# Other Aquarium Forums > Equipment and Accessories >  My Impression of the Maxspect Razor 420 120watts LED (8000K)

## David

Hi everyone

I am currently using the Maxspect 420 Razor 120w LED (8000K). Just to share my impression of this lighting.

Based on the marketing aspects of the light set, it seems that a lot of research has gone into this product to optimized plant growth and here are the extracts of it from the website.









On taking out from the box, the build is rather good and the whole aluminum chassis is basically a heat sink with a fan in the center. There is two options to set it up. Pendant or by stand provided. Originally I used the pendant since I already have the mounting point in my ceiling.

However here comes the first bomber. The Razor comes in three sizes. 1 foot single LED group, 2 feet double LED group and 3 feet triple LED group. This means that if you have a 4 footer, you need to get 2 x 2 feet set. if you have a 6 footer, you need to get 2 x 3 feet set. There are optional linking bars to joint them together but the problem is that it tends to sag where the joints are and it looks really funny.

Next is the height suspension. If you have a 2 feet depth and 2 feet wide tank, you need to suspend it quite low in order to get enough light to go to the bottom and at the end, after a lot of time adusted I found out that there is no difference between using their wire cables for pendant to the legs supplied, it may be better off to use the legs supplied so that you don't get that sagging in the center look.






Now to plug it in. The Razor Driver (the ballast if you want to call it that) comes as a separate unit from the light fitting. This is a good and bad thing. The good, it makes the lights looks really slim and the heat from the driver is not sitting over the tank. The bad is that you need to find a cool space to place it as it gets HOT and not a good idea to put in into your tank cabinet. So you need to find a place to put it. The next issue I have is where the wire comes out of the light set. I thought it would have been better if it came out from the top rather than the side. Its because of this wire that the two light set cannot meet each other back to back if the link bar option is used causing it to sag in the center and a clean look cannot be achieved.



Now to program the Razor. It comes with a two channel programmable for the sunrise and sunset or even moonlight environment. The intensity of lights are also programmable from 0% to 100 % according to the 6 TP (Timing Points) of the sunrise to sunset period.



The weakness about it is that you can only program it on a 12 hour basis. This means the sunset cannot exceed 11.30pm. So if you want to shut the lights after 12am or beyond, you need to cheat by setting the clock backwards. The next weakness is that if two sets or more is used, you have to sync the timing of each light set manually and somehow, it will be off by a few seconds unlike the higher end models offered by GM or Mitras that used Bluetooth to communicate for multiple light set sync.

The next issue I have is with the cooling fan. It blows downwards to the tank this means heating up the water but what really irritates me the most is that dust gets blown into the water as well....



My overall impression is that its value for money for a mid level LED light set. It is well built and a lot of research has more or less gone into this light set for planted tanks. There are some weakness in them but are not major issues as there are always work around them.

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## AQMS

Nice. Look like someone is switching to Led now... :Razz:

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## David

tech junkie...no choice....resistance to trying out new tech is futile..... :Laughing:  Now my backside is itchy to try out the Mitras..... :Roll Eyes:

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## AQMS

> tech junkie...no choice....resistance to trying out new tech is futile..... Now my backside is itchy to try out the Mitras.....


Mitras LX 6000? :Shocked: 
That is super X led,it is german quality should be excellent!!

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## David

Yup that is the one..... :Grin:  at 1.6k per pop.... :Shocked: 



but that is not the most expensive....that prize goes to the ATI LED T5 combo.....the 2ft Super LED with T5 combo is 2K plus and its already selling well to reefers....and it is SUPER SEXY....looking at it and your saliva comes down like a waterfall ...... :Laughing:

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## Urban Aquaria

> tech junkie...no choice....resistance to trying out new tech is futile..... Now my backside is itchy to try out the Mitras.....


Thanks for the review, its very informative for those looking at these lights!  :Well done: 

When you next switch your light systems... there will be many chaps here who would be keen to "adopt" your maxspect razors.  :Grin: 

Good that you got the 120W units too, those can also individually fit 2ft tanks nicely.

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## Urban Aquaria

Btw, about the razor's in-built fans... from your experience so far, how hot does the maxspect unit get during operation, like say if its on full power intensity for 8 hours at a stretch? Does it get hot enough to activate the fans? 

I'm guessing at certain lower light intensities when dimmed the heat output would probably be low enough not to activate the fans at all even for longer light photoperiods.

Also thinking if the fans could somehow be modded to blow in the opposite direction (ie. away from the water), so it blows upwards and draws heat away from the light set rather than blowing air downwards though it into the water, might not be as effective in cooling it though.

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## David

you are most welcome....and for LEDs in the market, the Razor is a good mid entry point level. Price point for the 2ft is about 600 a pop. I have not seen any other entry points and the Mitras is at 1.6K and the ATIs at 2K+ per pop.

I have seen the others at the lower price points but the build and the LED grouping does not inspire confidence for me at the least. For the Razor Planted version aka 8000K color temp, it comes with 2ft and 3ft only I think.

So here comes a small issue. If you have a 4ft tank you need 2 x 2ft. One can get away with a single 3ft but if the depth and height of the tank is 2ft or 60cm in dimension, I think the 3ft may not have enough coverage. If you have odd dimension like 5ft...then this may be a bit more difficult to solve.

As you can see in the picture I posted above, using just 2 x 2ft and you will see a blank spot in the centre. Its a pity my tank is 50cm in depth, because if its 60cm, I would use 3 x 2ft placed across the tank. It would have provided better coverage, the program interface pointing to the front and the wires to the back.....but than again, tank maintenance would be a chore to remove the light set when it comes to it.

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## David

With regards to the fan, it comes on within 1/2 hour on 100% light intensity....any thing below 70% and the fan more or less does not come on. It gets warmishly hot around the centre where the LEDs are but not as hot as the Driver. the heat sink draws a lot of the heat away. My guess is that the fan is to protect the chipset inside the system rather than to cool down the LEDs.

The strange thing is that according to Maxspect, the heat sink draws heat by upward draft rather than a downward draft....so I am rather curious why the fan is blowing the other way. I am also curious if I can switch the the wires for the fan to blow the other way round....Any avid electrician can commend on this before I start ripping the Maxspect apart from the top.... :Smile:

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## BFG

Hmm, it seems to me you could use the 3ft model. There is an accessory which could connect both light set together or if you want to, you could diy it yourself by cutting a pair of the leg and join the 2 light set together.

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## felix_fx2

David, there are already some folks spotted that took apart your model.
My guess is that the fan is blowing down to cool onboard controllers, like pc motherboard having Northbridge/Southbridge heatsink.

I recall clearly that this model can hang and didn't you use to hang the last set?

@Urban, one of the chaps might be you? hehe...

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## tawauboy

> .......
> 
> The strange thing is that according to Maxspect, the heat sink draws heat by upward draft rather than a downward draft....so I am rather curious why the fan is blowing the other way. I am also curious if I can switch the the wires for the fan to blow the other way round....Any avid electrician can commend on this before I start ripping the Maxspect apart from the top....


upward draft - passive cooling by convection
doubt you can't switch the wires around to get the fan to blow the other way because most, if not all, fans are brushless. there is electronics inside the fan. so you'll need to turn the fan around and leave the wires alone.

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## David

@ BFG ...the 3 feet coverage at the two ends are rather weak. Better to use the 2 Feet joined.

@ Felix. I tried using the pendant but the sag in the middle is really an eye sore.

@Tawauboy...thanks so it looks like I am stuck with a down blowing fan. It cannot be turned around because of the plastic fitting.

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## limz_777

good review there , does the centre part get enough light coverage ?

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## AQMS

David,i am very sure that you can turn the fan around just like tawauboy suggested.
i see screws at the both sides...

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## felix_fx2

you mean got lobang?

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## David

@limz_777 thanks and yes the coverage is enough as long as no tall plants at the center. If not, it can still be adjusted more towards the center or use the link bars.

@Zero nope there is only the screws at the top side to remove the plating. But then again the plate is removed to mount the ball joint should panning of the lights are required. I double check again.

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## David

Oh guys, I forgot...the driver aka ballast rating is 140 to 160 watts. My electrician happened to be home and I asked him to help me take a reading and it turned out that the real consumption is 146watts. So perhaps the 160watt model should be consuming 180watts or so.

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## David

Sorry sorry ...just one more thing. The timer moves by 1/2 hour block only.

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## tawauboy

> Oh guys, I forgot...the driver aka ballast rating is 140 to 160 watts. My electrician happened to be home and I asked him to help me take a reading and it turned out that the real consumption is 146watts. So perhaps the 160watt model should be consuming 180watts or so.


you are getting 91% efficiency, which very good. are you running the lights at maximum?

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## David

Yup...that was max power....but I needed to cut down to 70%.....Just gotten green water all over again..... :Laughing:

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## yan

Hi,

Saw the Maxspect Razor on my uncle's reef tank.
First impression was... wow it's slim and inbuilt fan (2).

Currently on 4 x 36W DIY PL lamp (3ft mini pellia & dwarf hair grass). 
Guess's its time for a change.

I believe 120W would be sufficient instead of the 160W?
Where can I find the best deal? In LFS or online?

Thanks

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## BFG

The wattage difference is based on the length of the light set. The 120w is for 2ft while the 160w is for 3ft.

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## David

Yan...try De-Lighting .....Razali is the owner and he is the distributor of Razors....9752 5051

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## milk_vanilla

this thread is poisonous better stay away or else more $ to be spend  :Wink: 

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## David

@milk_vanilla....technically speaking I got poisoned by you indirectly because you gave me Razali's number....so I am just merely returning the favor.... :Laughing: 

Wait till I review the Mitras 8000K in a couple of months time....I think the ones I ordered will be in by September.... :Wink:

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## milk_vanilla

Once mitras kicked in, You should impress more people by open house bro.

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## David

Sure....not a problem with open house....problem is that you guys have to troop all the way to KL ..... :Grin:

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## AQMS

> Sure....not a problem with open house....problem is that you guys have to troop all the way to KL .....


as long as got makan-makan i come :Grin: .

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## illumnae

I'm using the 60w 1ft version for my nano tank. It has to be placed at the highest position using the provided legs, or light spread isn't sufficient and stem plants grow towards the middle. Even at the highest position, running the lights at 70% gave me green water with ample co2 and ferts. Now running it at 50% and its all good.

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## David

@illumnae...you bought the 1ft 60 watt Razor? Its available in 8000K? Looks like you are also have the focus spot issue as well.....

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## BFG

To add poison to the water, presenting-

http://reefbuilders.com/2013/08/30/m...-light-models/

30w only.....if I'm not wrong.

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## illumnae

> @illumnae...you bought the 1ft 60 watt Razor? Its available in 8000K? Looks like you are also have the focus spot issue as well.....


Yup, I have the 16000K 3ft 160W version for my marine tank and liked it alot, so I actually got the 16000K 1ft 60W version for my office marine nano. When I converted the office nano to a planted instead, I purchased the 8000K pad from Razali and he showed me how to change the pad (I still have the 16000K pad so I can switch it back when required). When he changed it for me, his spare 8000K pad had some issues, so he actually took a pad from an existing 8000K 1ft 60W version to swap into mine. At that point in time he had 2 pcs of the 8000K 1ft 60W versions in stock. And yep, the lenses don't seem to have wide enough spread, so when it's at the middle position marker, the centre is obviously brighter than the sides, which led my background stems to grow upwards towards the middle. Problem was solved when I raised the light to the maximum height position. As the light is so high up, I guess that's why 30W led over a 1ft cube is sufficient light, compared to say the UP Aqua Z series LEDs or ADA Aquasky, which use lower powered lower wattage LEDs, but place the LEDs much closer to the surface.

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## tropic

I am running the 160w, 10k x 2side by side on my reef tank. Maybe switching back to low maintenance biotope concept. I tried earlier adjusting the whites and a mix of blue to give a cool white colour. Hope it can pull off for the plants. 

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## David

Wonderful. This means that a five feet tank can be configured.

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## David

@tropic...I could be wrong but if you use a 10K for a planted tank, you may encounter more algae issues.

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## Henlek

> @tropic...I could be wrong but if you use a 10K for a planted tank, you may encounter more algae issues.


Hi David, I'm glad you mentioned green water. I'm using the 160w 8000k model on my 2.5x1.5x1.5ft, planted, EI dosing, religious WC, good co2 4bps, good circulation, yet bloom, all kinds of algae festival including green water and hair algae the worse. I suspect it was the light, so I tuned in down to A:40% B:60%, 8 hours a day. Still algae persist. Do you think I am at the right % range for my tank size? This light is really difficult to catch the correct zone.

Light is hung 25cm above tank rim. My tank holds exactly 115L or 30g after minus all the scapes.

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## David

Hi Henlek

Have you settled the green water? Water change is not enough and you need use a UV sterilizer of at least 10watts and above and run your tank water till it becomes crystal clear. Do not fertilize the water while using UV. clean your filter and throw away the wool and use a new one.

I don't understand why did you turn up the percentage of the blue spectrum and cut the red spectrum. Blues somehow encourages algae growth. Keep the red and blue spectrum equal.

The 160watt Razor to be frank is a little of an overkill for your tank dimension. but since you have already bought it, lets work from here. Cut down your lights to 36% for both A and B. Observe if your plants are photosynthesizing. If no, increase both A and B by 1% till you do. If yes, you can now decide if you like to decrease both A and B by 1% to 35% (in my opinion, I would) till you reach a percentage when you don't see photosynthesis. (By this means the lowest possible plant).

As for your hair algae, you need to re-check your water circulation and the amount of CO2 present in your water column.

What kind of plants are you growing at the moment? Is this tank new or has it been running for awhile. What is the bio-load currently in the tank?

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## David

If you do cut percentage from 36%, when you reach a percentage that you don't see photosynthesis, it means your last percentage is the minimum that you need.

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## tropic

10k you may dim the blues to ensure a whiter output. 10k has more reds in the warm whites. But still I believe 8000k is still whiter than a 10k whites, if you know what I mean. 

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## Henlek

Thank you for your kind reply. Yes I did a UV and cleared it up in 48hrs including a huge 70% WC. But it seems to threaten to return when I tried to sponge off green dust algae (I think so) on the driftwood and leafs. Its under control somewhat.

As for the lights, I thought the opposite, that red (B) is a dance with algae! And because red makes the tank look so yellow and greenish, that's why I tuned it to 40/60% to balance it. Now that you corrected me, I am going to try it. Thanks for the correction. 36% sounds very low, but your method also sounds very logical and gradual, so its 36% from tomorrow. 

I using a Eheim Pro 3 2075 connected to a chiller, output a big lily pipe, plus a 200l/hr mini powerhead midway inside the tank. With these, I was confident that my flow is good. I can see the Co2 bubbles going all over the tank and the drop checker is a lovely lime green. Its a mystery I get all kinds of algae. This leads to your next question.

Tank was newly flooded 2 weeks ago after 2 months of DSM. I suspect that the New Amazonia soil harboured the algae during DSM and bloomed after flooding, including high levels of organics released. My PH is below the reading of my API test kit, surely less than 6, highly acidic till now. There are no live stock in there now, nothing may survive. But my water test seems ok.

Today's reading: Ammonia/Nitrite 0, Nitrate 20ppm, PO4 0.5ppm, KH 4gkh, GH impossible to get a reading.

Plants: Vallisneria, Amazon Swords, Cryto Parva, Java Ferns, Hygrophila Corymbosa, E. Tenellus , Mini Hairgrass and a half dead lawn of HC Cuba.

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## David

Most if not all your plants are root feeders and not water column feeders. Either cut your water dosage by 2/3 or introduce stemmed plants like the Hydrophlia Polyspmer (wrong spelling I am sure.. :Wink: ) Rotalia Indica or roundifolia...this will take up your Nitrate and Phosphate. Just don't forget to dose the K.

I don't know how bad is your GW but it is advisable to change filter wool and rinses your filter.

As for the lights, do equal percentage for both A and B. While 36% sounds low but don't forget that your 160watt is alittle of an over kill and the watts per gallon does not really apply to LEDs.

If you like, you could start at 38 to 40 but I rather stay conservative at 36 as your tank has a height of 45cm and taking into account of the overlaps. Observe your plants for photosynthesis bubbles especially for the lowest plants which is your foreground.

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## David

@tropic...I think I more or less understand where you are coming from...I think.... :Very Happy:

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## Henlek

Too right, didn't consider the plants, blindly following EI. I would try the Hydrophlia Polysperma. K I covered with Seachem Potassium during Marco days along with Nitrogen and dry Kh2Po4. GW was as bad as my avatar. Filter was overhauled after UV as you mentioned, purigen added too. This morning seems slight green again.

Has to be the lights! Honestly I was blasting the razor happily at 85% for 2 days after flooding, contributing to my algae mess now. This is in big part due to my lack of understanding of LEDs. I did some basic calculations and 40% both A&B should have been my start point. No forum says anything on how to use the razor properly till now as opposed to the traditional T5HOs. High powered LEDs is not for everybody, unless you know what you are doing. I didn't. Thank you again for the info.

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## milk_vanilla

Most of built in dimmable lights, usually are high quality made one. 100% power blast will give significant big par result, unless you know what you're doing. My dimmable (not razor) also give tremendous result, my max output is 60%. Even with EI and lime green co2, I could see minor gsa on my bottom glass. So my best output so far is 50 -55%. With height 40 cm above the surface

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## milk_vanilla

And another trick is you shold get your DC lime green when the light is kicked in. Not something in the middle of your light period. However we won't get the immediate result with DC. So your trial and error and observations are crucial here, and itakes lot of time. But this is where the most fun part of the hobby

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## David

Hi milk...the only other dimmable lights is either a GM or Mitras...unless you bought the mother of all lights...ATI... :Wink:

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## David

Henkel...don't be too hard on yourself. In this hobby, it's partly science and mostly art. No one can give anyone definite answers to questions as no two tanks are the same.

The forum and the community within the forum can only point a guideline. The rest is up to the aquarist to use the information and adopt it wholesale or modify it to suit his or her tank condition.

It is through experience gain from tears that I for one will always start with 50% of manufacturer recommendation and work my way up to the optimal point that suits my tank condition. Of course optimal points will change over time as plants and fauna grows.

When I first got my razor, I underestimated its ability and for once, forsake my better judgment and went 100% and paid the price for it.

One thing is for sure is that you have to solve your lighting output of which I have shared with you how I did it and based on my own tank as the benchmark I did some calculation and judgement call according to the variant of our tanks and light specs that I came to 36%.

As for your thread algae, may I suggest that you want to cut down and/or stop you N and P dosing and stick more to K. Unless you add stemmed plants.

Why do I say this? It is because I see your NO3 and P reading is alittle high and I will add a few percentage more. This is because reading varies depending on where you took your water sample from and at what time did you take it.

Normal we just scoop the water sample from the top of the tank, no? Reading differs from the bottom to the top of the tank depending how much muck is accumulated at the bottom. The next time, observe where the algae is growing in the tank. There is always a level that it's rampant. Just like how green hair algae loves to grow on top of mosses ...this is because muck has accumulated within the moss and not been cleared.

Timing when sample is taken is important. During lights on and plants are photosynthesizing, NO3 and P reading will be lower as compared to hours after lights out period. While it seems insignificant, the difference between failing at 49 marks and passing at 50 marks is 1 point.

Another factor that some aquarist ignore is the filter. NO3 and P can be manufactured from the filter and pumped back into the tank if the muck accumulate in the filter is not cleared for a long time. Observe the next time when you don't clean your filter and the water flow rate starts to slow down...if you have a rainbar you will see beautiful BBA growing on the outlet holes.

Most will disagree with what I am saying or suggesting. This is just to share with you my experience and experiences of aquarists now long left the hobby.

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## milk_vanilla

David, it's seen on my avatar  :Wink:  lets back to razor talk

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## Henlek

> And another trick is you shold get your DC lime green when the light is kicked in. Not something in the middle of your light period. However we won't get the immediate result with DC. So your trial and error and observations are crucial here, and itakes lot of time. But this is where the most fun part of the hobby
> 
> sent from tapatalk


Hi milk, no contest. It is my poor understanding of LEDs. I made a big mistake of calculating wpg on the razor, hence giving all algae a good holiday. It's now down to just 36% and monitoring as prescribed by David. Before, I used regular T5s on other tanks, never had such a big headache. Maybe someone can help to put a sticky on how to tune them properly.
As for CO2, yes it's turned on an hour before lights, off an hour before lights off. Thanks milk!

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## Henlek

What a wealth of info! Thank you for sharing and writing all the details, printed it out to digest, I am sure I can use some points or rather most of it. I also remove all the ferns and got 3 pots of Hydrophlia Polysperma as stem replacement.

Well now I am beginning to feel bad that I hijacked this thread to chat about my algae and earned lots from it. Sorry readers... 

But then again, if everybody kept mum of what a product's misuse might lead to, nobody would learn from it. Anyone reading this, especially those interested in buying a razor or higher, please study this thread and don't ever go about blasting it at 100%. Because 100% you will get algae.

Overall, the razor is really damn razor thin and a fantastic product I feel (so would algae if you did what I did), just that the stupid fans are blowing downwards when they kick in. What the fish man?

Thanks a great deal David. Else I would still be wondering.

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## David

Hello Henkel, again I am saying don't be too hard on yourself. You are not hijacking the thread in any way and I felt it is good that you shared your tank situation where most would shy away from sharing for whatever reason.

Basically, high powered LED is in its infancy stage and not everyone is exactly sure about it. I for one at some earlier point detested LED. If it was not for a blown MH, I would have never tried LED.

In fact the whole fraternity of aquarists should thank Razor for bring this technology to affordable prices. It was our own lack of understanding that brought about our situation of which I shared in my journey thread and this one.

Blasting the Razor at 100% does not assure algae. It all depends on the tank dimension, height of suspension, age of the tank, type of plants and fertilizing regime.

I feel so sad that you got rid of your ferns for the Hydrophlia....did you get the normal one or the one with white vein markings on leaves? The latter is not easy to find. I think there is a third variant where the leaves are narrower.

The fan blowing downwards is irritating...hahaha!!!

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## David

PS: please do observe for photosynthesis. If you see none that you normal would over 2 days, bump up your percentage by 1 point and observe again for 2 more days. Keep bumping till you do.

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## Henlek

Thanks David! As the thread was for Razor, I felt bad page 3 became algae. However I wanted to sound out that when one jumps ship to high powered LEDs such as the Razor, he must be knowlegeable enough to operate it, not just how nice and efficient they are, else it could become a potential disaster. Many years ago, it was just sand, then came all kinds of aquasoil, bringing in a whole new world to us and some people struggled. Similarly, in a generation of high tech LEDs, the lesser informed will struggle again. Perhaps 20 years down, some sort of nuclear powered lights will arrive, people will again struggle. Going high tech means our brains must keep up unnaturally, somethimes messing up ourselves (myself, not all of you, peace). Diana Walstad would murmur "serve you right".


But since we don't like to put our tanks near the window, the Razor comes in and no doubts is one very very good and affordable machine compared to chunky MHs. The Razor produces minimum glare, minimum light spills, all the energy appears to be thrown directly into the tank. Go ahead potential owners! Start low if you have never heard of par. You can get cut by the *razor*.

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## Henlek

> I feel so sad that you got rid of your ferns for the Hydrophlia....did you get the normal one or the one with white vein markings on leaves? The latter is not easy to find. I think there is a third variant where the leaves are narrower.
> 
> The fan blowing downwards is irritating...hahaha!!!


(Now worse, plants  :Opps: ) I'm not sure, looks like the whole leaf is pale green completely and surely not the narrow type as it looks ordinary to me. 12 hours into poking them in, the leaves seem to whiter a little... maybe shock. I put the slow ferns into another tank, no massacre.

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## David

Picture please and how are the rest of the plants reacting to 36%?

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## Henlek

Oh no :Embarassed:  picture? My tank is disgrace. All kinds of problems and torn down plants because of all the algae science has known. When I get back home later, I will take a pic of the nightmare.

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## David

It's okay...we all have been there before. More importantly is are there any photosynthesis at 36%

Perhaps a new thread so others can contribute?

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## Urban Aquaria

I've been following the latest discussion with keen interest, maybe i can share some observations on it...

I noticed that Henlek's high-tech tank is around 40 gallons, and at the suggested 36% of 160 watt Razor LED lights (8,000k), which i assume works out to 57.6 watts, results in 1.44 watts per gallon (wpg).

My current setup is running 20+ watts LED (also 8,000k) in a 17 gallon high-tech tank which works out to only around 1.2 watt per gallon. I still get pearling and healthy plant growth, and yet have very little algae issues. But if i add more lights, algae starts to become a problem again.

Maybe we are starting to see a pattern here... perhaps the watt per gallon rule could still be used as a base reference for LED lights, just in a different "ratio" compared to florescent T5/T8 lights. Assuming there is optimal levels of nutrients and Co2, it seems a range of 1-2 wpg could be considered the ideal range for LED lights which is not too strong yet not too weak.  :Smile:

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## David

Hi UA...you could be right...I am doing about 1.7 watts per gallon just that my tank is 60cm in height ...less gravel and base feet about 56cm

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## thebaldingaquarist

I did some research into LEDs.

I have to disagree about the ratio thing. The temperature and frequency of the LED is important. Every plant reacts and needs a different temperature and frequency of light. Its a popular belief that all plants like a certain frequency and temperature, but thats not true.. its true, however that "alot" of aquatic plants react to a limited range of temperature and freq.

Effective LED lights cater for a broader range of temperatures and frequencies and makes sure to cover (and emphasize) the sweet zone.
In the case of razor, its very good in the sense you can adjust the temp and intensity of the light. making it ideal for a hobbyist to experiment.

So before one gets a off the shelf LED, you will need to understand what you are getting. not all LED lights are equal.
Don't be like me..
Go in, see wattage, see got blue LED and go GAGA.

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## Urban Aquaria

> Effective LED lights cater for a broader range of temperatures and frequencies and makes sure to cover (and emphasize) the sweet zone.
> In the case of razor, its very good in the sense you can adjust the temp and intensity of the light. making it ideal for a hobbyist to experiment.
> 
> So before one gets a off the shelf LED, you will need to understand what you are getting. not all LED lights are equal.


That's true... when i started buying LED lights, i was randomly buying all those that were actually not designed for growing plants, many were actually made for marine tanks or just for viewing fishes, so although the wattage seems high enough, the mix of spectrums were not actually suitable for planted tanks, end up the plants don't benefit as much and encourage algae instead.

Luckily now there are more and more companies coming out with mass market LED lights that have spectrums specifically tuned for planted tanks, so it makes choosing the right ones much easier.  :Smile:

----------


## David

Are we now back to the CRI issue again and or color temp?

Because the last time I was into it....well... there were a lot of different views and I left it as that... :Wink: 

Wattage is a measure of intensity of the light set in question and different kind of light set of the same wattage produces different intensity.

CRI or color temp range is about the wave length range of the light set in question regardless of its intensity.

Both are just as important which was why I asked Henkel the reason behind have his A channel at 40% and his B channel at 60%. The net effect in terms of intensity is 50% but by doing so, he has altered the CRI and or color temp of the Razor. This means in a nutshell that it's no longer a 8000K but something else.

So in this sense I agree with both of you. UA is focusing on intensity while Erctheanda is focusing on CRI and or color temp.

----------


## Henlek

In reading the last 5 posts, I suddenly don't feel alone anymore. Going by UA's notes, I think David's 36% for me is as close as a best start. Temperature theory by Erctheanda highlighted my insanity in doing 40warm/60cool for planted.

2 weeks ago, twice the greens. This is the result of poor judgement, torn down and dying greens..... 



As you can see above, a lousy camera has its advantages. 

I probably would give this crap another month or so before I say its last prayers and start all over again. Next time, 36% will do.

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## David

Henkel....your tank is beautiful....what's wrong with it? You got hit by greenwater once. Just UV till clear and change the filter wool. If you want to be double confirmation, UV another week.

Your Polyspemer looks fine.

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## David

Iooking at your tank, Indica may have been nicer?

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## thebaldingaquarist

Your tank looks great! Don't be so hard on yourself bro.

Algae is our best friend. Too many best friends is not good for you. But cannot do without it. 

Back to the topic. 

So, any consumer advice? Buy? Don't buy? Wait for another version? Wait for sale? What's the verdict?!

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## David

No need to tear down. It can recover....

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## David

Verdict is that any aquarist looking for a mid range LED, the Razor recommend, I would.

Don't under estimate it's ability. Maxspect made it in 30cm, 60cm and 90cm is for a reason.

The right one to by is corresponding to the tank length. In Henkel's case, a 60cm Razor would be more than enough.

As for the channel percentage, if one is not an advanced aquarist or just want to Keep It Simple, leave it at equal percentage and correspond the intensity based on a 1.5 watts to 3 liters of water as a starting point and bump one's way up till an optimal point is reached for photosynthesis.

For me, I use the percentage just for sunrise to sunset to moonlight play with the TP (Timing Point).

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## Henlek

Thank you all for the kind words and encouragements. The picture doesn't tell, it is really an algae disneyland in there. Recently the algae have new partners in detritus worms. Perfect. Compounding matters, recurring GW. But at least that is easy to taser with a UV. Biological suicide due to plant decay, rich soil and way too much light in the begining, beyond repair.

Ok Stop nagging.

The Razor is really one very good machine, prospective owners must be as good. I also know that the smaller 120W version does not come with ceiling mounts, so in case you intend to hang it. And yes it is fun to play with the TP, I have mine going something like this: TP1 08:00 1%, TP2 10:30 1%, TP3 11:00 36%, TP4 19:00 36%, TP5 19:30 1%, TP6 23:00 0%. Hope I'm not inviting yet another bewilderment here.

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## Henlek

> It's okay...we all have been there before. More importantly is are there any photosynthesis at 36%
> 
> Perhaps a new thread so others can contribute?


Oh yes David, forgot to tell you that I'm also quite keen to find out if there any life at 36%. Didn't have the time to observe yet as the timing clashes with work hours, and partly also difficult to bring myself to stare at the misery. This weekend will be good to investigate.

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## bennyc

David, just to ask a noob question, how do you know/find out the optimal point is reached for photosynthesis? No algae or pearling or what ?

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## David

@Henkel...the 120watts does come with ceiling mount. Your TP points looks fine...just that why are you not doing it so that it coincides with your after working hours?

@bennyc...there will always be indicative signs of photosynthesis by the release of O2 bubble strings and or pearling. Through my experience with the Razor with the standard stand, a 60cm height tank should be starting around 70 to 75% while a 45cm height tank should be around 40 to 45%

The above is about the guideline as a starting point based on the right sizing of the Razor to tank, meaning a tank of length of 60cm to 75cm should be using a single 60cm Razor, a 90cm should be a 90cm razor, a 120cm should be a 2 x 60cm. There will always be variations as they are dependant on the plant mix. As for myself, I am currently pushing at 73% as I am trying to increase the rate of growth for my DHG (Dwarf Hair Grass) which I can sleep for two months or so just to see coverage of the foreground... :Knockout:

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## Henlek

> @Henkel...the 120watts does come with ceiling mount. Your TP points looks fine...just that why are you not doing it so that it coincides with your after working hours?


Sorry for the misinformation, indeed mounts are included. Plants have much shorter working time than me, by the Razor's last TP6, I'm not even home yet :Crying:  Btw, at 36%, I could not see any photo going on, guess I would have to raise it slowly in future.

In any case, I have just switched off all life support, co2, lights, chiller etc. David, I would like to express my deep appreciation for your thread, schooling and encouragements (not forgetting others too), now I know how to use my Razor properly for my new start. Thank you!

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## David

I am so sorry that you are restarting your tank? I understand how you feel because it happened to me as well.

Push forward. Don't give up and I am sure you will get the balance right.

I wait impatiently to you new setup.

PS: start at 38% the next time round and ensure that your TP is adjusted to when you are home from work. Do this by setting the clock backwards by 2 hours to 3 hours.

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## Henlek

[QUOTE=David;744523]I am so sorry that you are restarting your tank? I understand how you feel because it happened to me as well.

Push forward. Don't give up and I am sure you will get the balance right.

I wait impatiently to you new setup.
QUOTE]

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## thebaldingaquarist

[QUOTE=Henlek;744567]


> I am so sorry that you are restarting your tank? I understand how you feel because it happened to me as well.
> 
> Push forward. Don't give up and I am sure you will get the balance right.
> 
> I wait impatiently to you new setup.
> QUOTE]



HAHAHA, is there a LIKE for this post? PLUS 1 from me!

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## milk_vanilla

so max razor is really cutting your tank off huh ?

 :Wink: 

Keep tunes on your new coming tank.

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## David

[QUOTE=Henlek;744567]


> I am so sorry that you are restarting your tank? I understand how you feel because it happened to me as well.
> 
> Push forward. Don't give up and I am sure you will get the balance right.
> 
> I wait impatiently to you new setup.
> QUOTE]


That is the SPIRIT.....I be right here waiting to see your new setup.... :Wink:

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## Tank_In_Motion

Hi Henlek, thought I share my experience with you since our specs are pretty much the same.

My tank's dimension is 70X45X45 and I am also using the 160W version of the Maxspect.
Substrate: ADA Powersand special S, Amazonia and Powder
Ferts: Seachem potassium, trace and iron 
My lighting schedule: TP1 05:00 0%, TP2 10:00 0%, TP3 11:30 60%, TP4 19:30 60%, TP5 20:00 5% 0%, TP6 23:30 0% 1%
Distance from water surface 30cm.

Tank was started from scratch about 2.5 weeks ago. So far have conducted 5 water changes of 50%, not every other day as recommended by ADA, too much of a hassle. Mainly slow growing plants consisting of tridents, bolbitis, anubias nana petite, various cryps and pinnatifida. The foreground plants are a mix of HC, staurogyne repens, Japanese hairgrass, Lilaeopsis brasiliensis and tenullus. The only plant that is growing like a weed is probably only the tenullus. 

Main form of algae that I am experiencing so far is the hair/thread algae that's clinging on to my fissidens and hairgrass. Haven't gone to the extent of engulfing my entire tank yet but it is starting to be an eye sore especially on my fissdens. Still comtemplating how to get rid of them, probably going to physically remove as much as I can and dosing with excel.

Hair/thread algae on my fissidens

hair algae1.jpg

Present state of tank

Day 20 1.1.jpg

Probably will have to solve my hair algae issues soon before it gets any worse.

Good luck with your new set up! Cheers...

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## David

Tank_in_Motion

Are you injecting CO2 into your tank? If so, how much are you injecting into your tank in terms of the KH to PH chart and or by CO2 indicator?

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## Henlek

Nice Nice, very natural job T_I_M! Thank you for sharing. Your pics bring back memories of my deceased tank, very similar, right down to the TPs. Very nicely done Fissidens on the driftwood too. I'm really not too sure but 60% sounds alot of light to me now, since if you followed this thread, I'm going to play safe David's way, start low and work upwards. Could this have contributed to the hair algae? I saw that you got ferts K & trace covered, can I learn why there are no N & P? 

Btw, I wonder if anyone using the Razor realise that somehow it gives the tank a warm green look. When I was using T5s, my tanks looks clearer and a whiter tone.

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## David

@Henlek....It may or may not be the light intensity alone as he is hanging it at a height of 30cm. Based on his percentage of 60% he is getting about 0.7w to 0.8w there abouts (perhaps 55% may be better based on the plants he is having)? As he is using ADA soil, and to my understanding (correct me if I am wrong please) it leeches NH and thereby starts the water cycle without the need for any form of bioload.

One of the contributing factor may be that he is dosing his tank too early and in what proportion is he dosing? My take is that the tank has not fully cycled and his plants has not fully acclimatized to his water parimeter for dosing. Most of his plants are either slow growers and/or root feeders is another contributing factor. There are no fast growing tank starter stemmed plants like the Hydrophilias or Rotalas. While the Tennulus are growing, I noticed that they are pale.

Water circulation may be an issue combined with a greater need for CO2?

To answer your question about the Razor, take a look at the following video that will answer your question.

http://youtu.be/3A49TGvLdDw

In this video, please noticed the size of tank to the size of the Razor used..... :Smile:

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## Tank_In_Motion

Hi Henlek

As mentioned by David, will be depending on the leeching from the aquasoil to supplement the N & P for the next few months or until it is exhausted.

Hi David

Am dosing CO2 at about 3bps from an inline diffuser and I would like to think that the circulation in my tank is sufficient as it is coming from two sources, a 2217 and a surface skimmer that doubles up as a powerhead, both positioned diagonally across each other such that the current is pushed around one full circle. I haven't introduced much fauna into my tank yet but I do feel sorry for my Sakuras which are constantly battling this whirlpool 24/7.

As for my fert regime, I am dosing 10ml of Seachem's Potassium and Trace everyday, at least for now. You might be right about me dosing too early and that my plants are not fully acclimatized, the verdict's not out yet as my tank is probably not fully cycled (haven't done any tests yet). The plants are definitely not looking their best...yet, as most are grown from their emersed forms. Will decide any changes to my fert regimes once the plants fully take on their submersed forms. I am new to this hobby so pretty much still experimenting with all the feedback from the forumers. 

But what I did change was to tune down my lights from 70% to 60% after reading through this thread, when Henlek was advised to tune down to 36% and Urban was using only 50-60%. However this is what I observed from my plants at the end of the day, the plants higher up the tank were bubbling but the plants right at the bottom ie the HCs and the tenellus decided to take the day off. Hardly a bubble in sight...ok they were probably photosynthesising as well but not as hard as I want them to be. So I will probably switch back to 70% tomorrow and see how it pans out. 

As for the paleness of the tenellus, I really do attribute that to atrocious photography and the less than desirable bluish-ness of maxspect's LEDs. To illustrate, this was taken with the blue LEDs tuned down to 0% and warm LEDs left at 70%.
Ok... the photography is just as bad but at least they seem to be taking on a more greenish tint. 
tenullus.jpg

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## David

Hi TIM

The 160w Razor is meant for a 90cm tank and at 100% intensity is more than enough for a 90x60x60. You are now using it for a 70x45x45.
No doubt it is 30cm from the waterline, users for the Razors under estimate it's intensity that can rival the intensity of the MH.

In my opinion, you are dosing your tank way too much too early with most of your plants slow growers, root feeders and no stemmed plants.

It is quite evidential that you have more than enough light at 70% for your Tennulus to be spreading like weed in such a short time frame. Tennulus is a aggressive root feeder so none or very little of your liquid fertilizer is absorbed.

My take is to cut your dosing and if you like to increase the percentage, I will go 65% and not 70%.

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## Henlek

Hey not fair! My lights is at 25cm above water, TIM is 30cm. How come TIM gets to go at 65% but me at 36%?

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## milk_vanilla

We could increase the light to the max, there's nothing wrong with that. But when you increase it and without touching the other parameters ( co2 and ferts) are become limited. Therefore your plants suffer and algae takes this opportunity to role the competition., they are better opportunist than the aquarist.

Some folks bomb their tank with huge amount of co2 and use EI method to make these sources become not the limitation point and with success they could run together with their fancy light. It's end up with super high tech tank ( they called), in the mean time It narrows down your balance equilibrium, which is not impossible but it takes lot of effort, knowledge, experience to reach that certain point. 

So in the end everything back to your decision, decision and decision.  :Wink: 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free

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## Urban Aquaria

Super high tech tanks with no fauna are the best arrangement, without any fishes or shrimps to worry about, can crank up lights, Co2, nutrients and chemicals to crazy levels... after a period of super lush plant growth, then add in a school of fishes, take nice photos, after that take them out.

Unfortunately for the rest of us who want to enjoy seeing fishes and shrimps swimming around the tank daily, no choice have to just keep the tank parameters in moderation instead.  :Grin:

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## David

Henkel, no two tanks are the same. Not only in height. Water perimeter, plant type, plant mass, base fert and fert regime. All plays a part.

The difference is that you got green water and TIM did not. His A and B channel are of equal percentage while yours was not. However, his Frissden and Tennullus are showing signs of a tad too much light.

I would recommended TIM stay 60% as algae has already has a foot hold in his tank. It is complicated with the amount liquid fert he is putting in on a daily basis.

However, his mind is made up to go back to 70% so I just want to go slow at 65% as I am guessing he is around to monitor the situation.

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## Tank_In_Motion

Henkel you are not sulking are you? lol... :Wink: 

Aquascaping is definitely more of an art than science, every tank is unique, fellow forumers can dispense really useful and relevant advice but at the end of the day no one knows your tank's parameters better than yourself. 

Just to reinforce what M_V said and pretty much my take on light intensity as well....be it at 36% or 65%, light intensity only determines how hard you want your plants to work and in turn how fast they will propagate. If one intends to tune up his lights, he would have to power up his dosages of nutrients and CO2 correspondingly because if you expect your plants to work harder but still give them the same miserable portions, they are going to stop working at some point in time when the lights are still on but the nutrients have run out. That's when algae takes over. 

Tom Barr can't seem to stress enough that more often than not, it is not the excess nutrients but the lack of CO2 that motivates alage growth. Drawing theories from EI, that's pretty much the reason why I'm dosing what I'm dosing. However David brought up a good point though, most of my plants are either root feeders or slow growers, with the exception of perhaps a few of my fore to mid ground plants, so I'm not sure how much of my dosing of potassium and traces is put to good use but I would rather have them in excess than to risk a shortfall. 

At the end of the day, these few pointers would be my mantra for now until my tank really screws up.

1. Excess (though not overly excessive) nutrients. 
Intend to keep K & N below 30ppm and P 2-3ppm. Haven't done any tests yet though as my tank is still cycling so am just dosing about 24ppm of K per week and performing my regular water changes to keep the rest of the macros in check.

2. Generous CO2 dosing
I'm probably blasting about 3bps of CO2 (hard to really count anyway) but all I know is my tank looks like soda pop when I'm blasting my CO2 during the day. Used to have a drop checker for the first few days but it constantly shows green so in the end I removed it as it has become more of an algae magnet than anything else. I do dose stuff to keep my KH between 3-4 after every water change to prevent PH swings though.

3. Sufficient water circulation
Sufficient is really subjective but in my case I do see swaying for most of my plants in my tank so that should do. A 2217 and an additional powerhead should suffice for a 2.5 feet tank. Sufficient water flow ensures that nutrients are thoroughly circulated and quite a number of algae issues arise from stagnant water anyway.

4. Regular water changes (50% every 3-4 days for now)
For my case, since I'm dosing my ferts rather regularly, this is to ensure that they do not over accumulate over time and since my tank is still cycling with ADA aquasoil, ammonia levels might reach dangerously high, I haven't done any tests so far though.

Despite my best efforts, I still get algae on some of my plants but I would like to think that is because they are right under the intense glare of my unforgiving 160w LEDs. Oh well, will monitor and see how it goes. 

Cheers  :Cool:

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## stressed

Am also a user of the 120w 8000k set for sometime now. My settings for channel A and channel B are equal. My peak lighting intensity is 75% for a 2ft deep tank. 

Do not have any issues with light unevenness with use of standard bracket provided. 

My water change is about 25% per week and dosage of DIY frets every two to three days and it consists of N, P, K and excel. I only dose trace elements every month as I have observed it generally gives rise to spot algae on my glass, though not bad, it will require me to clean the glass after a fortnight.

I do not drop check my co2 level but tank is like a fizzy tank of sprite during photosynthesis period based on 75% intensity. No chiller except dc fan. Co2 bubble count is about 3bps.

Think my only variable with most users is I have a 75% light intensity only for 3 hour per day. The 2 hour before and after are my light ramp up and ramp down. I am unable to justify scientifically but this model sure works for me.

I get to trim my plants every fortnight or so, no bba etc so I guess the receipt is working, so FYI for those with algae, may want to reduce the photosynthesis period and try.

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## datura

any outcome on your new set up Henlek, hope it works this time for you

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## Henlek

> any outcome on your new set up Henlek, hope it works this time for you


Hi datura, thanks for asking! Yes I'm back (as promised to David). Was thinking of letting it mature more before I prompt David.

And this time it worked much better, thanks to all who contributed to this thread.

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## hobbit6003

I'm currently using the maxspect razor 60W 8K on my 18L tank, intensity is at 70% on both channels.

Plant growth is good as I compliment the strong lighting with good dose of liquid fertilization and CO2. However, I noticed that even as the growth is lush, my Rotala rotundifolia remain green instead of reddish shoot, a friend of mine observe the same with his 120W.

Here's my tank in the thread:
http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...679#post763679

Anyone has any comments on the light's impact on their red plants?

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## milk_vanilla

Would it be because your rotala is at the back, while your led bulbs slightly middle upfront? Led disperse is not wide as t5 though

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## hobbit6003

I don't think so, the spread of the light is pretty good as it is hanging only 13cm from the water surface.

The Rotala's growth has been good, growing to the surface very quickly and having to be trimmed at least once a week. The internodal distance looks normal and even those at or near the water surface is green but pearling like crazy.

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## Urban Aquaria

Your lighting should be more than sufficient... just for comparison, i use the Up Aqua Z-Series light which is only 20+ watts, way lower wattage than your MaxSpect Razor. The rotala leaves closer to the water surface in my tanks are reddish in color.

It could be due to other factors like nutrients or Co2, or maybe it couls be because the plants are still adapting to the tank conditions.

Just curious, did your rotala plants show any hints of yellow/orange or red leaves when you first got it? 

Reason i ask is you might have gotten Rotala sp. Green instead, which will always stay green.  :Smile:

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## hobbit6003

> Your lighting should be more than sufficient... just for comparison, i use the Up Aqua Z-Series light which is only 20+ watts, way lower wattage than your MaxSpect Razor. The rotala leaves closer to the water surface in my tanks are reddish in color.
> 
> It could be due to other factors like nutrients or Co2, or maybe it couls be because the plants are still adapting to the tank conditions.
> 
> Just curious, did your rotala plants show any hints of yellow/orange or red leaves when you first got it? 
> 
> Reason i ask is you might have gotten Rotala sp. Green instead, which will always stay green.


Yup, light is definitely very adequate. As for CO2 and other nutrients, I'm quite sure they have ample inside the tank. Growth of the plants is extremely healthy and fast, and I think I'm close to getting the right balance of nutrients in the tank, as I observe the growth of plants, the rate of )2 saturation, as well as algae growth, which has been very significantly reduced after I reduced my light intensity and increased my K and PO4.

Come to think of it, you may be right that I've gotten the green species as I think I only see slight tinges of pinkish stems but the shoots a had green leaves when I bought them, hmm.....

I decide to let them all grow and trail the water surface and see what I get, these weeds are growing at a really fast rate for now...

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## Urban Aquaria

Yeah, if the plants are growing well and you still haven't seen any yellowish/orange or reddish tint in the leaves so far, then it most likely the sp. Green version... its still a nice variant though, the color is very distinct.

Btw, if you do get an opportunity to go shopping for _Rotala sp. 'Rotundifolia'_  again at any LFS again, their initial leaves are usually all bright red color in the pot (benefits of being grown under the power of direct sunlight at plant farms!). Sometimes if those pots have been sitting in the LFS tank for a few days, you might also notice new shoots and submersed leaves growing out and those would tend to be orange to light green color, depending on the lighting they use.  :Smile:

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## hobbit6003

Haha, since everything is green, I'm complimenting the tank with a school of Endler's Livebearers which add the much needed dash of red in the water. Great algae control crew too, together with the shrimps, nerite snails and ottocinclus, the green algae on the rocks are being reduced at a significant rate. 

Besides these green algae on rocks, I do have very little GSA on the glass near the substrate level, which I think is normal.

After reading this thread, I guess the amount of light and intensity, differs greatly from tank to tank, depending on dimension, types of plants, layout, water circulation, and then tweaking and tritrating the fertilisation regime and CO2.

For this tank, I start with very high intensity of light (100% on both channels), achieve fast growth, and then observe for algae, then adjust downwards my light intensity and also fine tuning the liquid fertilisation regime. Today, I think I'm close to getting the right mix, and have kept the algae at bay.

But then again, itch fingers will come in later, changing flora and fauna, and the whole titration process starts all over again, I guess this is the fun of the hobby right?  :Razz:

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## Henlek

> I'm currently using the maxspect razor 60W 8K on my 18L tank, intensity is at 70% on both channels.
> 
> Plant growth is good as I compliment the strong lighting with good dose of liquid fertilization and CO2. However, I noticed that even as the growth is lush, my Rotala rotundifolia remain green instead of reddish shoot, a friend of mine observe the same with his 120W.
> 
> Here's my tank in the thread:
> http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...679#post763679
> 
> Anyone has any comments on the light's impact on their red plants?


I have Ludwigia Glandulosa at the back of my tank with the Razor close to it. When I first bought it, it was so red but within 1 half week, it turned green. I was thinking it's due to lights as I ran the Razor at 50% only.

I have heard many say that iron and light are the main factors, but then many also said no. Out of curiosity, I went ahead and got ADA iron bottom, pushed 2 tabs into the Ludwigia area which is only about 14 by 10cm. Surprisingly it turn much redder and i did not adjust the light. Never as red as before though. I am not sure if it was the iron tabs but anything alse remained the same. Another interesting thing was 2 weeks ago I trimmed them as they were getting too tall, they turn back green. I don't know why, but they look healthy.

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## ne0matr1x

Can I check with the bros here who have use this light. It seems form the brief reads that I have in this thread, most if not all of you did not turn the lights to 100%.
In that case what would be a better set up for a 4' x 1.5' x 1.5' with the light suspended at 20cm above the water surface?

1. 2 x MAXSPECT Razor 120W

or

2. 2 x MAXSPECT Razor 160W

or 

3. 1 x MAXSPECT Razor 3000W


Mine is a heavily planted tank.

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## milk_vanilla

I'm not owning razor, but mine is also dim able. 
I feel proper light spread cover against your tank size is more important to be determined before your coming purchase. Light power can be adjusted later based on the necessity, it's the benefit for dim able light fixture  :Wink:

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## ne0matr1x

> I'm not owning razor, but mine is also dim able. 
> I feel proper light spread cover against your tank size is more important to be determined before your coming purchase. Light power can be adjusted later based on the necessity, it's the benefit for dim able light fixture


Thanks milk_vanilla. Does that means option 1 or 2 better? Since they are separate units and can relocated to the exact place you want? in that case, 120W x 2 pcs enough?

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## milk_vanilla

I'm not really familiar with razor model, but if i were you and budget it's not your constraint i will take the higher model, you could play with the power anyway later on. 

But please explore their dimension too, when you hang them both side by side.

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## ne0matr1x

> I'm not owning razor, but mine is also dim able. 
> I feel proper light spread cover against your tank size is more important to be determined before your coming purchase. Light power can be adjusted later based on the necessity, it's the benefit for dim able light fixture



Hmmm.... proper light spread cover. In that case will this be a better option?
http://www.delightings.com/index.cfm?GPID=109

Looks like it can be independently positioned to focus on different areas of your tank.

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## Stuart Phoon

Hi. I have a 60cm height tank. Vol of approximately 190 litres after counting in sand rocks etc. What % do you reckon i should start at and how many hrs for the photoperiod?

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## tropic

> Hi. I have a 60cm height tank. Vol of approximately 190 litres after counting in sand rocks etc. What % do you reckon i should start at and how many hrs for the photoperiod?


IMO, if you are hanging, can consider about 40cm above tank. Start of 30-40% and ramp up gradually. My guess most users will stop arnd 70% range as the lights are pretty bright. Longer duration and stronger intensity will also leads to algae.

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## shaohao85

Am running on 60 percent .. 7 hours including ramming up and down .. only keeping simple plants and shrimp

uploadfromtaptalk1447789719364.jpg

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## Stuart Phoon

how big is your tank?

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