to feel same way.  :Smile:  

It is very common to listen what we want to. I doubt newlife nor is TS is wrong. It is just maybe just clarify the sales for TS. (unless it is a flame-clone)

----------


## hyun007

> It is very common to listen what we want to. I doubt newlife nor is TS is wrong. It is just maybe just clarify the sales for TS. (unless it is a flame-clone)


I have the feeling that it might be the later.
Phone number of the seller was not even edited out!!!

----------


## avex30

> That is why I said an eager newbie, meaning those that want to keep bkk but they don't have chiller. They know that it might not be possible to keep them without chillers but being a newbie they are not 100% sure. These people are sitting on the fence and when an experienced keeper say that it can be done accompanied with a example, they will think they also can do it. That is the power of telling the customer what he wants to hear. 
> 
> Through this event the evidence so far has been that the expert has been saying that bkk can be kept with a fan. Where is the evidence that says otherwise? As you say it takes 2 hands to clap. So if there have been any omissions it can easily be clarified by the other side of the screenshot. If the expert says he doesn't keep any records then it will be up to him to prove the evidence is of suspect.
> 
> 
> Motive of it only the TS will know.


Yes precisely a saleman will always do their sales pitch 1 sales close mean 1 more commission. It up to the buyer to protect themselves that alot of such issue happen be it here selling shrimps or in the outside world selling every other things. Look at the small claims court they also can't protect each case all they can do is call for both party to meetup and resolve. It is we as buyer that need to protect our own pocket if we choose to be ignorant and depend on the sales person to tell us then we most likely will be buying alot of stuff which doesn't serve up to expectation like the salesman claim. 

A newbie all this while most of the old timers have been trying to educate newbies to read up to research up. Yes one can be desperate cause he want BKK "WANT very much" but if he did a research and know jolly well that it is totally or mere impossible to keep them alive for long without a chiller than he should choose not to go ahead until he get chiller or something. 

Yes it is up to bro newlife to defense himself if he still have the apps conversation going on... But not many people keep track a know a few seller whom doesn't why simple IPHONE sucks when you have too much message it will lag like hell and as a frequently seller he could have many or tonne of sms or apps msg coming in this is lagging like hell. It goes the same some seller already sell below the prices yet there is still low baller trying his or her luck. I know of a seller whom not only don't keep track of sms or apps message any dealing with him is always over a call etc. They trust their buyer truthfulness to get the shrimps but never expect some pretending and setup a trap. All i can say it more like dirty politics. 

Example why some people knowing jolly well they can't afford a car but yet go ahead and sign one just to have the car TOW off by the bank?? Show off? Woo gals? Cause his peer have it he also must have??

What is going on with the buyer mind only he or her knows. What is the whole idea of TS posting this and appear here and there mean only he know the best. Someone who felt they nearly got cheated will they just come here to post abit here and there post a few mere reply and some apps capture evidence and disappear into thin air?? Look at some of those thread of people whom felt cheated buyer write long compostion seller reply back same but here hmmm alittle too calm?? Like test the water in AQ let the rest argue till the world ends?? Hmm fishy motive i must say if this is in the entertainment industry it might be call creating a profile so that people will take note of them or their new launch. Here what is the purpose? TS is not even clarify no matter how busy he is able to dig something to post and dig out the apps to show my best bet is he sitting there laughing his arse off at bunch of us. Indirectly mocking everyone??

----------


## cheetf

Yup, think we should keep quiet and let the TS and the expert come out and say something. No point we keep guessing.

----------


## binniez

Hmmm.. Not too sure why they are not responding. But TS last activity was 18th Nov 2011 16:40 whereas seller last activity was Yesterday (19 Nov) 20:21 which is just a few hours back. Am curious since seller should be subscribed to thread, why isn't he defending himself either? Isn't it normal for someone who feels that he is being wronged to clear his name at the very first instance? If indeed he has proof of the missing parts in the message, he should at least post it out to prevent more speculation and misunderstanding from happening. Hope either party can respond so as to clear up the misunderstanding if there is any.

----------


## felix_fx2

This is getting stagnant.
Why iPhone lag? I never delete sms since day 1, open too many app same time.

But login don't mean need to do anything. Tons of times I login Aq on pc and end up playing game.

----------


## thxpro98

> This is getting stagnant.
> Why iPhone lag? I never delete sms since day 1, open too many app same time.
> 
> But login don't mean need to do anything. Tons of times I login Aq on pc and end up playing game.


hehehe i agree with you on this one.. everytime i open web browser i open AQ but ended up playing my own game .. kekeke.

i think we should really wait for the buyer and seller to step forward. there are alot of ways this issue can branch out.

----------


## eviltrain

They may even had settle the problem outside the forum without us knowing. 

Huat ah! 家和万事兴

----------


## cheetf

True. But if incident did happen, newbies please do your homework. Don't rush into it.

----------


## avex30

> This is getting stagnant.
> Why iPhone lag? I never delete sms since day 1, open too many app same time.
> 
> But login don't mean need to do anything. Tons of times I login Aq on pc and end up playing game.


Bro with watsapps and the chat and photo sent over whatsapps i can tell it lag like hell sometimes it take me 5 min to load and like you i will end up playing games. Anyway like i say i felt like be mock at so let all not speculate or guess or argue shall wait for a conclusion or maybe this thread will just fade away.

----------


## newlife

To Any bros who wanted me dead flat...especially bro binniez who have been keeping close to my movement...and bro cheef who have been a talking model in this thread..

Answer to all this lead...will be provided soon...
Don't worry...

----------


## cheetf

Been waiting very long already.

----------


## avex30

> Been waiting very long already.


Haha Bro Chee look like more evidence is showing from another point of view.......... let stop mawing on each other 1st and see what is this all about. I believe it will be a nice showdown.

----------


## newlife

> Been waiting very long already.


You hurry to see me dead flat...????

----------


## newlife

> Haha Bro Chee look like more evidence is showing from another point of view.......... let stop mawing on each other 1st and see what is this all about. I believe it will be a nice showdown.


You are right!!!

----------


## cheetf

> You hurry to see me dead flat...????


If you want to think that way I cannot stop you.

----------


## eviltrain

> Been waiting very long already.


i know how you feel, its like watching Taiwan drama and everyday it just end suddenly. 吊胃口.

----------


## newlife

Patience...
Trimming here & there leads to many...

Bro Cheef..when things turn out..I should buy you a Big drinks..
Reason??? For pushing me find out so much...And going in deep into this matter...

Anyway...frankly speaking...this issue doesnt really affect me...

----------


## felix_fx2

> Bro with watsapps and the chat and photo sent over whatsapps i can tell it lag like hell sometimes it take me 5 min to load and like you i will end up playing games. Anyway like i say i felt like be mock at so let all not speculate or guess or argue shall wait for a conclusion or maybe this thread will just fade away.


I should add you haha. Help you lag more  :Smile: 
This will be another mark in google to search "bkk fan only".

----------


## cheetf

> Patience...
> Trimming here & there leads to many...
> 
> Bro Cheef..when things turn out..I should buy you a Big drinks..
> Reason??? For pushing me find out so much...And going in deep into this matter...
> 
> Anyway...frankly speaking...this issue doesnt really affect me...


Yah maybe you should.

----------


## veggie

Okie. I am kinda of sad and damm angry when I see this tread. This post is to the TS. 
Let me ask you a few question

1: why your friend can't post and you need to post for him or her? ( don't tell me you never tell your friend there is this site which you can get more info about shrimps? )

2: when we start a tread here is to find out a solution to solve the problem or to warn hobbiest about the problem you are facing. But from the start till now you only post 4post. ( hey you are here to stir shit? )

To me you start this tread is to make all AQ guys fighting each other, and there you are happily watching show. To me you are here to make everybody piss of with everybody. This is not a hobby should be like.

----------


## newlife

> Yah maybe you should.


When will you be available?

----------


## felix_fx2

Veggie bro,

Fact is alot people may Act like that. We should not flame TS that manner as truth is not known. If it was really a flame-clone, you getting angry clone owner will be much much happier.

I do feel strongly the storms make hobbyist even stronger. Now their talking about going to "la kopi" (for the benefit of non dialect group. It mean going drink coffee).

I may not belong to shrimp keeper. But the bros we have really seem to be a poisonous large group.

----------


## cheetf

> When will you be available?


Dunno man, very busy. No choice, have to work hard for my money. I got no bkk or prl for sale.

By the way, still waiting.

----------


## thxpro98

> Veggie bro,
> 
> Fact is alot people may Act like that. We should not flame TS that manner as truth is not known. If it was really a flame-clone, you getting angry clone owner will be much much happier.
> 
> I do feel strongly the storms make hobbyist even stronger. Now their talking about going to "la kopi" (for the benefit of non dialect group. It mean going drink coffee).
> 
> I may not belong to shrimp keeper. But the bros we have really seem to be a poisonous large group.


the time that i am here, all the seniors who helped me, guide me.. super friendly bros. which thanks to them i could keep shrimps now. hehe but they super poisonous..

----------


## Yulbrainer

> Okie. I am kinda of sad and damm angry when I see this tread. This post is to the TS. 
> Let me ask you a few question
> 
> 1: why your friend can't post and you need to post for him or her? ( don't tell me you never tell your friend there is this site which you can get more info about shrimps? )
> 
> 2: when we start a tread here is to find out a solution to solve the problem or to warn hobbiest about the problem you are facing. But from the start till now you only post 4post. ( hey you are here to stir shit? )
> 
> To me you start this tread is to make all AQ guys fighting each other, and there you are happily watching show. To me you are here to make everybody piss of with everybody. This is not a hobby should be like.


Agree bro. Some seller are not only want to earn money, they share knowledge and hapiness of the hobby.
But some are wickedly try to earn money with all possible way available.

----------


## veggie

Bro Felix, from what I see the TS is trying to stir shit. What is the point of posting a screenshot and then go behind the certain??? When leading all AQ bro & sis it is that guy? I want him to step out right now and explain, as you see what had happen now. All because he just leave some stupid screenshot with no head and tail. Cause so guys like me I don't like to SMS too.(as I don't really like to SMS too ) If he want just ask his friend to say who is the seller Lor?

----------


## veggie

Bro Felix,

from what I see the TS is trying to stir shit. What is the point of posting a screenshot and then go behind the certain??? When leading all AQ bro & sis it is that guy? I want him to step out right now and explain, as you see what had happen now. All because he just leave some stupid screenshot with no head and tail. Cause so guys like me I don't like to SMS too.(as I don't really like to SMS too ) If he want just ask his friend to say who is the seller Lor?

----------


## binniez

> To Any bros who wanted me dead flat...especially bro binniez who have been keeping close to my movement...and bro cheef who have been a talking model in this thread..
> 
> Answer to all this lead...will be provided soon...
> Don't worry...


I would like to point out something here.Seeing you dead does not benefit me. I do not belong to any group here neither am I TS's friend. Just solely here to express my views here based on the kind of bizzare examples that you give and what are your views and ethics on shrimp hobby regardless of whether it is based on making a quick buck or genuine interest.

My piece having said, regardless of whether this matters to you or not, its your choice. U might say that you are framed but if you do not prove yourself because you are not affected then so be it. But how others would view you is another matter. Like what you said, if you think I am wanting to see you dead flat, then so be it. I am not affected here and neither do I think that I need explain further. =)

----------


## felix_fx2

Murder unlawful. :P
Everyone also express how they think.
Soon all will be drinking kopi at the kopitiam near GC haha.

3am. Zzzzz.

----------


## cheetf

Still waiting.

----------


## stormhawk

The thread starter has a history of being a troll, as evidenced by his previous posts in other flame fests involving 1-2 other sellers, primarily berber and his obvious taunt to ZackZhou in a separate thread. If he or his imaginary friend has a problem with the re-seller or sellers, he/she ought not to muck things up on this forum. The claims about using fan to keep and successfully breed BKK is obviously false without some environmental conditions being tweaked and he/she being someone who knows at least the basics of shrimp keeping should know this better.

What is the purpose of dragging a seller's name through the mud, even if he/she made false claims just to sell his items? We get fed false information all the time just to make us buy things that we really don't need, what's the difference? What about those people who sell damaged goods via sales threads? As always, caveat emptor aka buyer beware. I am not taking sides here but the thread starter's previous actions have more than certified the probability that it is a flame-clone account.

----------


## avex30

> Veggie bro,
> 
> Fact is alot people may Act like that. We should not flame TS that manner as truth is not known. If it was really a flame-clone, you getting angry clone owner will be much much happier.
> 
> I do feel strongly the storms make hobbyist even stronger. Now their talking about going to "la kopi" (for the benefit of non dialect group. It mean going drink coffee).
> 
> I may not belong to shrimp keeper. But the bros we have really seem to be a poisonous large group.


 
Alamak you know got la kopi session you never notify us to go join in........ Can share DIY what.

----------


## cheetf

> The thread starter has a history of being a troll, as evidenced by his previous posts in other flame fests involving 1-2 other sellers, primarily berber and his obvious taunt to ZackZhou in a separate thread. If he or his imaginary friend has a problem with the re-seller or sellers, he/she ought not to muck things up on this forum. The claims about using fan to keep and successfully breed BKK is obviously false without some environmental conditions being tweaked and he/she being someone who knows at least the basics of shrimp keeping should know this better.
> 
> What is the purpose of dragging a seller's name through the mud, even if he/she made false claims just to sell his items? We get fed false information all the time just to make us buy things that we really don't need, what's the difference? What about those people who sell damaged goods via sales threads? As always, caveat emptor aka buyer beware. I am not taking sides here but the thread starter's previous actions have more than certified the probability that it is a flame-clone account.


Well, I am glad that you brought the name berber up. As we all know in this forum, there was a big hoo haa in the forum with regards to him selling less than desired quality shrimp to one of our forum members for a rather exorbitant price. And now, we have been enlightened to be more careful of this type of seller and their behavior. As a shrimp keeper, I think it there is nothing wrong with what the TS did by bringing up the matter to our attention, however by bringing it up as a clone account is questionable. 

Yah, as always we hide behind the term caveat emptor, but if you can increase the buyer's awareness by proof of such activities, is it wrong? Would you rather go through the trade with more information that might help you or just accept the fact that there are always false claims. 

At the moment the one side of the story is out. The proof that the TS is a clone still does not exclude the seller from proving that he did not really do what he did. He has been given an open mic to voice his innocence. And of course we are still waiting. The fact now is, there is one side with some sort of proof and we are eagerly waiting for the other. As I have been informed, the seller has done lots of work to find the answers even though it means nothing to him.

----------


## veggie

Hi mod stormhawk.

If he really is a clone, are you guys going to do something about it?

----------


## veggie

Hi mod stormhawk,

So is there any answer form you guys about the clone account?

----------


## cheetf

> Patience...
> Trimming here & there leads to many...
> 
> Bro Cheef..when things turn out..I should buy you a Big drinks..
> Reason??? For pushing me find out so much...And going in deep into this matter...
> 
> Anyway...frankly speaking...this issue doesnt really affect me...


Where is this evidence that you worked so hard to show? Still waiting....

----------


## kenny

How come so many CSI wannabes?

----------


## eviltrain

You don't want to know the truth meh? Hehe

Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk

----------


## cheetf

Drama must have ending mah.

----------


## binniez

> What is the purpose of dragging a seller's name through the mud, even if he/she made false claims just to sell his items? We get fed false information all the time just to make us buy things that we really don't need, what's the difference? What about those people who sell damaged goods via sales threads? As always, caveat emptor aka buyer beware. I am not taking sides here but the thread starter's previous actions have more than certified the probability that it is a flame-clone account.


Hi Stormhawk, I believe that if you were given a false information which resulted in your decision to purchase something, you would also feel angry at the unethical seller who sold you that item. Would you want to go back to complain or warn your fellow friends about this particular seller or item? For those who sold damaged goods in this forum, don't we have a investigation thread to handle these? In real life, there is always CASE or small claims tribunal court to manage these cases. But over here in forum, the moderators do not have legal power to judge cases and pass sentences. What we can judge on to protect ourselves when making purchases is based on these whistle blowing threads and sellers reputation. 

Because of these warning threads, we become more aware of things that are happening and thus would then learn to exercise our caution and research more when we are making purchases. Just imagine the real life scenario if someone was conned and he/she kept silent about it thus allowing the scammer to be able to scam others. I would not put this as a political thread pulling the seller thru the mud but rather a whistleblowing thread that can aid to warn others. Even if the buyer had not purchase anything from the seller, there is still an issue of false information given as per the screenshots of conversation provided.

Of course I am not mentioning that bro Newlife is a scammer or such. He is not guilty until the moment he is proven to be. I believe most of us are still waiting for his part to prove himself innocent and his reputation or if there was any misunderstanding in between.

----------


## stormhawk

Hello chee,

I accept that some people may be selling me items on the basis of false claims, just like how I get wrong advice when I first went to an LFS as a child, where the shopkeeper would tell me this and that just to get my parents to buy what I wanted, but did not need. Same thing applies here. If newlife made such claims, the TS's friend should have done his own homework to know that it is not possible with some tweaks and changes in the environment. Reference in those chat screenies that vynax posted was that of HuiZhong's claims that he could keep BKK with fan. A person with basic knowledge of shrimps would know that it is near impossible to do so, given how sensitive these BKK are. 

I did not say vynax was a clone, but I said it is probable that he is one of such clones. Again I must reiterate, I am not taking sides in this thread. What I posted is my personal opinion, and not the collective opinion of the moderators. We all should live and let live. Why must there always be flame fests on the forums? Drama aside, I understand that it is good to have such discussive threads from time to time, but not when personal attacks come into play.

To veggie,

That will be decided in time. I am still waiting for vynax to state his true intentions and for newlife to state his side of the story if he so wishes.

To robin,

I understand your point of view, but as I already mentioned, with or without such threads, people ought to make decisions based on their judgement. If they err and make a mistake in buying an item from an unethical seller, that is entirely their fault for taking what the seller said on face value, and not doing their checking beforehand. For example, if I made a mistake and bought a broken filter from a seller in this forum, am I wrong? I would say yes, because no.1, it is 2nd hand and there is no way of telling whether it is faulty or not to begin with, if I did not insist on a test beforehand. Same with shrimps. If you're buying from someone, you would ask for the conditions etc to successfully keep them, but not everyone has the same luck even with the same conditions. YMMV or "Your mileage may vary" has always been true to me. I can give an animal the best conditions and yet it will die on me if something goes wrong somewhere.

Everyone is guilty of unethical behavior from time to time when it comes to selling. My friend once warned a prospective buyer that the fish he wanted are sensitive and need certain conditions to thrive, yet the buyer bought them anyway and blamed my friend when they die. So who is unethical here? The seller, or the buyer? There's always 2 sides of a coin and what is discomforting to me is how the TS can post easily editable screenshots to support his claims. If all he wanted to ask is whether BKK can survive with or without fan, he already has his answers in the first few posts.

In this case, I am still wondering what is vynax's true intentions, other than asking what seems to be an "innocent" question on behalf of his friend, which may or not be imaginary to begin with.

----------


## felix_fx2

> Drama must have ending mah.


Very likely.
I take side with the poor shrimp.  :Smile:

----------


## newlife

Dear bro cheef and bro binniez....

If this issue can be easily solved or find out....I won't be waiting for so long to provide you guys with the response.
And you guys are not in my shoes....and YOU do not know the taste of it.
All You guys know is only pressing me for an immediate answer to you.
Why do i say "you guy waiting to see me dead"?
It's all from the words and response YOU post in this thread!
"unethical seller","false information","scammer"," conned"
And "I'm still waiting"....."I'm still waiting"..."I'm still waiting"...
Ask yourself...you are waiting for TS to provide the missing text? Or waiting for me to give an explanation for you guys to bombard me with thousand and millions of question?why?what?...etc etc...

Be RIGHT or be WRONG.....the surface purpose of this opening this thread is already very obvious....
Reputution down or what...All AQ member who have been reading this thread can choose to beware of buying or dealing with me. I will still post my shrimp for sales...I'll still post some nice collection Of mine...I won't hide or withdraw. And let me tell you....my recent sales post...people still response and purchase. If anyone thinks that I'm a "unethical seller" & "provide wrong information"...I don't mind them to criticize or don't mind anyone spreading about my "SPOILT REP" to prevent my sales at Marketplace.

Cheef & Binniez....let me ask you...Party A bought some shrimp from me....and regularly a 3rd party will call party A to check if the shrimp Which he bought from me "DROP COLOR" or not? 
-what is the purpose for 3rd party to do this?Can you answer me?
(This is base on a TRUE INCIDENT)

Do I need to open a thread to point out names??? I don't think there is a need.....Why? 
Reason: Its just a hobby...and there's no need to point out names in thread to make a BIG HOO HAA!
I know As long the quality of the shrimp is good....I don't need to bother about all this people doing 小动作 behind people just to find chance to pin me down!

Quote you another TRUE incident...my buyer bought some shrimps from me...out of nowhere XXXXXX person will have his way to know that this person bought shrimp from me. What he did???? Called up my buyer to counter quote a lower price....after quoting....will add in..."erm....think you better don't buy from me la....don't want to snatch Newlife sales! 
-Can you tell me the purpose of his act???

To T.S or whoever it may concern...let me tell you...This incident in fact taught me to beware of 小人....who will find dirty ways to spoilt or pull my rep down. But I'm sorry to all "WHO WANT TO SEE ME FLAT"....this incident makes me STRONGER and look down on those who did this act to me. 

BINNIEZ & CHEEF....in this world...humans are selfish and greedy. And will follow where the wind goes...anything that benefit a person....a person will cover his conscience and support a person even if he has done a Cheat in forum or provide wrong info or have a record of *unethical seller* terribily before. Anyone that can benefit a person will be treated like a GOD even if seller have a BAD record!
-If this down bottom screw up reputation seller posted his shrimp at a extreme low price...you guys still hesitate to buy from your so call "unethical seller"??? Touch your heart!!!

I believe most of AQ shrimp hobbyist have a AF account too...I invited a good experience Taiwanese Shrimp Hobbyist to AF and share his collection. He even share his set up and explain how his tank system works....
End up? Zap his reputation down till "Under Moderation".
Can you explain why this happen when a experience oversea guys willingly to share but yet end up "under moderation"?
"RED EYE"? "SORE EYE"? Or????
Some guys here will know the reason...no need me to say out.
All I can do....??? Is to apologies to my Taiwan friend....
And I felt disgrace....that SG forum is at this standard! Stabbing here and there! Planing plot and gathering manpower to kick off people that is a sore in their eyes!
Just to add on....the person I invited is Vin_fish from Taiwan!
Anyone doesn't know can search thru his thread and see what have he done wrong to deserve this!!!!

All I can say to both of you now...我心里没有鬼....我不是走后门的...
I did nothing wrong at all....
You guys can jolly well....spread or warn your khakis not to deal with me. I doesn't lose a piece of fresh at all.
I don't earn a living with a $30/pc shrimp.

And whether both of you...is trying to go against me...you yourself knows better then anyone.
And I don't think i need explain to both of you at all.
Thru out this incident that happened....I have already communicate and find out with that "TS Friend"...
Everything have been reported to AQ Moderators.

And lastly....same thing.....I'm also waiting for T.S....dear Bro Vynax response....

*if anyone feel offended or uneasy with this reply I made....do feel free to call me up @ 93884666...24/7...my doors are always open.

----------


## newlife

And bro binniez....
What I quote about HuiZhong BKK kept in fan is just a example I met to share...
You can check on HuiZhong thread on what I post or check with HuiZhong whether if I offer to loan him my spare chiller!!!
Why I quote on him is not because of pushing the blame to him if buyer BKK died without keeping in chiller.

I just find it interesting to share with people someone really made it keeping without chiller + feeding with goldfish food!
Why interesting to share???
YOU GO AND ASK AROUND.....HOW MANY HOBBYIST KEEP BKK IN CHILLER TANK YET STILL GO DEAD!!!!
So do u think it's interesting to share HuiZhong non-chiller case compare to those hobbyist with chiller who can't even keep them survive for days???

HuiZhong case is my 1st time hearing...and I just share around with people who happen to chat with.

Binniez....what you indicate in the reply...is it trying to caused fire between me and HuiZhong?
And let me indicate here....HuiZhong did not buy any shrimp from me....but me and him is in a good talking term with jokes and laughter!

Anyone can contact or pm HuiZhong...and ask him whether if I offer him my spare chiller...when I never even see him before...even if he did not buy anything from me. 

Please don't try to be a judge to gauge a person thinking that my purpose is to let buyer blame HuiZhong instead of me if the BKK died.
My advise to you...."Kiang Jiu Ho,Mai Kay Kiang"(in dialect).
And don't come cause 1 more fire between me and HuiZhong.
If you really like to cause for flame burning and spreading...test it on yourself to me...
Understand? 
Give you one more sentence...
"Never eat chilli before,you never know chilli is hot"
Got it? Dial me up if you want bigger flame or taste chilli....

Do your homework....check HuiZhong thread...before talking so big and create 心病 for others to me..bro...

And rembember to check how many bro KK died in a chiller tank too...don't forget ya.

----------


## cheetf

Sigh.... Again a lot of smoke, threats, assumptions, irrelevant examples of other people and yet no evidence. 

If you want to start a thread and complain about these other people go ahead. It will be good for us too. But please remember to post some evidence to support your complaint. Otherwise it's slander.

By the way, I am still waiting......

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## felix_fx2

Bro chee, 1 man talking is no use when the other party make so small post. It still will not clear his name to some bros here. Only will make him more piss as people don't believe what he say.

So long as TS does not step up to clarify, everyone still will point 1 finger at newlife and have the other still pointing back at oneself.

Bro newlife, please stay on the thread. I do not say your right, but it is hard to not to wrong for never covering your *** from needless fire such as this.

Btw: I stopped going to AF since many moons ago. This is the very type of reason. Too many think AF is Hwz. Keyboard hero.

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## newlife

> Sigh.... Again a lot of smoke, threats, assumptions, irrelevant examples of other people and yet no evidence. 
> 
> If you want to start a thread and complain about these other people go ahead. It will be good for us too. But please remember to post some evidence to support your complaint. Otherwise it's slander.
> 
> By the way, I am still waiting......


Maybe opening a thread about complaining will be only good for you.....
I'm not born a stirrer nor a women mouth...

Wait...keep waiting....

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## newlife

> Bro chee, 1 man talking is no use when the other party make so small post. It still will not clear his name to some bros here. Only will make him more piss as people don't believe what he say.
> 
> So long as TS does not step up to clarify, everyone still will point 1 finger at newlife and have the other still pointing back at oneself.
> 
> Bro newlife, please stay on the thread. I do not say your right, but it is hard to not to wrong for never covering your *** from needless fire such as this.
> 
> Btw: I stopped going to AF since many moons ago. This is the very type of reason. Too many think AF is Hwz. Keyboard hero.


Bro Felix....every single text has been reported to moderator. Some stuff is better to kept unknown for all till T.S appear again....
Hope people who is in this thread understand my situation...and try putting them self in my shoes. But some bros here put words too sarcastic. I'm already in a hot pot....Some bros are assuming and putting words which are of sh*t. Everyone have their patience...a limit....
Frankly speaking...I have been keeping quiet for all those assumption and those like I'm still waiting...etc etc...really piss me off!
Trying a person patience???Or???

船头船尾遇的到....hopefully those bro who have been sarcastic in this thread will meet a situation like this...at least they get to have the feel for it.

Bro Felix....I'll stay in this thread till TS response....
Thanks...

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## binniez

> And bro binniez....
> What I quote about HuiZhong BKK kept in fan is just a example I met to share...
> You can check on HuiZhong thread on what I post or check with HuiZhong whether if I offer to loan him my spare chiller!!!
> Why I quote on him is not because of pushing the blame to him if buyer BKK died without keeping in chiller.
> 
> I just find it interesting to share with people someone really made it keeping without chiller + feeding with goldfish food!
> Why interesting to share???
> YOU GO AND ASK AROUND.....HOW MANY HOBBYIST KEEP BKK IN CHILLER TANK YET STILL GO DEAD!!!!
> So do u think it's interesting to share HuiZhong non-chiller case compare to those hobbyist with chiller who can't even keep them survive for days???
> ...


I say, is this a threat to me and bro chee? This is an open forum, and people are open to discuss. If you can't take it anymore, then don't bother and don't get personal. No point acting like a gangster to jio people to talk it out or carry on insulting others with your "proverbs". If this passes thru the moderator too then I can see where this forum is heading to. Like what you said earlier on, this doesn't mean a thing to you. We are looking at things based on the point of view here. At least I am. Undeniably, yes, bkk can be kept under chillers and yet perish, but from your point of perspective what you are telling others may be interesting to you, but to others they might think that it is an advice from you that it could be possible. At least over here, TS posted a record of your conversation though it is questionable. You were also given the right and option to speak/proof yourself but you choose not to, although you did mentioned that you are in the midst of doing so. Whatever it is, other than insult and threats, you can jolly well say what you want and I can also jolly well say what I want. Whether you are dead or not (like how you want to put it across) is none of my business or non benefitial to me as I am neither doing low balling stuff or neither am I a power breeder/seller who is competing with you for sales.

If you want to bring up and example, you could have done it in a more subtle manner. Why did you need to bring up another forumer's name? Why can't you just say "there is an example of another forumer keeping them without fan and feeding them with goldfish food? Why did you have to mention Huizhong's name? To make it possible for your buyer to search for Huizhong's thread to see for himself that it is possible? If indeed your buyer bought the shrimps and they died and he went to find Huizhong, I'll see if he will still be on good term with you. 

Regardless of everything, how one speak or does reflect entirely on himself. If this is how you want to carry yourself by all means. Its your life and this is an open forum. Although you are writing to me, many others are looking at it too. =)

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## newlife

Anyway bro....
You have your standing point...
I've mine standing point...

If you think I'm talking gangster with you....I'm not...
I'm not educated...not good in English....

Anyway...let put it a stop....
Let moderator investigate and have a outcome...

You can take it as I provide wrong info to buyer....
I think this answer should suit you....

If I offend you....I apologize in thread...,everyone see....
Ok?
Acceptable?

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## felix_fx2

All hush hush can? We all are educated people. Solve this like gentlemen. Mods also observing.

In the end all also hobbyist.

If really clone. I think he laugh at all until roll on floor. This is just what flame clones want. People getting worked up and scolding each other.

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## newlife

> All hush hush can? We all are educated people. Solve this like gentlemen. Mods also observing.
> 
> In the end all also hobbyist.
> 
> If really clone. I think he laugh at all until roll on floor. This is just what flame clones want. People getting worked up and scolding each other.


2 thumbs up....
You are obviously right...

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## cheetf

All hush hush have forum for what then?

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## AlexHcp

Chill to all bro, i have been reading and following this thread and dint make any reply here. I just feel that everybody should just sit back and await what TS has to explain. We are all fellow hobbyist, lover of shrimps - please do not let a few questions, comments and things that a clone account say, spoil our friendship here. 

Cheers.

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## avex30

> All hush hush have forum for what then?


Blast newbiE?? wahahaha nah forum for newbie like me to dig and learn ma but once in awhile participate in raging war..... or post to lend support to make forum active and not a dead city. Make it a better place for newbie like me to learn more stuff lo. 

Words exchange sometimes what we post or type is interpret wrongly and all hell break loose. Due to different background different education level different etc etc. Since mod mention they are looking into it let not mock each other further. However will appreciate if TS will appear to say his point for this not to argue but state why he is doing this. it does since like TS have disappear to thin air??? Maybe the person who show or sent TS that message might like to appear to clarify also........ If you're reading it that is.......... Mr/Miss G______8?

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## felix_fx2

> All hush hush have forum for what then?


Noisy ok, but over the noise limit soon. Else mod close thread all will be for nothing.

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## ZackZhou

> All hush hush have forum for what then?


Yes, we have the forum to discuss and share while you need the forum to satisfy your growing ego.

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## cheetf

> Yes, we have the forum to discuss and share while you need the forum to satisfy your growing ego.


Ego? Who's the one always showing off his shrimps?

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## cheetf

> Noisy ok, but over the noise limit soon. Else mod close thread all will be for nothing.


Noise limit not up to us to decide right?

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## avex30

> Noisy ok, but over the noise limit soon. Else mod close thread all will be for nothing.





> Noise limit not up to us to decide right?


Hahaha i like this comment yea of cause not up to us to decide in real life MOM will step in. In forum well my guess is the mod but i do agree with bro felix too noisy later thread got lock than CSI team cannot continune to investigate liao wahahaha  :Razz:

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## veggie

Right.... All should chill right now and wait for the TS to appear.

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## ZackZhou

Not to back on NewLife, but people who dealed with him before, will know that he talks like that. There is nothing wrong with the way he talks.

Based on the facts in the entire posts, I believe that it will be very difficult to sell Bkk to anyone already. As before you sell, it's your responsibility to ensure the buyer have full knowledge before selling him. Besides the need of chiller, there are other factors too.

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## newlife

> Ego? Who's the one always showing off his shrimps?


Don't show shrimp....show what? 
Insect?
Or topic like this kinda debate which suit you....

Told you Liao lor....
My fault...give false info etc etc....
Correct...
Then you no need keep waiting.....

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## cheetf

> Not to back on NewLife, but people who dealed with him before, will know that he talks like that. There is nothing wrong with the way he talks.
> 
> Based on the facts in the entire posts, I believe that it will be very difficult to sell Bkk to anyone already. As before you sell, it's your responsibility to ensure the buyer have full knowledge before selling him. Besides the need of chiller, there are other factors too.


There is a difference between, buyer having full knowledge and the seller not disclosing the correct information when asked. 

This info is brought to you by 'My BIG inflated ego'

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## felix_fx2

> Don't show shrimp....show what? 
> Insect?
> Or topic like this kinda debate which suit you....
> 
> Told you Liao lor....
> My fault...give false info etc etc....
> Correct...
> Then you no need keep waiting.....


Show rubber ducky scape. All ada2 and rubber ducky.  :Smile: 

Just imagine someone post that. Wha damm epic.

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## ZackZhou

> Ego? Who's the one always showing off his shrimps?


So we cannot always show pictures of our shrimps? 
Then what's the purpose of this hobby? 
So does everyone need to behave like you?
Never showed a single piece of your shrimp and talk so much in this forum about it instead? 
Yes, people will think that you have a big ego and talk too much.

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## avex30

> Show rubber ducky scape. All ada2 and rubber ducky. 
> 
> Just imagine someone post that. Wha damm epic.


Wahaha you can start it  :Razz:  i will sure support the post

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## cheetf

> Don't show shrimp....show what? 
> Insect?
> Or topic like this kinda debate which suit you....
> 
> Told you Liao lor....
> My fault...give false info etc etc....
> Correct...
> Then you no need keep waiting.....


But I am not satisfied. I am waiting for evidence to see that you are innocent. Why you say I want to see you dead?

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## cheetf

> Show rubber ducky scape. All ada2 and rubber ducky. 
> 
> Just imagine someone post that. Wha damm epic.


Got lego thread somewhere. Seen before.

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## newlife

> There is a difference between, buyer having full knowledge and the seller not disclosing the correct information when asked. 
> 
> This info is brought to you by 'My BIG inflated ego'


Ok lor...I already say...I provide wrong info just to earn $.
Cheat newbie.....With craps.....
Mislead...

Swee Bo? Stop la...
What Zack says make sense...I not high educated....I speak like this...
You guys might think that I'm rude....or gangster....but that's the way I talk....must I change to suit you?

Since i already say mislead....provide wrong info to earn $$....
Then ok Liao lor...you also no need to wait....
Ps to keep you waiting too....

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## cheetf

> So we cannot always show pictures of our shrimps? 
> Then what's the purpose of this hobby? 
> So does everyone need to behave like you?
> Never showed a single piece of your shrimp and talk so much in this forum about it instead? 
> Yes, people will think that you have a big ego and talk too much.


Hahaha. Please read properly hor. Where did I say cannot post pictures of shrimps.

Of course you can show off. They are your shrimps and your ego. 

Just as you can do whatever you want I can do what ever I want. 

Also I am not worried about what people think of me. Thank you for your concern, but even my grandmother is not concerned about what people think about me.

By the way, where does it say must show off shrimps to participate in the forum ah?

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## felix_fx2

> Wahaha you can start it  i will sure support the post


Supply me rubber ducky. I put in my unfinished 3 feet take pic. Lol

How come left us few talking during lunch time?

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## avex30

> Supply me rubber ducky. I put in my unfinished 3 feet take pic. Lol


Onz you i got dig my kids toybox hahaha i know there is a few rubber ducky somewhere.

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## felix_fx2

> Onz you i got dig my kids toybox hahaha i know there is a few rubber ducky somewhere.


My god. Really have?
Time to run. Lol

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## newlife

> But I am not satisfied. I am waiting for evidence to see that you are innocent. Why you say I want to see you dead?


????You not satisfied???? Then you expect me to make you satisfied?
I'm sorry to say that I can't....and who do you think you are to expect me to make you satisfied?

Bro...I think overall...is waiting for TS to come....

Or this way la bro.....you tell me what you actually wants la...
I'm really sick and tired....
Admit wrong also sala....
Now not satisified...want the other....

Err....I think better still....as normal.....
Better for you to keep saying "I'm waiting....I'm waiting....."
Sound less irritating.....

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## cheetf

> Ok lor...I already say...I provide wrong info just to earn $.
> Cheat newbie.....With craps.....
> Mislead...
> 
> Swee Bo? Stop la...
> What Zack says make sense...I not high educated....I speak like this...
> You guys might think that I'm rude....or gangster....but that's the way I talk....must I change to suit you?
> 
> Since i already say mislead....provide wrong info to earn $$....
> ...


No need to paiseh. I can wait. 

Also no need to change the way you speak. People love you the way you are. Just one small request. PLEASE DON'T THREATEN ME. I am very dusturbed by threats and may get up in the middle of the night to type replies.

How's your search for the evidence coming along?

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## vinz

In view of the conflict going on in this thread, I am locking it for now and looking into it later.

Having not had the time to read anything, I have this to say:
- Everybody cool down.
- Do NOT start another thread to continue this argument. ANYONE breaking this request of mine will face an immediate suspension.

Thank you.

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## vinz

My impression of this thread:
Lots of speculation.Inconclusive "proof".Some people, whether on purpose on not, were on a witch hunt because they disapprove of someone else's ethics and methods.The last few pages degenerated into a mud fight (with a side show about egos).People getting personal.People getting defensive.People jumping on a single statement and using it as a basis of an attack, when the statement could have been interpreted 3 million other ways.A few immature people *behaving* like gangsters and cowboys. (Speaking like gangster is understandable. Behaving like gangster is not acceptable. There are people who speak like gangster but behave like angels. There are some who speak like educated people, but behave like gangster. There IS a difference.) 

My advice is this:
Do NOT get personal.Do NOT take it personally.Do NOT speculate and add fuel to a flame bait or flame war.Unless you have experimented SCIENTIFICALLY extensively and have SCIENTIFIC conclusions to share, post about your EXPERIENCE and but do NOT treat it has the final word. This hobby has so many variables, I think it is fair to give the benefit of doubt to people who manage to do something no one else could.Give the benefit of doubt, but ask questions to clarify. The real ones will be able to explain and we all learn something new, or truthfully admit they don't know why they succeeded. The charlatans will either disappear or hang themselves while trying to explain.Understand that misunderstandings happens a lot in the internet, so start with the mindset that people are not being evil is a good attitude.Be OPEN MINDED about other people's experience, even if it goes against current "wisdom" or you failed using the same method. Part of the purpose of forums is for people to share their experience, learn from each other and advance the hobby for self and community.Instead of witch hunting, post the correct information to help newbies. Simply because there is no way to know how truthful or the purpose of the postings are.

I would like to thank the few people who were in the thread actively trying to keep things calm.

One of AQ's primary goals is to be a peaceful community where people get along even if they disagree (debate, discuss, accept that the hobby still has many secrets and agree to disagree) and there are no personal attacks. Where people go to find and share experience and information about the hobby and enjoy themselves. However, the community is made up of all sorts of people and some of them are not very nice. It is not possible for AQ to play judge and jury to root such people out, but if you don't get drawn in to play their game, they can't do much harm.

We understand that occasional flare ups are unavoidable, but we will not hesitate to remove members or groups of members who are recalcitrant and regularly disrupt the peace and run counter to the culture of AQ.

This thread will remain closed. Again, do NOT reopen this topic publicly in another thread.

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