# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Catfishes >  Parotocinclus sp. "Peru"

## Ivan

Hi, I just visited Tiong Bahru Ben last Friday and he introduced me with some special Otos which I've never seen before (sorry, I did not take any photo). 

Those Otos are about 1cm but can grow up to 2cm (max) according to Ben. The price for each Otos is around S$10. Would appreciate if any experts can share your view next time when you visit Ben. :Smile:

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## benny

Looks anything like this?



Very few sucker catfishes stays around 3 cm. This is one of them.

Cheers,

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## michael lai

Ivan, the Oto ben was refering to is the zebra Oto. There are 2 very lovely specimen there, the 2 largest ones, you can't miss it. Ignore those that have clip fins or looks listless or sunken tummies.  :Smile: 
By the way, for the catfish lovers out there. Ben has one of the best selection of rare cories for sale now, check it out. You will be pleasantly surprized or go home a very happy man.  :Smile:

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## benny

Zebra oto? They grow up to 6 cm in size. Definitely not 3 cm.

Cheers,

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## michael lai

Well....... :Laughing:   :Grin:  anyway I was there yesterday. The zebras is the only thing in that price 'bracket'.

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## Ivan

> Looks anything like this?
> 
> 
> 
> Very few sucker catfishes stays around 3 cm. This is one of them.
> 
> Cheers,



Yep! That's it!!! He mentioned these Otos came from Peru... :Smile:

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## ciscube

> Ivan, the Oto ben was refering to is the zebra Oto. There are 2 very lovely specimen there, the 2 largest ones, you can't miss it. Ignore those that have clip fins or looks listless or sunken tummies. 
> By the way, for the catfish lovers out there. Ben has one of the best selection of rare cories for sale now, check it out. You will be pleasantly surprized or go home a very happy man.


any greenline cory?

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## valice

For those who are interested in this fish, C328 has about 10... Housed together with the CRS grade As... Left 8 only I think, because I brought home 2...  :Grin:

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## ranmasatome

Took some photos of the buggers today... :Grin: 
Just got 4 of them yesterday..really cute..







Enjoy...

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## genes

Very nice looking otos. Are they as sensitive to water parameters as their zebra cousins?

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## ah^siao

they are even more water sensitive than the zebra otos. try at your own risk

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## ranmasatome

no leh.. mine all okay.. i dont find them sensitive at all..

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## celticfish

the ones i saw were really really small!
i reckon just over one centimeter.
are those the same?

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## ranmasatome

yes.. i make them look big dont i?? thats what i like to do in most of my photos, if you haven't already realised. i like taking small things.

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## celticfish

i think you like small things and view them in GREAT detail...  :Grin:  
thanks for the plants.
the stem ones are doing great but the fan ones need some recovery time.

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## MIZU

> Looks anything like this?
> 
> 
> 
> Very few sucker catfishes stays around 3 cm. This is one of them.
> 
> Cheers,



are they tiger oto? 

saw the same fish in a lfs with the name tiger oto written on the tank :Smile:

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## Quixotic

Yes, "tiger oto".

In my experience, they are rather fragile, for some reason or another.

I have only been able to keep them for about 2 months, but that's in a community tank. I suppose they should do better in a species tank.

Maybe I am missing something in their diet as well? How long were you guys able to keep them? Any experience to share?

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## valice

Yah... I would like to ask about their diet too..
I having them for about 2 weeks or so, but I haven't seen them touch a single piece of the algae wafer I drop in...

But are these fishes popular enough in the past for people to know more about them?

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## Quixotic

I think they graze on algae since they stick themselves on any surface. But on all occassions, my tank has plenty of algae and yet I haven't been able to keep them alive long enough. Perhaps being in a community tank is not helping either.  :Huh?:

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## Kingfisher

Got 10 pcs yesterday and more than half of the population are dead today.  :Sad:

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## aquarius

> no leh.. mine all okay.. i dont find them sensitive at all..


Care to share what you feed them and how long have you had them? Water parameters etc??

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## ranmasatome

well.. i dont know.. i just dump alot of ketampang leaves inside.. they seem to be doing fine.. they also dont touch the algae wafers i throw in.. but so far so good..

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## aquarius

If they're not feeding on the algae wafers, are they feeding on the algae thats in your tank?

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## Justikanz

Not all suckermouths eat algae... There are some that eat wood and some that eats insects and some that eats fish... Fyi...

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## Ah_ZhaN

My one and only Parotocinclus sp 'peru' has been missing since last week, any methods to lure it out? I can't seem to find it's body as well...  :Huh?: 

Many people experienced deaths on these 'tiger' otocinclus..including mine which has been missing all these while.

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## Quixotic

Rather than herbivores, they may be omnivores. Did some extensive googling and one thing that seems to be common is that they ignore dry/commercial food.

Anyone tried BBS? Found this Japanese article that mentions BBS being provided as part of their diet.

_"...It reached the point where the brine shrimp is eaten. In addition getting off on the bottom, it reached the point where the feed you eat. As for the picture the place where the brine shrimp which gets together on the glass surface is eaten..."_

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## ranmasatome

My ketapang leaves has holes already.. theres noething else in the tank so i figured it must be them.. going to try some live feed and see what happens.

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## hwchoy

I used to soak my ketapang (after cleaning) in warm water to extract out the "essence". then bottle the brown water for future use. I wonder if this extraction process destroys the humic acid and other "essence" of ketapang?

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## aquarius

I've seen them nibbling on the algae which is on the small stoned substrate at Ben's aquarium. It would be great if we know what's the requirement to keep them alive cos they are really beautiful and cute fishes.  :Smile:  Unfortunately many of us has been heartbrokened to see them die after a short time with us including myself.  :Crying:

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## Ah_ZhaN

> I used to soak my ketapang (after cleaning) in warm water to extract out the "essence". then bottle the brown water for future use. I wonder if this extraction process destroys the humic acid and other "essence" of ketapang?


Actually, I am doing that as well...I think as long as the water mixed with ketapang leaves turns yellow, the leaves should be usable. Or maybe you can do a pH test of the ''extract'' before you bottled it up to verify the work of pH lowering from Ketapang leaves.

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## ranmasatome

i used to do this but i find that if i store the water too long.. it forms a layer of mold on the top... so now i just keep the leaves and use as an when i want without mold.

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## hwchoy

the disintegrating leaves very the lehchey.

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## ranmasatome

not if you have plecos.. :Grin: .. but still i find these fishes do quite well in ketapang-water..

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## valice

I have a feeling it is a wood grasper... I see alot of shit on a piece of DW which I placed in the tank housing them... And I did not feed it so far...

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## Quixotic

That is possible. They are on their own in the tank?

Of the two times that I have kept them before, one that is kept with wood (in community tank) survived for about 2 to 3 months. The ones without wood (in community tank as well) survived to a maximum of 1.5 months.

Anyway, this fish will be on my taboo fish list for now.

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## stormhawk

The reason why these little guys thrive in tanks with ketapang leaves is due to the acidity of the water, caused by the gradual rotting of the leaves. They like such conditions if I recall correctly, and thrive happily in acidic water.

As for diet, these guys are omnivores. They rasp on nearly everything. Even worms. Mine fed happily on tubifex they came across, but they were a pain to keep alive. I have a thought that they might feeding on the _aufwuchs_ living on the surface of the algae or driftwood in the tank. In short they're probably feasting on the microscopic animals living in the tank, rather than the algae itself.

As for those who have missing "Tiger Otos", don't despair. Most of the time they're just hanging out on the driftwood, on the underside at times. Due to their colouration, you might not easily see them, unless they shift position. However, if the little fellow goes MIA for a long long time, its probably dead by now.

This species does not do well in a tank with boisterous fishes. Best kept with similar sized fishes like Boraras and gang. I would not recommend this species to a novice fishkeeper, primarily because they are sensitive little buggers. Plus, they're not cheap.  :Sad:

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## marle

just got this fella tiger oto from c328 today, really cute creature.

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## aquanatix

Was damn tempted to get these buggers after seeing them over at C328.
Saw a crowd over the tank and was wondering what they were.When the crowd finally cleared i managed to look at the beautiful buggers.
After the feedback from fellow hobbyists here,doubts i'll be getting them anytime soon.
Sensitive and fragile,not to mention they come with a hefty price tag! :Sad: 
Hope more information can be found before i take a plunge!

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## joopsg

I think you did not acclimatize them properly.

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## blackBRUSHalgae

I have waited for these little otos for A YEAR!!!! finally they are here!!!! WEEEEE!

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## ranmasatome

Congrats.. go get some!! haha... imagine waiting for fish for 3-4years... i'm dying..but still cannot find them..haha..

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## marle

i have this Parotocinclus sp. "Peru" in my tank for about 1 month now, i must say it is very hardworking!

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## Quixotic

Since there is some interest stirred up on them recently, thought I would bring up this thread again, but with a twist.

Have you ever wondered why this fish is difficult to keep? Is it possible that this fish may actually not be a _Parotocinclus_ spp.?  :Shocked: 

There appears to be very strong resemblance of this fish with the fry of _Hypostomus_ sp. L229! The pattern and colour is amazingly similar albeit some slight differences in the shape of the head. Furthermore, both fish originate from Peru.

http://www.planetcatfish.com/forum/v...p?f=17&t=21808
_Parotocinclus_ sp. (3) or "Peru"
_Hypostomus_ sp. (L229)

However, this is no evidence that they are the same species. _Parotocinclus_ sp. "Peru" may just be the result of mimicry (resemblance of one organism to another or to an object in its surroundings for concealment and protection from predators).

Perhaps, it would be of interest then if those, who are intending to keep them, can keep them as if they are fries of _Hypostomus_ sp. L229. If they can be kept long enough, then it would probably shed some light.

Therefore, I would suggest the following requirements: species only tank; good and clean, very well oxygenated water; plenty of algae; some soft wood (could be part of their diet); mixed diet of live BBS (post #26), vegetables and other processed food.

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## Merviso

I would very much like to do that!  :Roll Eyes: 

I was asking Ben of Wu Hu this afternoon about the shipment of Tiger Oto, and he say someone told him the shipment is here and he might have it tonight. I was so happy...  :Laughing: 

However, he call the supplier to confirm and was told that it was a false alarm...  :Crying:

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## eeeeemo

haha

especially this two pic.

http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog...?image_id=8540

http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog...?image_id=1702

very interesting! it will be on my next to buy list. how many pieces do you suggest to bring out the natural behavior of these guys? i have a spare 2ft tank.

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## leekh77

Hypostomus L229 seen like hardly came in Singapore here..

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## Quixotic

> how many pieces do you suggest to bring out the natural behavior of these guys? i have a spare 2ft tank.


Well, as many as your wallet does not object to? However, as mentioned, they can be fragile and mortality rate is high, so you may want to give some consideration to your financial status.

Personally, I probably won't go for more than 5 maximum.  :Razz:

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## Huggable

Bought 2 pieces at Colorful earlier, still in the bag to be climatised. Hopefully better survival rate this time!

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## genes

Spot the difference! 

Paratocinclus sp.
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog...?image_id=5541

L229
http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog...?image_id=8542

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## RHX

So how do we know if the Parotocinclus sp. "Peru" that we see recently are not L229 juvenile when we can't keep them pass 6 months for them to grow into adults.

From those pictures I can't really tell the difference between them.

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## Panut

> Spot the difference! 
> 
> Paratocinclus sp.
> http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog...?image_id=5541
> 
> L229
> http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog...?image_id=8542


The second pic has a longer nose?  :Roll Eyes:

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## Quixotic

> So how do we know if the Parotocinclus sp. "Peru" that we see recently are not L229 juvenile when we can't keep them pass 6 months for them to grow into adults.


We don't know. However, if they are indeed fries, that may explain why they are so fragile. As such, husbandry of fries would somewhat differ from how you would normally keep them as _Parotocinclus_. Hence, I provided some suggestions of the setup for raising them as fries in post #43. This is so that we can (hopefully) keep them long enough to know if they are indeed L229 fries.

However, if you have managed to keep them long enough to determine that they are unlikely to be fries, then you would have also achieved the objective of minimising the mortality of _Parotocinclus_, based on the setup assuming they are fries. In that case, then it may be safely assumed that some of the requirements for raising fries are applicable to the well being of _Parotocinclus_ in the long run.

This may help other hobbyists towards better understanding the husbandry of the fish in question. Am I making sense?  :Opps:

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## RHX

Sounds perfectly logical. Have got myself 5 Parotocinclus sp. "Peru", no deaths so far. Hopefully they'll live long enough for me to find out.

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## illumnae

all the best! hope this season someone will be able to crack the husbandry of this cute fish  :Smile:

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## Jungle-mania

Does anyone have success of keeping them for more than a year?

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## RHX

It's been a month since i've bought my Tiger oto. Bought 5 & left with 2. Did not really see them eat, except scraping my ADA soil. And their stomach always remains flat so I was wondering if that's normal. 

I saw c328 kept the tiger otos with ketapang leaves, & i saw them scraping it till there's holes on the leaf. So i've got myself a ketapang leaf today, hopefully they'll eat something. I've been keeping them at a temperature around 25 ~ 26 degrees & PH around 6.5 ~ 7

To those who have bought this fish. How are your fishes faring now? What's the survival rate. Did you guys managed to get them to eat something? Care to share some experiences on this fish? And hopefully we can unveil some secrets of keeping this fish alive.

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## Morgan01

I had about 6 but they are too small and hard to find. spotted 3-4 usually and always very hardworking on my glass and leaves.

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## johannes

bought 2 left one but growing bigger..

saw it sometimes eat algae wafer with other otos, or maybe consume daphnia? as i feed daphnia (or probably other microscopic organisms) to my other fishes inside and also i saw it shitted...so must be eating something inside lo... :Smile:

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## illumnae

Congrats to everyone who's managed to keep these guys alive, perhaps the key to keeping these guys has been found?

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## Morgan01

I guess again down to good water condition and healthy happy environment for fish

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## RHX

But I am still not convinced that algaes are their main source of food. 

Comparing with my zebra otos, which are fat & always seen scraping algaes either from the glass or from the plants. 

My tiger otos however are always seen scavanging for food at the bottom of the tank. When I've put food at the bottom, they were never seen eating them. Also they are hardy seen either on the plants or on the glass. Don't know why mine behaves differently from others.

By the way, just found another surviving tiger oto. I guess 3 out of 5 survived to this point of time is still not so bad  :Razz: !

Here's my pretty well camoflaged Otos

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## Morgan01

Anyone seen new shipment of either zebra or tiger oto at any lfs of late? I need replenish

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## eeeeemo

haha instead of replenishing, shouldn't we all find a way to breed them??
i am quite sure the shipments of otocinclus cocama are farm bred as they are reported to be easy to breed like otocinclus!

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## Quixotic

> Congrats to everyone who's managed to keep these guys alive, perhaps the key to keeping these guys has been found?


Aha, when you mentioned cracking the husbandry of the fish, I was actually expecting it to be a much longer period.  :Grin: 

Actually, keeping them alive for a month (or even two) doesn't prove as difficult as one thinks, if they have been acclimatised properly. However keeping them alive for that short period doesn't necessarily mean that they will survive in the long term.  :Smile: 

Discounting the initial first deaths upon purchasing them, the losses seem to be occur from the 3rd month onwards, and the longest seem to be around 5 to 6 months (based on the Internet accounts I have read). It may be arguable that their lifespan may just be up to 6 months maximum, but I am not totally convinced.

So there must be some information that we could be lacking. Specific water condition? Specific diet? Specific temperature? Hopefully, we'll be able to find out...




> But I am still not convinced that algaes are their main source of food. 
> 
> Comparing with my zebra otos, which are fat & always seen scraping algaes either from the glass or from the plants. 
> 
> My tiger otos however are always seen scavanging for food at the bottom of the tank. When I've put food at the bottom, they were never seen eating them. Also they are hardy seen either on the plants or on the glass. Don't know why mine behaves differently from others.


Even for algae eaters, their diet aren't just solely algae itself, they do need some protein based food from time to time. They are likely to eat any food that you throw in your tank, including meat matter, just that it shouldn't be the main diet. Therefore, based on what I have fed and other observations, newly hatched brine shrimp, daphnia or tubifex should be taken readily.

It should be okay to scavenge from the substrate. The algae eaters I have, _Otocinclus cocama_ and _Oxyropsis carinata_ have a habit of doing that.

Anybody game enough to try feeding blanched vegetable in the long run? Would be interested to find out if this would prove to be a determining factor in the long run.

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## Panut

How many are you keeping, Quixotic?

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## Quixotic

That's in the past. I don't have them for this batch and don't intend to keep them anymore. They are on my personal list of fish-to-avoid until:

1. more is known, and/or
2. I am convinced of my own long term commitment of them.  :Wink:

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## johannes

i saw mine eating the hikari algae wafer together with my zebra otos... :Smile:

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## illumnae

> That's in the past. I don't have them for this batch and don't intend to keep them anymore. They are on my personal list of fish-to-avoid until:
> 
> 1. more is known, and/or
> 2. I am convinced of my own long term commitment of them.


haha me too Quixotic, though i'm less adventurous and didn't even bother trying once  :Opps:  i'm waiting for the breakthrough so that I can learn and keep these cute guys in future. For now, I stick with zebra otos!

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## jacian

I kept mine in 2 separate tank. 1 of the tank got plenty of green spot algae on the glass and can see them busy scraping algaes off the glass and plants.
The other tank I am feeding them with algae wafer, bbs, decap brine shrimp eggs but I do not see them feeding on any of them.

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## ranmasatome

Perhaps it is rotting matter? like leaves and wood? we never seem to have enough of that... 
Let me see if i can find them.. then i'll try again.

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## celticfish

You mean like the rotting ketapang leaves in aunties tanks?

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## RHX

I've did that! A ketapang leaf was left in the tank for a week already, but I've yet to see anyone of them munching on it. 

Maybe i did not spend more time in front of the tank observing them to notice it.  :Razz:

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## ranmasatome

i mean like old leaves.. or old wood that has been in water so much that you can kind of scrape the wood off easily with your hands.. its kinda like brown diatoms almost.. you know mushy yucky stuff..

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## Samuel2618

> i saw mine eating the hikari algae wafer together with my zebra otos...


Mine too.. They are feeding on Hikari Algae Wafer together with all my other fishes.. Actually Not sure if this is true but think they do feed on brown algae too.. Initially before introducing them into the tank.. There were quite an amount of brown algae on my filter.. saw one of the tiger at the filter and the next day.. The filter is free of brown algae..

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## Zenislev

Menn....just found my last piece of tiger oto dead today. It has been in my tank for about a month or so....guess they're really fragile...

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## sithspawn

I bought 2 pcs of them when they first sold in Y618. I kept them in a temporary tank with my dwarf crayfish because my main tank was under treatment for white spot (I rescued the 2 crayfish and a cherry shrimp out of that tank)

The said tank did not have any fltration of any sort and the base was black dennerle sand with no other decor or wood. I must admit that I didn't do regular water changes at all, in fact I;ve only done three 10% water changes so far. Both tigers are still doing fine. Same goes for the 2 dwarf crayfish and a lone cherry shrimp. The only food I feed is that new Sera shrimp food, that silver packaging japanese crs food and hikari crab cuisine.

This tank is my most neglected tank and the tigers are doing fine. Go figure.

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## ranmasatome

Mine that lasted me for about 6mths or so also came from a tank that didn't have filtration..and i hardly did anything to the tank.

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## Samuel2618

> Menn....just found my last piece of tiger oto dead today. It has been in my tank for about a month or so....guess they're really fragile...


bro.. take it easy loh.. These fishes are fragile.. But have to admit they are real cute.. keep trying next time..  :Well done:

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## RHX

As of today, 3 of my tiger oto's are still surviving  :Grin: . I've also noticed that they have grown a little bit, maybe a few milimeters.

By now i'm convinced that they are algae eaters. Most of the foods i've thrown into that tank are quickly being eaten by other fishes. They have no what so ever chance of getting to it. 

I've also notice, at night most of my otos & plecos will be busy working on cleaning the algae off the glass (Including the tiger otos). So I guess they've got their food supply over there.

Back to the topic of them possibly L229 juveniles. Can any pleco breeders confirm the growth rate of baby plecos? Is growth rate around 2mm in 4 months reasonable?

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## Zenislev

So hows everyone's tiger otos getting along?

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## Samuel2618

For me.. I have 5 pieces surviving well and healthy in the tank..  :Grin:

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## Zenislev

> For me.. I have 5 pieces surviving well and healthy in the tank..


Oh....so the last 5 survivors huh? Hopefully they will stay with you long, i got no luck with exotic otos....

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## inimicus

Seen any of these little fellows around lately? :Smile:

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## celticfish

Best to take this up as a "Sighting request" in the appropriate section.
I note that these fish are seasonal.

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## apistomaster

I have had 17 of these tiny Parotocinclus since May. They are set up in their own 20L.
It took them only a few days to eat the algae I allowed to grow in anticipation of getting them. Now all they eat is Spirulina Sticks.

I am hoping to breed them. I have heard rumors that they have been bred ib Switzerland but I haven't heard any details. They are very delicate and I think keeping them in very soft water is important.

They are some of the coolest new catfish introduced into the hobby to me.

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