# Killies Import > Non-Killie Segment >  Pseudomugil furcatus and Marosatherina ladigesi aggressive?

## dageti

dear all,

these fish have just recently begun to appear in LFS in Italy, and while many people are drawn to them because of their lovely finnage and colours, very little is known about them, and specifically about their disposition toward tankmates. now a lady I know just bought 2 pairs of _P. furcatus_ and 1 pair of _M. ladigesi_ and placed them together in a densely planted tank. soon, she observed a lot of fighting between the two species and among the _furcatus_. it seems more a territorial thing than feeding competition, because she says things have since calmed down a bit, and that feeding the fish did not seem to trigger aggression (she spread out the food evenly on the water surface to make sure every one got their bit though).

now both _P. furcatus_ and _M. ladigesi_ get the generic 'peaceful schooling fish' label pretty much everywhere, but the experience of some of you seems to suggest otherwise. in a private conversation Jianyang told me _furcatus_ are usually more aggressive than _gertrudae_ for instance. he also mentioned Ron once had these fish and noticed they were aggressive. could Ron or anyone else who had these fish recount their experiences? are these fish actually aggressive under certain conditions? what apparently triggers attacks and what works in keeping the aggression level low? my friend started a thread in the italian boards but we hardly have any answers to her questions, so your posts will be much appreciated by many. thanks for your help,

francesco

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## RonWill

Hi Francesco,
I am presently breeding two _Pseudomugil_ species, namely; _P. gertrudae_ and _P. signifer_. Used to keep _P. furcatus_ and the Celebes rainbow (_Marosatherina ladigesi_) and from personal experience, they can really bicker amongst themselves and closely related (or similar looking) tankmates like the _P. signifier_.

However, it is during such times that one can observe males sparring and displaying their finnage but in a community tank with more peaceful and slower growing fishes, like the Clown killie, their almost-non-stop harassment can cause alot of stress.

Like Zebra fish (or _danios_ species), there seems little we can do to curb their hyper-speed activities except provide ample tank space and more turbulent water movement. They will bicker less when well fed and contented but the *only* time they don't "fight" is when I switch off the lights!

Oh... and don't believe everything you read. The "peaceful" label is very subjective, as in, "I might not kill you but I'll probably harass you to death"  :Twisted Evil:

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## dageti

Ron,
thank you very much for your reply. my friend will be instructed accordingly  :Smile: . she intends to move the fish to a larger tank later (she is now raising angelfish fry in it). in the meantime, she'll be feeding the _furcatus_ and the _ladigesi_ well and keeping a close eye on them. they have stopped fighting for now, probably because territories have been established, but you never know.

it's interesting what you said about 'peaceful' being a very subjective notion. yes, I have always been suspicious of the 'peaceful' label applied to pretty much any fish that is not obviously large and nasty/predative looking. I see now that it also varies a lot according to where you are from: you mentioned zebra fish. here in italy, any beginner who wanted unaggressive cyprinids for the community tank would be invariably told to try the 'peaceful' _Brachydanio_, as opposed to let's say, _Barbus tetrazona_.  :Laughing:  

I hope you won't mind another request: I was thrilled when I read you are keeping the _signifer_. they are by far my favourite rainbows and one of my favorite of all fish species (and my nickname and avatar in the italian boards  :Cool: ). trouble is, _nobody_ keeps them here, let alone sell them. I am desperate to see them in italy any time soon. so I would love it if you could tell me something more about their care and breeding when you have time. I did a bit of reading myself but you know nothing beats first hand experience. and..I hate to sound rude, but do you believe that _signifer_ eggs could ship well? it's far too cold now, but if you are still keeping them by next spring and they are breeding, I would pay the earth for a batch of eggs, or trade for anything you might need from europe. I've been drooling over those fishies so long. 

thanks again,

francesco

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## RonWill

> ...but if you are still keeping them by next spring and they are breeding, I would pay the earth for a batch of eggs, or trade for anything you might need from europe


James Bond said, "The world is not enough" but then again, you don't have to pay through your nose for _signifier_ eggs either.

Honestly, I used to be very gung ho in sending things out but after stumbling over a few blocks of red tapes, I'm more careful before saying "no problem". Find out what you can regarding eggs-in-post and get back to me.

Francesco, I wanted to show you some pics of the _signifer_ but as Gan found out (with his _furcatus_), these fellas are fast and their highly reflective sheen makes phototaking a real pain. Their beauty and colors are very subtle and with flash photography from point-and-shoot digital cameras, the details are very washed out. 

_P. signifer_ are at their best just before meal times, when they'll all gather up front and flaring their finnage. At other times, they're just too 'lazy' to show off like in *Adrian's page*.

For now, the _gertrudae_ are doing it like rabbits but oddly, nothing from the _signifer_ (lots of snails in their mop though  :Confused:  ) Moved the entire lot over to another breeding tank and let's see if I get anything viable.

Water incubation period for most _Pseudomugil_ species is 6~10days at 29ºC, so Express Air is best, with about 10 eggs to each breathable bag.

Let's see if I can shoot a short video clip instead...

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## dageti

Ron,

thanks for your reply. I understand you have good reasons for being more cautious about sending eggs than in the past. I know it can be a real pain when buraucracy stands in the way, so I do appreciate you 'leaving an open door', as we say in italy. I'll come back to you when the cold is over and get information on shipping in the meantime. 



this is the picture that got me madly in love with the _signifer_ in the first place. (for reasons maybe best left unexplained, I've always been a sucker for fish with long pointed fins: chromaphyos, _Iriatherina_, angelfish etc). I agree that they have a subtler beauty compared to other rainbows, but they're still the loveliest of all to me.

I know something about photographing fish and frustration. I've tried to learn as much as I could from the photography threads in the forum but I still have a long way to go with my Coolpix 4500. and fish are so uncooperative. my blue rainbows _Melanotaenia praecox_ would not stand still for a second as I tried to take pics, so I opted for a movie to document the chasing and displaying of fins. of course, as soon as I switched the camera to video mode, they formed a lovely tight shoal and stood perfectly still until I was done filming, right under the front lights that best capture their metallic colours. 

francesco

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## hwchoy

Francesco, you mentioned Barbus tetrazona. Want to point out that it is generally accepted usage that Barbus is for use with European and African cyprinid groups while Asian ones are generally assigned to the genus _Puntius_. Note that none of these are monophyletic (i.e. they are not related to a common ancestor) hence more revision is required.

For southeast Asian barbs, a number of species have been assigned to their own genus for example the tetrazona is recognised under _Systomus_ for having several common traits such as a serrated dorsal spine. Things vary depending on the schools of thought but definitely asian barbs should be named under _Puntius_.

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## Green Baron

All my family members love the _Pseudomugil furcatus_ ! I went back to the LFS hoping to get a few more _furcatus_ but alas there were none left :-( I ended up getting _P. gertrudae_ relunctantly. Now I am really glad I got the _gertrudae_ as they are actually quite pretty after they acclimatised to my tank. 

I'll try to take some photos of the _gertrudae_ this weekend but no promise as they are really active. It will be easier to photograph them in a photo tank but I am too lazy to do that so I'll just have to be patience.

The _Pseudomugil_ and _Melanotaenia_ are great show fish for planted tank. My 3 ft tank has stabilised and with the addition of these rainbow fish, the tank is now a conversation piece whenever I have visitors.
This is how my tank look like after I rescape it in October.


I am still looking for a few more _P. furcatus_. Anybody who which LFS has this fish ?

Ronnie,
Where did you get the _P. signifer_ ? I would like to get a few of this fish as well !

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## keehoe

Gan, Try the two fish shop along havelock road near 河水山 community center. "xxxxxx engineering" might have that.

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