# Other Aquarium Forums > Freshwater Fauna > Killifish >  Overseas eggs order?

## zmzfam

As an update to this thread, and to whet others appetite  :Twisted Evil:  , these were the eggs that I ordered. 
These eggs arrived in Singapore on Thursday 11 March 2004. Flying by first class, the eggs took 3 days (Singapore time) to arrive and they arrived in good condition - read no fungused eggs and no mushy-mushy dead frys.
I don't have any photos of the eggs - no DC, money all spent on killies  :Confused:  - but the eggs were all on peat, similar to the photos in this thread.

My eggs-list and their hatch-rate:*
_Aphyosemion australe_ 'Cape Esterias' EBT96/27 - 12 / 16 
_Rivulus agilae_ 'Mont de Mahury' &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp - 15 / 20 
_Rivulus derhami_ 'Tingo Marie' &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp - 10 / 20 
_Rivulus cylindraceus_ 'Al Castro' strain &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp - 14 / 14 
_Aphyosemion exigoudeum_ 'Ngoudoufola' &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp- 10 / 20
_Fundulopanchax gardneri nigerianus_ 'Makurdi' &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp - 12 / 20
_Fundulopanchax gardneri nigerianus_ 'Misaje' &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp &nbsp- 1 / 20 (This is my fault - should have gotten a better hatch rate)

* xx / yy should read xx frys out of yy eggs

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## zmzfam

Hehehe  :Twisted Evil:  ....now as per the title of this thread, anybody keen to participate in a new mass egg order?

Maybe should have started this thread as a poll also  :Rolling Eyes:  

Anyway, if you are keen, do reply to this thread. Ronnie would also be interested in how many are willing to participate in the next round of mass eggs order - are you Ron  :Question: 

We can list the eggs we should bring in later or as we go along.

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## RonWill

> Anyway, if you are keen, do reply to this thread. Ronnie would also be interested in how many are willing to participate in the next round of mass eggs order - are you Ron


Zul,
I'm game to tag along and share shipping cost with *anyone* who has the initiative to bring in their own killie eggs. It's my own way of showing support for having more killie species locally.

If you wish, I can have you spear-head and organise the next mass order... you game?

Of course, when the ordered eggs are confirmed in stock and due for shipping, I'd expect the participants to fork out the money first (I would, since my money don't grow on trees  :Rolling Eyes:  ). LMK if that's ok with you.

BTW, I should have you hatch out all my eggs... you've got good wet fingers!!!

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## CM Media

Seems that you're ready to co-ordinate the mass order.  :Twisted Evil:   :Twisted Evil:  

Nice to see you're taking the lead. Good try on your orders.  :Very Happy:  

Guys, this is a good chance for you to own some of your dream killifish with proper population code. Do not get this chance miss out. :wink:

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## zmzfam

> If you wish, I can have you spear-head and organise the next mass order... you game?





> Seems that you're ready to co-ordinate the mass order.


Hahaha....I expected that once I started this thread. Not a problem on my part to do the co-ordination. However, need people like you and Au to come out with the list of species to order.

Just need to know who is game enough to join in.

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## RonWill

Zul,
Thank you for not shrinking away in fright... I know it's a daunting task to ask of you. :wink: 

For the species list, I'm not the one selling eggs... so it'd be advisable to request for a current list of available species. Remember too, that some, especially non-annuals, are not egg-machines or vending-machine, where you can pop in your coins and out comes a nice cold canned drink!!

I think I know from whom you acquired the earlier batch of eggs, so why not check back with him and see what goodies he has for us?

For starters, I'll be game for *all* species of;
Aphyosemion elberti - any population
Chromaphy splendopleure - any population

Anyone else want to keep the ball rolling?

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## timebomb

Zul,

I'm keen on participating in the egg mass order but can you reveal the source? You seem to getting very good hatch rates. I would also like to see a fish and egg list from the breeder you're buying the eggs from.

Thank you.

Loh K L

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## zmzfam

I got them from David Mikkelsen - Ron did you guess right?

I think you should know his website - http://www.thekillifishsource.com. Those who are interested can take a look at his website and see if there are any species they fancy.

The good hatch rate I attribute it to good luck. As I had mentioned before, when I received the package and look through all the peat, there was no sign of any fungus - which was good.

For non-annuals, the best hatch rate I found was when I picked the eggs (upon eyed-up) from the peat and put them in a container of clean water - not tank water. The last time I did that to the _Aphyosemion cognatum_ I managed to get 14 frys out of 16 eggs.

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## ruyle

> I think you should know his website - http://www.killifishdavid.com.


Ummmm, try http://www.thekillifishsource.com the above URL won't display.

Bill
farang9

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## zmzfam

:Opps:   :Opps:   :Opps:  Thanks again Bill. Guess it's time to go home when I typed that.
Have amended my post.  :Opps:   :Opps:

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## PohSan

This time, I think that I am ready for the mass egg ordering.  :Smile:  . Is that a due date when we have to finallize the ordering list? 

Regards,
Ong Poh San

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## stormhawk

Add me in for a bag of Terranatos :wink:

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## RonWill

Zul, so my guess was correct and I'm happy for your hatch rates. This time, will you babysit the eggs/frys for me?  :Laughing:  

Kwek Leong, please advise whether it's appropriate for the species list to be posted here.

David, if you're reading this, please advise whether you and your fishes are ready for a bulk order.

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## timebomb

Rashid sent me a picture of the _Aphyolebias peruensis_ a few days ago and I think it's one of the most beautiful killies I've seen. But I checked David's list and it seems their eggs are sold only through auction. 

I think there's a chance that with a big order, David may be agreeable to selling the _Aphyolebias_ eggs to us directly. What do you think, Zul? I'll be happy with any _Aphyolebias_ eggs, no matter what species.

Loh K L

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## timebomb

> Kwek Leong, please advise whether it's appropriate for the species list to be posted here.


Huh?? What's there to be inappropriate about? I'm fine if you want to put up David's fish and egg list here but I would say it would only clutter up the thread. It's just a matter of one click to go to David's list on his web site. 

I would suggest that David, if he's following this thread,let us know what eggs he has that are available now. I kind of suspect that egg and fish lists are usually not very well updated. I haven't update mine in ages  :Laughing: 

Loh K L

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## zmzfam

I've written to David to take a look at this thread.

Kwek Leong, let's hope that our order is big and you get your eggs.




> This time, will you babysit the eggs/frys for me?


Alamak Ron! Don't carry until like that lah!  :Laughing: 
Hmm.....maybe I can drop my frys at your 'Raffles Hotel' when I go for my reservist.... :wink:




> Is that a due date when we have to finallize the ordering list?


We have not fixed a date yet. You might want to take a look at David's website to see which killie(s) catches your fancy.

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## killifishdavid

Hi Guys,
I just arrived here today! I do try to keep my availability list up to date weekly or bi weekly, but sometimes I may over look something, it is a big list !!! I will trey to put a list together for you, I have the Aphyolebias sp.#153 available now. I also have just aquired 3 new Aphyolebias to my hatchery all wild caught from Southern Peru as well as the new Moema quiii. I have not yet set them up to breed and collect eggs as of yet and do have a couple of standing orders for them all ready. I do not have pics myself of the new Aphyol. sp#152, #165, rubrocaudatus and the Moema quiii but I can email photo's for you to share that belong to the person who exported the fish to us from Peru!! I will send them to Ronnie and let him email them to each of you interested. Will be back here as soon as I have a list. Au SL sorry for delay in white worms just been sooooo busy!
I will send replacement eggs as I am able with this next order.

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## CM Media

> Au SL sorry for delay in white worms just been sooooo busy!


David, it's OK no problem just get your things organise and send when you're able to.
:wink:

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## RonWill

> Alamak Ron! Don't carry until like that lah! 
> Hmm.....maybe I can drop my frys at your 'Raffles Hotel' when I go for my reservist.... :wink:


Zul, I babysit frys all the time... especially those who're out of the country or fulfilling their reservists' training. They usually collect bigger frys than what they brought. Bring your frys over when they're in need of 'room service'.

For the species list, I think I'll stick to the 2 groups earlier mentioned.

OFF TOPIC __________________________________________________________
For those who don't dig the lingo, "Alamak" is equivalent to Bahasa Melayu's (Malay Language) "Oh my gosh!", "Good grief" and urm... "Sheesh!"  :Laughing:  

"Carry" is colloquail Singlish... for "flatter" and urm... "polishing apple"  :Question: 

Zul, Singlish occasionally, will add a local flavor to the message but not everyone will 'catch the drift'. I'm not Bahasa Melayu proficient, so it's best you include post-script translations. Thank you for your compliance  :Cool:

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## RonWill

David, I've reduced the resolution of the 5 pics you emailed me and have uploaded them. Do you/I have permission to show the pics or are they restricted for private viewing? Please advise.

Will these wild specimens have population/collection codes, or just 'sp.#xx'? FWIW, the _Moema quiii_ is still one cool looking fish.

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## timebomb

> Do you/I have permission to show the pics or are they restricted for private viewing? Please advise.


Ronnie, I think it should be okay to upload the pics to the forum but we have to acknowledge the person who owns them. I think David mentioned they belong to the exporter in Peru.

David also said he has the eggs of the Aphyolebias sp.#153 available so that will be my choice. Please take note of that, Zul. Thank you.

Loh K L

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## killifishdavid

The pics belong to Lance Peck of "Gone Wild" in Peru, I believe he has his name layered over some of the pics. I can not give permission, nor do i have permission to use the pics for public viewing. I have emailed him but have yet to recieve a reply. Use your own knowedge and judgement in your decision to post the pics here.

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## RonWill

Dear all,
Hope this makes your day. *All photographs courtesy of Lance R Peck of "Gone Wild", Peru.*
Pending permission. Grab an eyeful of the fishes now... it may not be posted here for long.

 *Aphyolebias sp.# 152*

 *Aphyolebias sp.# 153*

 *Aphyolebias sp.# 165*

_ Moema quiii_

 _Rubrocaudatus_

David, can you give us an idea how large these fellas will grow? From the pics, they look huge!

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## RonWill

David, are the Moema quiii throwing eggs? I would be interested in these and sp. #153 when available.

Looking forward to your available egg list as well.

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## killifishdavid

All of the new wild caught aquisitions are being conditioned and treated for any intestinal parasites that may exsist. I will be setting the Moema and a few groups of the Aphyolebias up to breed very soon. The Aphyolebias sp#153 attained a size of about 3 1/2 to 4 inches. The Moema will reach a size of up to 8 inches!!! I have the 2 largest pairs now in a 55gallon tank with a group of Ep.infrafasciatus. The 2 prs of Moema are about 4 1/2 to 5 inches at this time.

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## timebomb

Wow!! The fish are beautiful. 

I have a soft spot for big Killies. So please let us know when you collect eggs from the Moema, David. 

Loh K L

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## RonWill

> The Moema will reach a size of up to 8 inches!!!


urm... David, I think I'll pass on the _Moema_. At that size, even the infamous SJOs looks like snacks to them  :Exclamation:   :Shocked:

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## A.Rashid

wow.. those Aphyolebias makes me drool already....
slurp slurp slurp.......

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## francis

Wow,i would be interested in these Aphyolebias sp when they are available.

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## zmzfam

Ok, these are the people who have expressed interest in participating in the next egg mass order :

Loh KL
Ronnie Lee
Zulkifli
Rashid
Jianyang
Poh San
Francis ??

How about the rest? Lily??

David,
are you ready with the list? Let's whet the others appetite  :Twisted Evil:

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## R^13^S

I am interested in the mass ordering too, please count me in, thanks.

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## imported_lily

> How about the rest? Lily??


Hi Guys,

Actually I shouldn't be ordering any more eggs because;
Firstly, I am running out of space..
Secondly, I have too many species on hand but nothing like Au with 40 over..Wonder how he handle them????  :Surprised:  
BUT since there is a mass order going on, I would like to place my order too.  :Mr. Green:  
If possible, I am interested in getting the eggs of Micromoema xiphophora.
Thank you.

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## killifishdavid

Lily,
I too would like to get the Mic. xiphophora established in my hatchery!
I had this fish in the early 90's and did fairly well with them, I like them as they are especially peaceful species as well as unusual. So far all eggs I have had sent to me have been zero hatch, s I do not yet have this species.

The Moema quiii have started to spawn in their 2 gallon goldfish bowl filled with peat moss, I will wait about 3 weeks before pulling the peat for the first time to inspect for eggs.

This week I ship out many eggs orders and should be able to put up a list
by the end of next week for you all to pick and choose from. Please be patient with me as my wife is pregnant and ready to give birth any time now! I am 42 years of age and ready for my first children, so this time, now I may be away from the computer at any given moment for this one of the largest events in a mans life!!!

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## ruyle

> Please be patient with me as my wife is pregnant and ready to give birth any time now! I am 42 years of age and ready for my first children, so this time, now I may be away from the computer at any given moment for this one of the largest events in a mans life!!!


Congrats, David!

Bill
farang9

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## zmzfam

Congrats too, David!

Don't worry too much about the mass order, we can wait. Seeing your child delivered the first time is more important and it's a wonderful feeling. I know I enjoyed that moment.

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## timebomb

> Seeing your child delivered the first time is more important and it's a wonderful feeling.


I felt like I was in heaven when my daughters were born but the first time I hatched my own killifish eggs, I was just as happy too  :Laughing: .

Congratulations on becoming a father soon, David. Let us know when it's time to pass the cigars around :wink:

Loh K L

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## imported_lily

From here, I can sense how happy a man you are now,, CONGRATS! David and may the process of your wifes delivery be a smooth and easy one. :wink:

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## Debbbear

Congratulations!! David  :Very Happy:  
I will be thinking of you and your wife.May all go well! 
Lily,
Sure is good to hear from you again!!!

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## RonWill

> This week I ship out many eggs orders and should be able to put up a list by the end of next week for you all to pick and choose from.


That's great... time to look into the piggy bank again!  :Laughing:  




> Please be patient with me as my wife is pregnant and ready to give birth any time now!


Congratulations seems to be order for the day. Best wishes from us all, David and we'll all be looking forward to the addition of the 'new fry' :wink: 




> for this one of the largest events in a mans life!!!


yup, and that of soiled diapers, wee morning feeds, bottles in the sterilizer and... Sounds like a great hobby!  :Laughing:

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## francis

Congratulations David :Smile: 

Best wishes from me and everyone here.

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## CM Media

Congrats David.  :Laughing:  

If you're here, please advise if you could fulfill this mass order that we're trying to consolidate here within the next 2 weeks or so.  :Confused:  

For your info, there will soon be a consolidated order from Korea to you. Hobbyists there are waiting for you to get through with our order before they approach you. 

This way, it'll be easier for you to co-ordinate the 2 orders better. Please advise.

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## zmzfam

Just an update for those people who are interested in the mass order. David has been busy during the last few weeks - one of them getting ready for his baby, but not just yet.

Let's be patience and wait for him to catch up on his hatchery work and prepare us a list. If any of you has any special order, let me know and hopefully he's able to fulfill that also :wink:

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## RonWill

To those who're keen in the 2nd mass order, please browse through the list I've posted in *this thread*.

Please indicate your interest *here*.

For reasons that I really don't know, the time given to choose is very short and if I understand it correct, only ONE bag of each is available (unless David can clarify that himself, together with the pricing?).

I'll side-step first and let you folks have fun 'shopping' (and no elbowing please :wink: ).

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## CM Media

Let me start the ball rolling.... 

David, 

I'll like to have a bag of Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 
Let me know if you can spare a bag. Alternatively, I'll bid on the Aquabid for the eggs.

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## PohSan

Hi David,
This is my order:
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' 

Thanks,
Regards,
Ong Poh San

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## killifishdavid

Au SL and Pohsan, I have these eggs for you !!

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## killifishdavid

yes for price and egg qty, please use the website as a guide !!

http://www.thekillifishsource.com

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## stormhawk

David, add me in for a bag of Simpsonichthys zonatus. By the way, are there any Terranatos eggs available?

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## turaco

To make things easy:

*Au*
Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

*Pohsan*
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' (MOE) 

*Stormhawk*
Simp. zonatus

*Gan(turaco)*
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Nguti' (MOE)

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## timebomb

*Au* _Notho. kafuensis_ 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

*Pohsan* _Paraphyosemion mirabile moense_ 'Bakebe' (MOE) 

*Jianyang aka Stormhawk* _Simp. zonatus_

*Gan(turaco)* _Paraphyosemion mirabile moense_ 'Nguti' (MOE)

*Kwek Leong* _Aphyosemion elberti_ 'Nange Eboko' (ELB) 

If you don't have the Nange Eboko available, David, I'll be happy with any _A. elberti_ eggs. Hope all is well with your wife and newborn.

Loh K L

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## PohSan

Dear David,
I wish to add in a fish which is not in the list. If it is not possible, then I will try the AB. The fish I hope to include is _Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae_ 'Tinto'. Also, what is the new book which you introduced on the home page of your site. I am interested also. 

*Au* _Notho. kafuensis_ 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

*Pohsan* _Paraphyosemion mirabile moense_ 'Bakebe' (MOE) 
_Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae_ 'Tinto'

*Jianyang aka Stormhawk* _Simp. zonatus_

*Gan(turaco)* _Paraphyosemion mirabile moense_ 'Nguti' (MOE)

*Kwek Leong* _Aphyosemion elberti_ 'Nange Eboko' (ELB)

Thanks,
Ong Poh San

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## RonWill

*Au* _Notho. kafuensis_ 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

*Pohsan*
_Paraphyosemion mirabile moense_ 'Bakebe' (MOE) 
_Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae_ 'Tinto'

*Jianyang aka Stormhawk* _Simp. zonatus_

*Gan(turaco)* _Paraphyosemion mirabile moense_ 'Nguti' (MOE)

*Kwek Leong* _Aphyosemion elberti_ 'Nange Eboko' (ELB)

*Ronnie Lee*
_Aphyosemion dargei_ 'Mbam' (DAR)
_Aphyosemion poliaki_ 'Ekona' (PLK)
_Chromaphyosemion splendopleure*_ 'Bamukong Ombe' (SPP)
(*** corrected typo in list spelt; splendopl*ue*re)

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## killifishdavid

Sorry, no DOL eggs right now!!

The rest of your wanted list looks good, should not be a problem for availability. Any eggs that are partly eyed or completely eyed up will be shipped in peat tea water in breather bags.

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## R^13^S

Au Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

Pohsan 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' (MOE) 
Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae 'Tinto' 

Jianyang aka Stormhawk Simp. zonatus 

Gan(turaco) Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Nguti' (MOE) 

Kwek Leong Aphyosemion elberti 'Nange Eboko' (ELB) 

Ronnie Lee 
Aphyosemion dargei 'Mbam' (DAR) 
Aphyosemion poliaki 'Ekona' (PLK) 
Chromaphyosemion splendopluere* 'Bamukong Ombe' (SPP) 

RongSheng
Aphyosemion christyi 'Lobaye'

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## zmzfam

*Au* Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

*Pohsan* 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' (MOE) 
Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae 'Tinto' 

*Jianyang* aka Stormhawk Simp. zonatus 

*Gan(turaco)* Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Nguti' (MOE) 

*Kwek Leong* Aphyosemion elberti 'Nange Eboko' (ELB) 

*Ronnie Lee* 
Aphyosemion dargei 'Mbam' (DAR) 
Aphyosemion poliaki 'Ekona' (PLK) 
Chromaphyosemion splendopluere* 'Bamukong Ombe' (SPP) 

*RongSheng*
Aphyosemion christyi 'Lobaye'

*Zulkifli*
Aphyosemion coeleste 'GBG 93-2'
Aphyosemion marginatum 'Bifoum'
Aphyosemion occidentale 'Mangata'
Rivulus agilae 'Mont de Mahury'


*David*,
can we close the list at 12pm Singapore time? That should give you enough time to consolidate the orders? As a confirmation, I will e-mail you the list separately.

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## killifishdavid

Zulkifli,
Yes that is good time for me! I have all eggs for the orders, I also have for you some eggs of DER tingo maria if you still need them for no charge.
The DER eggs are are close to hatching and i will ship them in water, so they should hatch by the time they reach you.

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## killifishdavid

Also will ship any aquabid auction eggs with same sending, I will send total due with shipping Monday evening, after I have sent the shipment.

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## RonWill

David, I'll make direct payment to you via PayPal, for what auctions I've bidded on (and fortunate to win).

Consolidate mine (and other SG member's winnings, if there are no objections) together with the main order and we'll split shipping at our end.

Kwek Leong, I noted that of the 3 available _elbertis_, you've indicated interest only for the _Aphyosemion elberti_ 'Nange Eboko' (ELB), what about the other 2?, ie. _Ap elberti_ 'Nnen' (ELB) and _Ap elberti_ 'Ndouzem' (ELB)? Will you be taking all 3?

If not, then I'll add that to my list. *David*, please take note of this, if it's not altready too late.

Zul, if you need assistance in prepayment or sorting out the orders (pre and post shipping), just let me know. (PS: Congrats for adding one more chip on your shoulder... my dear co-mod :wink: )

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## zmzfam

> I also have for you some eggs of DER tingo maria if you still need them for no charge.


Thanks David, that's very kind of you. Will be looking forward to try them again.




> Zul, if you need assistance in prepayment or sorting out the orders (pre and post shipping), just let me know.


Hmmm.....wonder how you know about that  :Laughing:  
Thanks, will keep that in mind if I need any help.

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## turaco

David,

Not sure if I can squeeze in 1 more request from Stormhawk(Jianyang), who is now in the Army camp without internet acess but still thinking about killies  :Rolling Eyes:  ?

He is asking for a bag of *Simp. alternatus eggs*. If that is not possible then we will just give it a miss. Sorry about that. 


If possible, this will be our list:

Au Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

Pohsan 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' (MOE) 
Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae 'Tinto' 

Jianyang aka Stormhawk 
Simp. zonatus 
*Simp. alternatus*

Gan(turaco) Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Nguti' (MOE) 

Kwek Leong Aphyosemion elberti 'Nange Eboko' (ELB) 

Ronnie Lee 
Aphyosemion dargei 'Mbam' (DAR) 
Aphyosemion poliaki 'Ekona' (PLK) 
Chromaphyosemion splendopluere* 'Bamukong Ombe' (SPP) 

RongSheng 
Aphyosemion christyi 'Lobaye' 

Zulkifli 
Aphyosemion coeleste 'GBG 93-2' 
Aphyosemion marginatum 'Bifoum' 
Aphyosemion occidentale 'Mangata' 
Rivulus agilae 'Mont de Mahury'

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## zmzfam

Ok guys,

this is the final list. Will be e-mailing this to David as a confirmation.

*Au* 
Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). 

*Pohsan* 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' (MOE) 
Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae 'Tinto' 

*Jianyang* aka Stormhawk 
Simp. zonatus (ZNT)
Simp. alternatus - *if available*

*Gan(turaco)* 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Nguti' (MOE) 

*Kwek Leong* 
Aphyosemion elberti 'Nange Eboko' (ELB) 

*Ronnie Lee* 
Aphyosemion dargei 'Mbam' (DAR) 
Aphyosemion poliaki 'Ekona' (PLK) 
Chromaphyosemion splendopluere 'Bamukong Ombe' (SPP) 
Aphyosemion elberti 'Nnen' (ELB)
Aphyosemion elberti 'Ndouzem' (ELB)

*RongSheng*
Aphyosemion christyi 'Lobaye' (CHR)

*Zulkifli*
Aphyosemion coeleste 'GBG 93-2' (COL)
Aphyosemion marginatum 'Bifoum' (MRG)
Callopanchax occidentale 'Mangata' (OCC)
Rivulus agilae 'Mont de Mahury' (AGI)

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## killifishdavid

Okay I have the order and will confirm the total with shipping and all prices in email to Zulkifli on Monday night or Tuesday for you to send payment. The order will be sent via FedEx May 17th for arrival on May 20th. I will also try to give some extra eggs as I am able for you to share
with those who have had poor results from previous shipments.

THANK YOU ALL !!!

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## RonWill

David, perhaps you'd like to clarify if the extra eggs are for which previous shipments; ie. from the 1st mass order or the separate private orders. IMHO, it's always a good thing to ask when in doubt and I'm sure we're all looking forward to new species in our tanks!

With the obligatory stuff covered, I'd like to express my thanks to the participants and also, my disappointment with the low turnout or hobbyists ordering eggs (including the newbies). Let's just say that I had higher expectations esp. when *shared* Fedex shipping is so fast and very affordable.

Killie eggs do not grow on trees and both Kwek Leong and myself, do not need to be reminded but if the risk-taking are borne by the regulars, there'll come a time when no one will respond to "anyone-has-eggs-to-spare" requests, both local and overseas.

This scenario reminds me of a parlimentary statement quoting, "no one owes you a living". By the same token, no one here is obligated to maintain and sell extra eggs (think about it!!).

It is my personal opinion that for the killifish base stock to be increase and stabilize, and to have a vibrant killie scene, we need newbies' involvement and not fence-sitting.

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## killifishdavid

Ron,
The extra eggs are for which previous shipments; ie. from the 1st mass order . I will send eggs I find at packing time from my stocks, some that come to mind are: gabuense marginatum, australe BSWG !!, australe red/orange, gardneri 'lafia', and ????

I agree with you on the envolvement from newbie's, it does not matter what country you live in, the more individuals in a club or group to work with the fish the better for ALL ! But, especially in a country where it is difficult or virtually impossible to get these species from LFS's.

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## timebomb

> It is my personal opinion that for the killifish base stock to be increase and stabilize, and to have a vibrant killie scene, we need newbies' involvement and not fence-sitting.


Ronnie, I agree with you completely but we have to be patient. Hobbyists in Singapore are not used to the idea of raising their own fish from eggs and the fact is prices of Killifish eggs can be quite daunting to a newbie. The other thing is we may have a skewed view of the Killifish scene here. We think many people know about Killies because of this site/forum but the truth is there's no fish shop in Singapore that specialises in the fish. Human traffic beats eyeball traffic hands down anytime. 

The day a Killifish fish shop opens in Singapore will be the day the Killifish scene takes off in a big way.

By the way, Zul, if you are reading this, I would suggest you bring the eggs to Eco-culture when they arrive. Eco wouldn't mind, I'm sure of this. We can meet and settle accounts there.

Loh K L

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## RonWill

Kwek Leong, I can't quite believe what I'm reading.

We have hobbyists who've stumbled and fall, but find the strength to pick themselves up, and went on to breed discus, bettas, apistos, corys, angelfish and even fancy guppies, but we *can't* handle killie eggs? Raising killie fry is not more difficult than out-growing a brood of discus or ranchus.

If the both of us, as newbies, felt awed by the prices and risks, will this forum exist? Why are we over-protecting the newbies? Have we not provided them with enough information, shared our experiences or are the 'old-birds' expected to hold workshops for every aspect of killie keeping? Perhaps we should teach them how to open a bag of egg-laden peat and at the next workshop, show them how to wet the eggs, how to frame a fresh crispie...

Yes, buying eggs is really too risky, so let's play it real safe for SG-based hobbyists and obligate all sellers to replace failed hatchings. Better yet, let us all expect replacements and shipping to be without charge. Will that sweeten the deal and enhance the killie-keeping experience? Will that motivate us or are we short-changing ourselves?

If later-newbies like Au, Sia Meng, Zul and Jian Yang, get discouraged by their early purchases and gave up, are we richer for it? Perhaps I should tell them to stop wasting their time, dedication and money.

Patience is a virtue, and it's one thing I fail miserably with.

But you're right. Let's be patient. Let's wait...
...for newbies to initiate and organise the next egg order.
...for a killie-only specialty store.
...for courier charges to drop.

Henceforth, shall we both relax and wait for others to bring in new species? We can buy eggs from them. Why should we be at the front-line at all times?

I must be patient but comes the day when Killifish-specialty stores open their doors, I'm afraid that the core group of today's killiekeepers may have moved on, as will I. It may be the 'happening event' of the year but history will repeat itself. There will still be people balking at the steep prices for coded wild-caught populations. Then what? Should we be daunted by these $30 fishes and respond to "my expensive killie died before I can breed it. Does anyone have eggs to spare?"

My post is harsh for the newbies but it's time they get real...
I'm not obliged to hold your hands,
to spoonfeed you information,
to provide starter cultures,
to give you free fishes,
or to sell them cheap.

Or would newbies prefer a menu of killies? (nah... you can forget about being spoilt for choices!)

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## timebomb

> Kwek Leong, I can't quite believe what I'm reading.


Why not, Ronnie?  :Laughing: 

There's one thing you may have forgotten - There are very few hobbyists who are as passionate about the hobby as we are. We belong to a different group and the truth is we can't expect there to be many like us.

Just like you, I'm disappointed by the number of hobbyists who participate in this mass-egg ordering exercise but let's not make a big hoo-haa over this. If we can hatch the eggs and breed the fish, we will make it very expensive for the newbies when they want the fish from us - that's about all we can do  :Laughing:  

Loh K L

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## zmzfam

> By the way, Zul, if you are reading this, I would suggest you bring the eggs to Eco-culture when they arrive. Eco wouldn't mind, I'm sure of this. We can meet and settle accounts there.


It is not a problem if you want to meet at Eco-Culture or at my place, since my place is only a 5 mins walk from the (Paya Lebar) MRT station. I can be at Eco by 6pm but can't stay long. Meeting at my place will be after 8pm. Let me know the preferences.

An update to the orders, David has sent out the package and ETA is Thursday 20th May noon. You can check the tracking status HERE.

I will post again the price of the eggs and also the shipping cost once I know the exchange rate. There are altogether 24 bags of eggs - so shipping cost per bag is drastically reduced.

Ok, I believe that David has shipped extra eggs of other sp with this shipments. Any proposal on whom and how to distribute them?

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## RonWill

Zul,

I'm flexible with meeting/collection venue and will pass on the extra egg. But whoever receives them, please don't feel that the species can be neglected because it was *free*. I'd like to see the species getting established, if all goes well, of course.

Just for the record, the previous participants in the 1st mass order can be found in this thread.

On the brighter side, local hobbyists are receiving a total of 16 new species against 13 from the 1st exercise (excludes duplicate).

Good luck my friends and have those fry foods ready.

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## CM Media

Hi Zul,

6pm should be good for me. I'll see you at Eco Culture and do let me know how much I should pay you for the eggs.

Thanks for your effort in co-ordinating this order. :wink:

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## zmzfam

Hi people.
The exchange rate used is US$1 = S$1.755.  :Confused:  
Shipping cost is US$50 so divided by 24 bags = S$3.70
I'll be rounding up to the nearest dollar on the total.

*Au* 
Notho. kafuensis 'Nanzhila River' ZMTW 99(30 eggs). (US$20)
Shipping : $3.70
Eggs : $35.10
Total : $39.00

*Pohsan* 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Bakebe' (MOE) (US$15)
Paraphyosemion mirabilis traudae 'Tinto' (US$20)
Shipping : $7.40
Eggs : $61.50
Total : $69.00

*Jianyang* aka Stormhawk 
Simp. zonatus (ZNT) (US$20)
Simp. alternatus - *if available* (David did not have enough time to collect the eggs)
Shipping : $3.70
Eggs : $35.10
Total : $39.00

*Gan(turaco)* 
Paraphyosemion mirabile moense 'Nguti' (MOE) (US$15)
Shipping : $3.70
Eggs : $26.30
Total : $30.00

*Kwek Leong* 
Aphyosemion elberti 'Nange Eboko' (ELB) (US$24)
Shipping : $3.70
Eggs : $42.20
Total : $46.00

*Ronnie Lee* 
Shipping : $26.00

*RongSheng*
Aphyosemion christyi 'Lobaye' (CHR) (US$15)
Shipping : $3.70
Eggs : $26.30
Total : $30.00

Those who wants to do bank transfer, my accounts as follows :
POSB Savings *150-01043-8*

Collection place:
Eco-Culture on Thursday 20 May between 6pm - 6.30pm. Sorry for the tight timing. Those who wants to collect at my place are welcome to do so after 8pm (PM me for the address). If you want me to leave your eggs with Eco (due to the timing) do let me know also.

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## timebomb

> *Ronnie Lee* 
> Shipping : $26.00


Zul, 

Am I missing something here but why is it Ronnie is not getting any eggs but he still has to pay for shipping?

I'll meet you at Eco at 6 pm. I don't know what we should do with the extra eggs but I'll go through the list of people who ordered eggs the last time and see if I can find a way to distribute them fairly. 

Loh K L

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## zmzfam

> Am I missing something here but why is it Ronnie is not getting any eggs but he still has to pay for shipping?


Because he's a great fella?  :Laughing:  

Hmm...maybe should not have put Ronnie's shipping share on-line. 
Actually, Ronnie won some aquabid auctions so he decided to pay the eggs cost together to David, to ease my burden,  :Very Happy:  because the total was around USD400

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## timebomb

> because the total was around USD400


Wow!!  :Shocked:  

That's a lot of money to pay for eggs. I hope you guys know what you are doing. Anyway, for the extra eggs, if there's no objection, I'm in favour of giving them to Ronnie whose record of hatching eggs is better than anyone's I know. 

Loh K L

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## RonWill

> ...but why is it Ronnie is not getting any eggs but he still has to pay for shipping?


My my, what sharp eyes you have Kwek Leong :wink:

Nothing is amissed, my friend (you didn't think I'd back out from egg-shopping... or did you?  :Rolling Eyes:  ).

For the 5 species ordered via this exercise, plus another 2 species from my won auctions at Aquabid, I've already paid US$169 directly to David via PayPal. I don't intend to place financial burden/stress to the organising person.

For those extra eggs, yes, priority should go to the previous participants first. Any of them who're still in 'lurk mode' should be allowed to voice their options. But if they feel it's inconvenient to care for fry, we'll consider other alternatives. IMHO, that should be fair enough.

As usual, when these issues are handled transparently, none of us are in questionable status.

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## turaco

Zul,

Thank you for co-ordinating this order. I'll be held up by a function & can't show myself at eco. Can you pm me your address & hp no.? I'll go to your place later in the evening. As for the extra eggs, may I suggest we draw lot? BTW, what species are they?

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## A.Rashid

Zul,

You should know my position, so the free eggs of my share can be given to those who are more interested but if there are no takers may be you or Ronnie can "keep" them for me and will collect them when my setup is ready.


Rashid

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## RonWill

Gan, from what Zul and I are aware, there're *possibly* 6 bags of eggs for the 9 participants of the 1st mass order.

I'm passing on these eggs and let the rest choose, to share and try again. Please wait for details from David and we'll decide from there.

Rashid, when will the home reno be completed and the tanks ready to receive the little buggers? As soon as we know what's coming, you can make your choice.

I don't mind babysitting the little buggers but please don't wait until they're adults, before you come and collect, ya?

David, I can see the shipment enroute at San Francisco now but could you update us on the species of the extra eggs?

Can someone contact Kah Kheng and Eric Yeo, to inform them and for us to know their decision?

In the event there's more than one taker for the same species, I suppose you guys can either share or draw for it... and before I forget, those who're receiving the 'free eggs' will have to chip in for shipping... fair?

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## A.Rashid

> Rashid, when will the home reno be completed and the tanks ready to receive the little buggers? As soon as we know what's coming, you can make your choice.
> 
> I don't mind babysitting the little buggers but please don't wait until they're adults, before you come and collect, ya?


Ronnie,

the renovation will finish on the 3rd week of June, then I will be busy with the setup and hopefully if everything goes as plan tank setup will be ready by mid July. By then I'm ready..... :P

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## zmzfam

> David, .... but could you update us on the species of the extra eggs?


*Reply from David :*
"_GAR lafia, Riv. xiphidius crique boulanger, AUS BSWG 97-24, not sure of
others some Aphyosemions?_"

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## Eric Yeo

Ronnie, I don't mind to have one bag of eggs from any species, I lost all my killies (2 species) from the 1st mass order. If OK, Au will collect on my behalf, I'm now resting, trying to recover from my surgery.
And also I want to thank David for his kind support.

Eric Yeo

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## RonWill

> *Reply from David :*
> "_GAR lafia, Riv. xiphidius crique boulanger, AUS BSWG 97-24, not sure of others some Aphyosemions?_"


hmm... that doesn't say alot...  :Laughing:  

Eric, sorry to hear about your killies but I think it's more important to rest. We'll catch up on killie-stuffs when you're better.

5 members have expressed interest ie. Gan, Rashid, Eric, Rong Sheng and Lily, the last 2 via SMS.
 
Tell ya what... since Zul works near where I live, I'll meet up with Zul when the parcel arrives and collect my share, the extras and also eggs for those who can't make it to Eco.

Via SMS, I'll be accepting Rong Sheng's order on his behalf.

Au, you've yet to pick up the N'sukkas from me. Do you want me to receive the notho eggs on your behalf? I can also pass you Eric's share as well.

Anybody else? Please let me know. Collection from my place this Saturday, anytime after 4pm. Suggestions?

Kwek Leong, if there's any prior arrangement with Eco, please advise. I'll collect from there if too much confusion arises.

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## R^13^S

Ronnie, I will try to be at your place this Saturday after work, which will be around 6pm. I will confirm with you again this Saturday, hope you dont mind. Thanks for your help in collecting the eggs on my behalf.

Regarding about the free 6 bags of eggs, I will not mind what species I will be getting. It's something like a bonus which is entitled to us. I delighted that Im entitled to the free bags of eggs, so I will happily accept what is offered to me. But if there are more interested parties, maybe we can split the bags of eggs up so that all of us will be able to get some of the eggs? Thanks David for your generosity on the free bags of eggs.

Eric, please do take care and get well soon.
 :Smile:

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## CM Media

> Au, you've yet to pick up the N'sukkas from me. Do you want me to receive the notho eggs on your behalf? I can also pass you Eric's share as well.
> 
> Anybody else? Please let me know. Collection from my place this Saturday, anytime after 4pm. Suggestions?


Hi Ronnie,

I've to pickup for Poh San and Eric as well. So I think I'll meet Zul at Eco at 6pm. As for the N'sukkas I don't think the fish will mind staying at your place a few more days...or errrr.... weeks maybe?  :Opps:  

Let me know if you change your mind to collect at Eco by tonight. I suppose to pass you some plants.

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## zmzfam

> Kwek Leong, if there's any prior arrangement with Eco, please advise. I'll collect from there if too much confusion arises.


I have not made any arrangements with Eco yet and I believe neither has Kwek Leong.

*Current arangements for collections of eggs :*
Ronnie - I'll pass to him at his place
RongSheng - pass to Ronnie
Gan - collect at my place
Au - collect at Eco
Kwek Leong - collect at Eco
Poh San - pass to Au
Jianyang - pass to Ronnie?? (I believe he's still in camp?)

*Candidates for the extra bags of eggs :*
Gan, Rashid, Eric, Rong Sheng and Lily

NOTE*: We do not know how many eggs are in the bags and I don't think David can recall also.

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## PohSan

Hi All,
I will try my best to be present at Eco. If I can't make it, I will call Au at 6pm to collect the egg on my behalf. Thanks

Regards,
Ong Poh San

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## CM Media

> Hi All,
> I will try my best to be present at Eco. If I can't make it, I will call Au at 6pm to collect the egg on my behalf. Thanks


Poh San,

Ronnie will be bring the Java moss for you..... :wink: 

If you can't make it, I'll collect all on your behalf. :wink:

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## stormhawk

Sorry, was tied up with some family matters. Anyway, Zul, please pass my bag of ZNT eggs to Ronnie. I'll pick it up from his place this Saturday. I'll be making the payment to you via bank transfer tomorrow. Can't make it to Eco tomorrow as I'm currently at Mandai Hill Camp. I'll only be booking out by 5.45pm earliest. 

Its okay about the alternatus, I'll get it some other time.. and maybe I'll just give the non-annuals a try. :wink:

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## RonWill

Guys,
Although I might be receiving my egg order earlier than most, I'll still be dropping by at Eco. Will see you all this evening.

Rong Sheng and Jian Yang,
I just realized that this Saturday is not a good time... it's my dad's birthday and we're bringing the folks out for dinner.

Sorry guys, no hanging out till the wee hours! :wink: 

Looks like my tank revamp will have to wait too. Is Sunday ok, say... before 3pm?

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## zmzfam

Guys and gals

I have received the package at 1030 hrs SGP time  :Very Happy:  .

The *extra eggs* if I read them properly will be :
_Aphyosemion australe_ BWSG 97 / 24 'Port Gentil' :wink: 
_Aphyosemion primigenium_ GBN 88-10

_Rivulus derhami_ 'Tingo Maria'
_Rivulus xiphidius_ 'Crique Boulanger'

_Paraphyosemion gardneri_ 'Lafia'

As mentioned by David, some of the eggs have already hatched while enroute to SG - in breather bags - so get ready. For the extra eggs, only the AUS BWSG 07 / 24 is in peat, the rest have hatched in breather bags.

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## zmzfam

Dear All,

For those who have ordered the eggs, any updating of the progress of the eggs, please do it in this thread.

All the best in raising your frys.

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